Sun is a star ???

a reply to: Raggedyman

This is nothing to do with superiority what so ever.

This is about fundamental information, crucial to being able to understand the underpinnings of everything, from the way energy is distributed through systems, to the way our universe is shaped by events that occur within it.

A lack of this basic understanding of the sciences, can lead people to do things that they might not otherwise do, if they had the barest minimum of information on the topic, locked within their minds. For example, a rudimentary understanding of Newtons work with physical principles, can explain to a young person why they should not dive into a river, off a bridge, unless they know the depth of the water is great enough to absorb their impact speed, and prevent their skulls being dashed asunder on the riverbed, or their necks snapped by impact with it.

A proper grasp of the basic idea of microbiology explains to a person why they must wash their hands before, and after eating, and keep themselves clean of things like saliva, faeces, urine, and avoid contact with various fungi and spore launching things of that nature.

A simpletons view of electrical engineering prevents people making poor choices as to how to provide enough sockets for all their appliances in the home, which prevents fires, failures, and explosions in these systems and appliances. This is simple, basic stuff, which is fundamentally important when one is trying to understand the way things ought to be done. It is not just a matter of having information and sitting there geeking off about it. This is life and death, the difference between safety and danger.

From understanding how to dress for the cold, to being able to provide basic first aid, science and a solid base understanding of it, is crucial. Science is the compass that steers people away from the Darwin awards nominations list, so those who fail to grasp even the simplest of its concepts, are putting themselves at risk by refusing to engage with its lessons.

I was stopped at a railway crossing the other day with a cousin of mine in the car. He asked me why the steam was not coming out of the engine?
I enlightened him on the invention of diesel fuel.
I've had conversations with walls that are more informed than him.

a reply to: Raggedyman

Shooting the messenger doesn't make those he runs into less stupid.

Blaming the internet is also an oxymoron since ALL kinds of intelligent information is provided for free with a simple google search. If you can spend four hours playing Candy-Crush you had time to google some geology, mathematics, etymology, history, ect...

I will claim my idiot of the evening prize by revealing once at a astromomy club event I asked a nice volunteer "hey! what's that constellation, you know? the flying W thingy?"

Facepalm....I could have googled Cassiopeia myself. Instead I got to watch his face contort into a Wallace & Gromit parody while he tried not to choke. It would have been a kindness if he had reminded me of the hundreds of websites instead of just referring me to his buddy. Sadly I already knew about Earth & Sky and Jack Horkheimer, but brain-farted cause the guys all had fancy telescopes.

a reply to: Raggedyman

Your response to me was removed before I had a chance to read it.

However, I have this to say. My post makes clear the importance of knowing a certain amount about science, even in every day life, that it is necessary in order to avoid unnecessary harm coming to oneself and ones family, that it can have benefits beyond the possession of knowledge. I do not expect everyone to be an authority on mycology, nor that every person pass a complicated course in high level electrical engineering.

What I am saying however, is born out by the number of people whose houses burn down or explode because they have failed to properly secure their appliances, or those who die because they failed to understand the importance of carbon monoxide monitoring gear. It is given testimony by the number of people who died because they took too long a dive, into water too shallow to catch their momentum before they bottomed out, or took a turn too fast in their cars, on their motorbikes, and so on.

Science does for the body, what only God can do for the spirit. It keeps us alive when the odds are against us, it allows us to think our way out of situations which our brawn alone is unequal to solve. We would be lost without it, starvation, sickness, disaster after avoidable disaster, death after easily avoided death, misery upon pointless and avoidable misery, all the time, in every place. I am not saying that we can cheat death, defy God with science, but what I am saying is that we can make sure that we only pass out of this world when circumstances beyond reasonable solution, present themselves, and that is not hubris, nor arrogance. It is good sense, and makes the best possible use of the resources gifted us by the boon of our creation and placement upon this world, in this flesh.

I fail to understand any instinct you might have, to speak against these points, as I have made them, because they are without doubt the most fundamentally important reasons to grasp firmly the compass of science, that we can better navigate the world we are on and the challenges it presents to our physical bodies. If you have a counter argument which relies on fact, rather than zealotry, I would dearly love to hear it, but being a man of faith myself, I doubt that there is one.

This is the advantage I have been given by an appreciation for science, and my faith in the Almighty, some level of certainty, in a very uncertain world.

a reply to: TrueBrit

Let me condense

Running people down doesn't build them up to a position of wanting to learn
It makes them hate learning

Also the op confessed he was educated by Star Trek

That enough

a reply to: TrueBrit

Let me condense

Running people down doesn't build them up to a position of wanting to learn
It makes them hate learning

Also the op confessed he was educated by Star Trek

That enough

a reply to: Raggedyman

No one is being run down here.

No one is suggesting that while explaining the deeper mysteries of the known universe to individuals who lack the information, we should be laughing at them, making negative statements about their parentage, or anything of the sort. Pointing out an inadequacy is not the same as making fun, especially if one is willing to help fill the gaps in a persons knowledge, using ones own, and directing them to sources where they might find better, and more solid information than one might possess on a specific point.

And for your information, most of the western Astronauts working today, would also say that they were inspired by science fiction, as much as science fact, when they made the choice to aim toward a career in space exploration. Arthur C. Clarke, Gene Roddenberry, Asimov, these men were, in their own ways, Godfathers of the modern age, people who bought exotic concepts into the minds of regular people, and expanded their understanding of what is, and might become, possible. There is NOTHING wrong with that in the least!

originally posted by: MarioOnTheFly
p.s. Special thanks to Seven of Nine for making the universe that much tighter.

You're talking about your pants huh?

But yeah it is amazing how naive or ignorant people can be...I say that instead of stupid because we all live in a bubble of some sort and science isn't infallible or can explain everything.

Imagine if we live in a holographic universe or you are just a brain in a vat...then actually the significance of that sun being star is rather irrelevant...

I think I've been fortunate. The dumbest science-related thing I've ever heard was in elementary school, and it was initially kids arguing over whether or not the sky was blue as a result of light scattering, or a reflection of the oceans. And in the case of the latter, why couldn't we see whales & stuff. One of the teachers stepped in & backed the reflection-insistant kid. < facepalm >
So far, I haven't (outside of ATS) really come across anything as profoundly ignorant as other posters' encounters.

originally posted by: BelowLowAnnouncement
At the end of last year I was watching a meteor shower, one girl I was with said, "How do the stars not crash into each other?". I said nothing, didn't have the willpower.

How the hell do people like this so much as brush their teeth without somehow drowning themselves?

a reply to: and14263

In primary school I was taught that gravity is a result of the Earth spinning and 'sucking' us down onto it.

I think we went to the same school. But no body sent me the correction memo. Thanks for the update.

a reply to: MarioOnTheFly

Long live the Education Industrial Complex?

originally posted by: TrueBrit


And for your information, most of the western Astronauts working today, would also say that they were inspired by science fiction, as much as science fact, when they made the choice to aim toward a career in space exploration. Arthur C. Clarke, Gene Roddenberry, Asimov, these men were, in their own ways, Godfathers of the modern age, people who bought exotic concepts into the minds of regular people, and expanded their understanding of what is, and might become, possible. There is NOTHING wrong with that in the least!

Like Hubbard and his dyanetics, thank sci fi for that, spaceships hiding behind comets and all the othe crazy stuff like that

Educated by pop culture, what a world.
I can't wait till some pop princess talks about twinkling stars in some guys eyes and, well, pop culture wins again

I was educated by mr squiggle, he came from the moon, draw your own conclusion

a reply to: Raggedyman

Science fiction opened up the entire realm of scientific thinking, to a greater audience than it had ever reached before. The works of Jules Verne, H.G. Wells, and a great host of authors adding to a groundswell of spreading awareness, concepts alien to most, becoming talking points around ever more dinner tables, and not just in the soceity houses, upper class dinner parties and the like, but round dinner tables in every strata of western society.

Yes, these fictions were just that, but if you intend to flatly deny that these works did not fire the imaginations of those who are currently working in related fields, then frankly, you have not been paying the requisite attention to the culture we are living in. I am using a computer which is less than a foot wide, a bit less than that tall, and less than half an inch thick. It can be held in the hand, and has a flat screen. Before Star Trek: The Next Generation, next to no one had even considered the possibility. Now these things are in the hands of a huge host of people. I think you need to take another look at science fiction, from the first amusing forays by the early pioneers in that genre, to today's authors and movie makers.

Without the fiction, some of today's fact might never have happened. That is just how it is.

a reply to: abeverage

Imagine if we live in a holographic universe or you are just a brain in a vat...then actually the significance of that sun being star is rather irrelevant...

Indeed...but reality within a reality is still a reality on a certain level. One that we occupy. It makes sense to observe it carefully and try to understand it...even if it is just a program. Our lives depend on it...

originally posted by: Esoterotica
a reply to: MarioOnTheFly

Long live the Education Industrial Complex?

hah...yes...long live and die peacefully

a reply to: TrueBrit

Yes, these fictions were just that, but if you intend to flatly deny that these works did not fire the imaginations of those who are currently working in related fields, then frankly, you have not been paying the requisite attention to the culture we are living in.

In my view...SF is crucial to our human endevour...it adds to science what it fundamentally lacks...imagination. And it inspires interest among ordinary people. It's a seed that can grow...

a reply to: MarioOnTheFly

Mac Gyver is on, you might miss something educational