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Gravity wave announcement live now.

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posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 04:13 PM
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Interesting stuff. I wonder if they could eventually use data from this kind of thing to help calculate a "relativistic correction factor" for the astronomical standard of a light-year? (Right now there's no standard gravitational field in regards to the locality of that measurement. So that particular "yard-stick" is likely a bit elastic.) They'll need more gravity wave measurements though in order to get the data points needed to try something like that. But the fact they got a measurement is pretty cool.




posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 04:43 PM
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a reply to: imitator

not just that, they haven't been able to reproduce it so it could be anything they measured, seismic activity or even passing vehicles.
Even if they say detection was made in 2 different stations there still are multiple anomalies that could count for these waves as you mentioned.

It's just to keep the money flowing and keeping jobs.
Between 2002 and 2010 LIGO didn't detect any gravitational waves and now after 5 years of upgrades (and millions of dollars later) suddenly they make the announcement of the discovery of gravitational waves. On top of that coinciding 100 years after Einstein's prediction. Coincidence?

After the upgrade ( more sensitive detectors, etc) LIGO's range improved from 65 million light-years to 225 million light years,
though the wave of 2 colliding black holes was measured 1.3 billion light years away. That's far out of range if you ask me.

Note also that the detection was made only a week after the restart of LIGO (2 months of calibrating) surprisingly fast no?
Back then Lawrence Krauss, who made the announcement in September, only gave it a likelihood of 10-15% being gravitational waves.
5 months of error checking or 5 months of preparing on how to fool mankind?

Correction
LIGO, officially began taking data on 18 September. The signal from the collision occurred on 14 September, so it was still in it's engineering, calibrating stage.


edit on 12-2-2016 by intergalactic fire because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 05:32 PM
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originally posted by: pauljs75
They'll need more gravity wave measurements though in order to get the data points needed to try something like that. But the fact they got a measurement is pretty cool.


They could just fake it if needed, called "blind-injections" well they call them exercises


the exercises can be valuable for rehearsing the analysis techniques that will be needed when a real event occurs. But the practice can also be a drain on the team’s energies. “Analysing one of these events can be enormously time consuming,” he says. “At some point, it damages their home life.”



The original blind-injection exercises took 18 months and 6 months respectively. The first one was discarded, but in the second case, the collaboration wrote a paper and held a vote to decide whether they would make an announcement. Only then did the blind-injection team ‘open the envelope’ and reveal that the events had been staged.


Maybe this was also the case now? who knows? only 3 people in the world would know.


A team of three collaboration members has the ability to simulate a detection by using actuators to move the mirrors. “Only they know if, and when, a certain type of signal has been injected




edit on 12-2-2016 by intergalactic fire because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 06:33 PM
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a reply to: intergalactic fire

These injections have been performed through LIGO's operation, many many times, why bother faking one when you have already done many others?

It is a good exercise actually in de-sensitisation, get people used to seeing weird things in their data, and so when one of them is real, they are not gunning for the result, they are looking at it from the position of "Its probably not real"

What is it with the money and job security comments? Its pretty funny.

Why? Well ok lets look at the reality.
1) Cost of building it -
Hardware - Most of the hardware was bought from high tech-industry, thus taking the grants and injecting it into the economy, NOT into any single scientist.

Salary - Yes people need money to live, of the nearly 1000 people who do research in LIGO, 95% of them are students and post-docs, these people are not that well paid. In the UK the salary is NOT indicative of a high skilled job, even in the US it isn't all that well paid. Scientists are probably the least likely people to be able to afford nice cars, big houses, hell, most scientists even don't start families because they cant afford children

Security - The average PhD in the US is between 4 and 6 years depending on a few factors, most PhD students don't get handsome salaries, we are talking 12-15K a year, the rest has to be topped up through teaching... oh yeah and tuition isn't always covered by that amount either. Average work placement expectancy for a Post-doc is... 3-5 years in the US, before they are told to move on... if you are a post-doc older than 35, depending on the field of physics you are in, in the US often you are considered 'not good enough' if you haven't landed a faculty. So, out you go. Oh yeah and 80% of post-docs WONT become faculty no matter how good they are.

Sooooo yeah? Its not fantastic, its not like these people take home an easy salary and blow it all on opulence, they don't they work ridiculously long hours, in high stress conditions with a very very high probability of failure at the end of it... source? Yeah Im a physicist I know first hand.... soooo wanna get some reality into that brain?



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 08:38 PM
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originally posted by: ErosA433
a reply to: intergalactic fire

These injections have been performed through LIGO's operation, many many times, why bother faking one when you have already done many others?

It is a good exercise actually in de-sensitisation, get people used to seeing weird things in their data, and so when one of them is real, they are not gunning for the result, they are looking at it from the position of "Its probably not real"

What is it with the money and job security comments? Its pretty funny.

Why? Well ok lets look at the reality.
1) Cost of building it -
Hardware - Most of the hardware was bought from high tech-industry, thus taking the grants and injecting it into the economy, NOT into any single scientist.

Salary - Yes people need money to live, of the nearly 1000 people who do research in LIGO, 95% of them are students and post-docs, these people are not that well paid. In the UK the salary is NOT indicative of a high skilled job, even in the US it isn't all that well paid. Scientists are probably the least likely people to be able to afford nice cars, big houses, hell, most scientists even don't start families because they cant afford children

Security - The average PhD in the US is between 4 and 6 years depending on a few factors, most PhD students don't get handsome salaries, we are talking 12-15K a year, the rest has to be topped up through teaching... oh yeah and tuition isn't always covered by that amount either. Average work placement expectancy for a Post-doc is... 3-5 years in the US, before they are told to move on... if you are a post-doc older than 35, depending on the field of physics you are in, in the US often you are considered 'not good enough' if you haven't landed a faculty. So, out you go. Oh yeah and 80% of post-docs WONT become faculty no matter how good they are.

Sooooo yeah? Its not fantastic, its not like these people take home an easy salary and blow it all on opulence, they don't they work ridiculously long hours, in high stress conditions with a very very high probability of failure at the end of it... source? Yeah Im a physicist I know first hand.... soooo wanna get some reality into that brain?


And you forgot to even be considered you have to bring something to the table to get a faculty position meaning you spend lots of time doing research and publishing. All of which your paid very little for if at all.



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 08:50 PM
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a reply to: ErosA433

why is it funny?
A billion dollar project operating for 14 years without publishing any paper or finding any proof in the field isn't that funny i believe.
If you're a scientist you have to perform or publish within x amount of time or you loose your job. No wonder why may useless papers are being published.
If these injections happened many many times before and they only know the true meaning of their observation months later, after many late night intensive research, testing, re-analyzing, writing the whole paper,etc. and you still believe this has a positive effect on the crew? To me it feels more like demoralization.

I believe this announcement had to come one day or another soon, even when gravitational waves don't exist, they just couldn't come forward saying Einstein was wrong, could they?

This is like the 9/11 of science, it was an inside job!



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 08:56 PM
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a reply to: dragonridr

it doesn't matter who get's the money, it's a billion dollars of tax-payers money and with this 'discover' it will only get a lot more



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 09:01 PM
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Discovering black holes merger gravitational aftershock would imply there is a fundamental medium that propagates such a wave.
I mean space-time lattice is not rigid. Events happening over its layer exhibit classic wave description.

Does this discovery mean there is a fabric underneath of all?



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 09:12 PM
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What shape is the wave? Not sure if that makes sense, but is it like say...the rings around Saturn if the flat disk expanded outward? Or is it more like a bubble expanding out from the event in all directions?



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 09:19 PM
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a reply to: intergalactic fire

Billion Dollars spent over the course of... 14 years...

The catholic church gets tax breaks (thanks to them having a religious exemption) of something like 52billion...a YEAR... so yeah... 70million a year... pretty cheap and better for mankind than most of the 1% that get 90% of the tax breaks



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 09:21 PM
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a reply to: BarefootInWinter

If there was a wave in the first place

But that's actually an interesting question, you mean is it 2d or 3d.
According for the laws of gravity to work it's 2d but we all know 3d is the reality.



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 09:24 PM
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a reply to: ErosA433

those blood sucking sbags



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 09:28 PM
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originally posted by: BarefootInWinter
What shape is the wave? Not sure if that makes sense, but is it like say...the rings around Saturn if the flat disk expanded outward? Or is it more like a bubble expanding out from the event in all directions?


I find this question you have to be a neat thing to ponder. I don't know what I think exactly that the data will lead to just yet, IF accurate. But my feeling is it will be enormous to the future of science. Assuming it is correct and my favorite person from History is right, then this could be the beginning of science grasping ways to control the gravity waves and all this might imply. Tesla would be happy I bet if he were alive. If it is NOT correct as a couple here state, it is still fun thinking about the possibilities...... I hope Phage is spot on and Einstein was correct in his assumptions. Cause if it is so, our "future is so bright I got to wear shades".
edit on 12-2-2016 by Justoneman because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 09:31 PM
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a reply to: Astyanax

Neither the article outlined in the OP or your argument hold water. After all look at the tool that won a Nobel Prize, obama lol. Or Mandela and de klerk for that matter, a terrorist and a traitor. The Nobel Prize has no credibility after those three lol.

When you find the time (or someone pays you, like Lil 'ole me) to design/build interferometers, perform BEC research using adiabatic reactors, maybe make an accelerator, ring laser or two, let me know, I've been doing it for 40 years. Until then, your opinion is simply an opinion, nothing to get all bent out of shape over ;-)

Cheers - Dave



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 11:49 PM
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Is this the Science Forum? You could have fooled me. After reading some of the posts in this thread I would have sworn I ended up in the Embrace Repugnance Forum. It’s dripping with ignorance around here.

First of all, if you want to discuss the subject and give the impression that you actually have a clue, at least get the terms straight. ‘Gravity Waves’ and ‘Gravitational Waves’ are completely different animals. The subject of this thread is Gravitational Waves. If you even care to know the difference, READ THIS. It gives a simple explanation.

I read a lot of posts from folks who seem to hate Einstein on some personal level. It’s almost cultish in a way. The mere mention of his name will elicit a livid response from these folks. And from my observation, the funny thing is the most outspoken of these haters are the most ignorant of the bunch. Not only are they clueless about the very thing they criticise most vehemently regarding Einstein, they are also profoundly ignorant about how science works and what the scientific method and protocol demands. I’d be willing to bet that 95% (or more) of the critics here have no idea what a gravitational wave is, and 99.9% of these same geniuses haven’t the foggiest notion of what GR is about or what the field equations express. And I’ll tell you now, I’m not getting into a pointless exchange here with some self-proclaimed prodigy who’s currently working on his 3rd attempt at getting a GED.

OK, I just had to get that off my chest. I feel better now.

For anyone interested, you can read the article submitted to Physical Review Letters HERE. It includes more than 1,000 authors. One of the reasons for the lag between the detection last September and the formal announcement in February was the careful scrutiny/analysis the discovery underwent. The scientists were well aware of the importance of getting it right before announcing it to the world and risking a BICEP2 blunder.

Gotta go... The smart money's on Einstein


PS: In response to your question about the ‘fabric’ of space, I don’t think this discovery implies that any such fabric exists. I believe it addresses the nonlinear dynamics of 4D (non-Euclidean) spacetime, not space, in the presence of strong-field, high velocity environments. ‘Space’ and ‘spacetime’ are different concepts. Space, in and of itself, is only a geometric volume. It has no physical properties or energy to be warped, twisted, stretched, curved, etc. 4D spacetime, however, is non-Euclidean and can be said to have a ‘curvature’. Einstein’s GR, and the gravitational waves it predicts, is expressed mathematically in non-Euclidean geometric terms. It’s not easy to visualize, but the math works.



posted on Feb, 13 2016 @ 12:24 AM
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Gravitational Waves detected in 1969


books.google.com... #v=onepage&q=gravitational%20wave%20Popular%20Science&f=false

Global Warming.... "Gravitational Waves"..... what do they have in common ... The National Science Foundation (NSF) awards about $7 billion for research annually. $$$ = BS science.


Fraud in Science






edit on 13-2-2016 by imitator because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 13 2016 @ 01:09 AM
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a reply to: cavtrooper7

Aahhh....Mathematically it was deduced by Dr. Einstein around a hundred years ago. We now have the technology to prove him wrong or right. He was RIGHT!

Mind blown....right?



posted on Feb, 13 2016 @ 02:14 AM
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What cracked me up was this one lady scientist who said you can hear the waves listen.. and then she played the audio clip. 'woop, woop', 'see.. gravitational waves!'

Ok.. that explains everything.

I don't think one scientist had a sound explanation. One that can make you understand the significance of this discovery.



posted on Feb, 13 2016 @ 02:17 AM
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What cracks me up is that nobody understands a damn thing about it, and yet their minds are blown.



posted on Feb, 13 2016 @ 03:10 AM
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a reply to: TheSorrow

Hey! They used REAL computers and not the Hollywood kind!


Speaking of money, I believe you're right on the money with your post.

www.youtube.com...




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