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UK Referendum 23 June 2016 - Will it be an EU BREXIT or Not?

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posted on Jun, 26 2016 @ 06:11 PM
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originally posted by: Freeborn
a reply to: UKTruth

Most of that could never happen.

Most of us see the benefits of a Free Trade Association, that would mean no tariffs etc.
If Scotland was part of the EU we could not impose tariffs on Scottish goods and not on other EU produced goods.

Would you want to deport Scots who live here?
I certainly wouldn't - most love it here and have made their lives here working and paying taxes and contributing to society.
Why would we want them to go?

If an independent Scotland remained in the EU then you can bet every single penny you've ever had and ever will that one of the many conditions would be the use of the Euro as its currency.

And I'm a firm supporter of devolved power to ALL the regions of the UK - that is one of the most significant ways the UK is moving away from the EU.
The UK is heading towards increased devolved power - the EU is moving towards less and less power being with the elected assemblies of its constituent nations and more and more power being given to the EU Commission and Parliament.

That's why it baffles me why someone who supports national independence can also support membership of the EU that is actively seeking to suppress nationhood.



I know - but it was fun writing it




posted on Jun, 26 2016 @ 06:18 PM
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Why you all talking about Scotland?

Thought you didn't want to hear about Scotland.

Thought you were all sick of hearing about Scotland.




posted on Jun, 26 2016 @ 06:19 PM
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a reply to: UKTruth

That's just a scorched earth policy. It's bitter & twisted.
I can't recall any Scot on here (or elsewhere) advocating such an outcome for England, in the event of Scottish independence, no Scot is calling on the EU to punish England in such a way for voting to leave, for example. Sure, many Scots have a certain distaste for the Home Counties types, many English do too ! But they also have enormous affinity with the North of England, with the West Country, the Midlands ... anywhere apart from the metropolitan south east.

Where on earth do your views come from ? What hurt have you ever been caused that's resulted in so bizarre an outlook on life that you'd punish people simply for trying to determine their own future ? Have you ever considered that it's such views which contribute to the break up of the UK, pushing people away ? Do you not have any goodness in your heart to simply wish the Scots the best, wherever history might take them ?



posted on Jun, 26 2016 @ 06:23 PM
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Why all the focus on Sturgeon and what SHE wants?

Scotland's overall status is clear and has been from the start of the Referendum;

In 2014 Scotland voted to remain part of the United Kingdom. Another referendum on the issue was determined to be out of the question for a generation at least, if memory serves.
When Cameron announced a Referendum on U.K. membership of the E.U., Holyrood, (SCOTLAND) stayed quiet- no objections to it taking place.
At the start of campaigning HOLYROOD did not stipulate that a Leave vote would be rejected by (SCOTLAND)
During the campaign, no such statement emerged.

NOW Sturgeon pipes up and throws her dummy! The P.M. made it abundantly clear in his speech that the people, meaning the U.K. collectively have spoken...and their wishes respected and followed. Why start with the emphasizing of how particular Provences/ Regions/ Cities have voted. Interesting for dissional analysis- true; but this was a, U.K., COLLECTIVE vote and as such this should remain the focus. Democracy IS just that; we all get a vote, the votes are counted and whichever side wins gets the prize- and the loser acknowledging that they may not like it but the decision has been resolved. Any true believer in real, genuine, TRUE DEMOCRACY should view and adhere to this principle. If not don't advocate/ take part in DEMOCRACY/ DEMOCRATIC PROCESS.

Does this really need pointing out to an ELECTED Offical; a Minister; a FIRST Minister?



posted on Jun, 26 2016 @ 06:24 PM
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originally posted by: Freeborn
The thing is;
The world doesn't revolve around Scotland.
The EU doesn't revolve around Scotland.
And the UK sure as hell doesn't revolve around Scotland.

If Scotland wants to go it alone and get swallowed up and become some forgotten, insignificant hinterland in the EU then that's fine, but don't think for one minute it'll be on your terms.

Sturgeon wants Scotland to have its own independence, remain in the EU, keep Sterling and The Queen and have open borders with rUK.
Basically she wants the best of everything - that will never, ever happen and anyone who believes such nonsense is as much a crank as she is.






England will have to resurrect Hadrians wall!!



posted on Jun, 27 2016 @ 02:42 AM
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originally posted by: TheShippingForecast
a reply to: UKTruth

That's just a scorched earth policy. It's bitter & twisted.
I can't recall any Scot on here (or elsewhere) advocating such an outcome for England, in the event of Scottish independence, no Scot is calling on the EU to punish England in such a way for voting to leave, for example. Sure, many Scots have a certain distaste for the Home Counties types, many English do too ! But they also have enormous affinity with the North of England, with the West Country, the Midlands ... anywhere apart from the metropolitan south east.

Where on earth do your views come from ? What hurt have you ever been caused that's resulted in so bizarre an outlook on life that you'd punish people simply for trying to determine their own future ? Have you ever considered that it's such views which contribute to the break up of the UK, pushing people away ? Do you not have any goodness in your heart to simply wish the Scots the best, wherever history might take them ?


I left out that England should invade Scotland and take all their resources.



posted on Jun, 27 2016 @ 03:19 AM
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a reply to: UKTruth

Well unlike iraq they will have WMD's



posted on Jun, 27 2016 @ 04:02 AM
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The EU don't want Scotland without rest of UK so NS's plan has back fired has it not!



posted on Jun, 27 2016 @ 07:07 AM
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Sooo....is this "Remain by the back door?": An Exit vote never acted on? Why the Referendum then Dave (ala the voice of Hal 9000) et all?

Will article 50ever be triggered?

From MSN UK today.

The article ponders the question using such rhetoric as:
weighing up Cameron's, during the Referendum statement, "Article 50 will be triggered immediately" vs the resignation speech's "....for a new P.M. to lead us into the exit".

The article also speaks of the successor as being in no rush to make the decision that will be "seen to be knowingly condemning the UK to recession, breakup and years of pain."

Eh? Here we go AGAIN with the break-up talk- (Constitutionally/ legally baseless, given events were MUTUALLY entered into, in my opinion). Also, what recession and pain? All those companies who said they'd leave following an Exit vote have not. Contingency plans, already agreed upon!, for the currency/ interest rates (Bank of England), have been implemented. The Economy is still as it ever was. ALL remains the same.

Somehow, I fear, the Government & Remain just MAY achieve their desired back-pedal...if we wait much longer to at least declare our intentions at an official level to go.



posted on Jun, 27 2016 @ 02:55 PM
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a reply to: Seeker7

Completely wrong dude.

SNP were elected overwhelmingly at the last general election and in the manifesto it specifically makes it clear that in event of Leave vote in EU referendum it would trigger another indyref



posted on Jun, 27 2016 @ 02:56 PM
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originally posted by: RP2SticksOfDynamite
The EU don't want Scotland without rest of UK so NS's plan has back fired has it not!


Have you got a reference for that because I haven't heard it from anywhere else ?



posted on Jun, 27 2016 @ 03:52 PM
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Oh I so wanted to mention Iceland but now's not a good time




posted on Jun, 27 2016 @ 04:04 PM
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embarrassing. Stop blaming the pressure. Every team has pressure we just can't handle it.



posted on Jun, 27 2016 @ 04:40 PM
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originally posted by: bigyin
Why you all talking about Scotland?

Thought you didn't want to hear about Scotland.

Thought you were all sick of hearing about Scotland.



Scotland is the one try to bypass the democratic process with your ugly little first minister useing every trick to block a EU exit.



posted on Jun, 27 2016 @ 05:02 PM
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originally posted by: bigyin

originally posted by: RP2SticksOfDynamite
The EU don't want Scotland without rest of UK so NS's plan has back fired has it not!


Have you got a reference for that because I haven't heard it from anywhere else ?
It was something I heard on the news. Someone in the EU said that the EU wouldn't want Scotland without the rest of the UK. APols for not putting up a source.



posted on Jun, 27 2016 @ 05:17 PM
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Seems like the media are certainly pushing the idea of staying in the EU / second referendum.



posted on Jun, 27 2016 @ 11:41 PM
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originally posted by: 83Liberty
Seems like the media are certainly pushing the idea of staying in the EU / second referendum.
Let them do what they like. It is all futile!



posted on Jun, 28 2016 @ 12:07 AM
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a reply to: crazyewok

Not sure why unionists invariably resort to name calling and personal attacks. It's pathetic really.



posted on Jun, 28 2016 @ 04:19 AM
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a reply to: bigyin

Thanks for the info. Did a bit of reading and found this.

From The Guardian Mon 20/04/15:
"EU referendum – proposal that there should be a double majority requirement, whereby each of the four constituent nations of the UK would have to vote for withdrawal before the UK as a whole could leave the EU".
SNP MANIFESTO 2015 - KEY POINTS

Sooo, O.K. But I'd point out to her that it's not quite the same as stating "If the U.K. goes from Europe, and we vote stay, I'll seek to separate us from Britain"- but THAT would be an obvious implication, reading between the lines. Politicians- who'd have 'em?

Still; do not recall her reiterating/ mentioning this stance openly to the U.K. during the Referendum. if not- sneaky!! An affirmation of U.K. breakup MAY of steered the vote in a particular way? Not me. I agree and support Scotland's right to independence as a sovereign nation. I believe it should only happen if YE want it. I would hope, in that case, for a strong unified relationship with your southern neighbours though, for the island's security/ trade etc.- an approach akin to the Irish Republic's (before the Lisbon farce!).

HOWEVER.....
The Referendum WAS fought on a U.K- E.U. in/ out basis. The result being used as a basis for U.K. breakup I find unpalatable. They're two separate issues to me, so for fairness sake, they should be kept separate. There may be people within the Provinces that don't want to be E.U. but do want to remain British. They should have their say- by separate Referendum.

Just my opinion.

Cheers.



posted on Jun, 28 2016 @ 04:22 AM
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So...yesterday David categorically ruled out a second Referendum. He and HIS Cabinet are in full agreement.
BUT!....

Possible way for them to reverse the Exit decision? This and still save credibility with the Electorate?

⦁ Cameron continues steering the Exit course
⦁ New P.M. negotiates Exit deal that both sides will be happy with
⦁ Under the extraordinary circumstance of the Referendum result the 2020/19 General Election is brought forward.
⦁ Campaigning sides advocate a new Referendum based on the outcome of E.U. negotiations
⦁ All hint at possible reunification with E.U. whilst holding onto the newly negotiated position- Exit is happy, they got their reforms; Remain are happy because new probable deals could present themselves. A theoretical win-win situation
⦁ No one sees the ploy; over the following years a slowly chipping and reshaping of said positions back to a way that is more palatable to E.U.

An offer of a Second Referendum, tabled by a party at the next Election. Perfectly legal and a behind-closed-doors offer to the E.U. to quell anti-British sentiment.

Maybe?




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