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Cliven Bundy arrested by FBI in Portland

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posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 03:05 AM
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a reply to: Gryphon66

Did of them make any actual threats, though? I get the implied threat that you are pointing out, but did any of them actually make any threats? I'm not just being ignorant. This is an important question to consider...




posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 03:11 AM
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originally posted by: TheBadCabbie
a reply to: Gryphon66

Did of them make any actual threats, though? I get the implied threat that you are pointing out, but did any of them actually make any threats? I'm not just being ignorant. This is an important question to consider...


I am armed and I bring several of my armed friends with me. I come into our local clubhouse or community center and announce that I'm staying until further notice, that I'll be setting up checkpoints and deciding who can come in and out of the facility, and letting everyone know that this is no longer a community center but is instead my own personal facility to use as I wish because I don't agree with the local municipal laws (or community covenants).

I don't want to hurt anyone, but if anyone tries to stop me or make me go away, I will "defend" myself.

Am I posing an obvious threat, or not?



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 03:22 AM
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originally posted by: Gryphon66

originally posted by: TheBadCabbie
a reply to: Gryphon66

Did of them make any actual threats, though? I get the implied threat that you are pointing out, but did any of them actually make any threats? I'm not just being ignorant. This is an important question to consider...


I am armed and I bring several of my armed friends with me. I come into our local clubhouse or community center and announce that I'm staying until further notice, that I'll be setting up checkpoints and deciding who can come in and out of the facility, and letting everyone know that this is no longer a community center but is instead my own personal facility to use as I wish because I don't agree with the local municipal laws (or community covenants).

I don't want to hurt anyone, but if anyone tries to stop me or make me go away, I will "defend" myself.

Am I posing an obvious threat, or not?


That's not really an accurate comparison, and you still haven't answered the question. That's okay, though. You don't have to, though I think your inability to answer it speaks volumes. You can go overboard stating the implied threat all you like, but I still understood what you were arguing the first time.



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 03:24 AM
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a reply to: TheBadCabbie

It is an exact comparison. If not, explain the glaring differences.

I have answered your question multiple times, in plain English and obvious terms. You have not offered ONE THING in response except to say the equivalent of "nuh-huh" ...

/shrug

My statement doesn't suit your argument, so you're trying to imply that I'm not saying anything. So what?
edit on 12-2-2016 by Gryphon66 because: Noted



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 07:05 AM
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a reply to: centarix

If a cop just met you on the street and shot you for reaching into your pocket, you might have a valid point.

That was hardly the case here!

These people were known to be armed. They took over, occupied and destroyed federal property. They stole govt. vehicles and threatened to resist any attempt to impede or disrupt their protest.

When stopped, they refused to follow instructions of law enforcement and instead sped away. Then they attempted to run through or around a road block set up by law enforcement.

LaVoy is dead as a result of his own actions and not because of any orchestrated assassination on the part of law enforcement.

This has absolutely nothing to do with equal rights!

Furthermore, there is nothing peaceful or patriotic about these militia groups.

IMO, these groups are full of nut-jobs who don't know the first thing about our justice system or living in a civilized society and who think they can dictate their own version of justice by force.

I'm a lifelong gun owner/collector who cherishes my right to own guns but I know full well that it's nutty assed "patriots" like these who pull stunts like this one that will eventually lead to a loss or curtailment of those rights.

Like I said before, the best way to lose one's rights is to abuse them and as far as I'm concerned, everyone connected with this occupation should lose their right to buy and own guns for life.



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 07:40 AM
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originally posted by: TheBadCabbie

Flatfish was saying that he would shoot anyone who was moving their hand toward their pocket, as if that's just okay.


Apparently, You people can't even repeat or quote the words from someone's statement that's in print right in front of your face.

WHEN EXACTLY, did I say that I'd shoot "anyone" who was moving their hand towards their pocket?

Who in their right mind would think it's OK for anyone to shoot someone else for simply moving their hand towards their pocket?

In the context of what happened the day LaVoy was shot, coupled with the armed takeover of federal property that led up to it and the fact that he refused to follow orders of law enforcement during a stop, yes I would shoot him when he dropped his hands and reached.

That's a helluva big difference than "I would shoot anyone who reached for their pocket."

Please don't misquote me in order to support your delusional idea of fairness and/or Justice.



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 08:24 AM
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a reply to: DelMarvel

Then let me have her address your concerns about her being a "real" judge:

Directly from the Judge:


To answer that question and give you the fair full depth of it, you have to learn a lot of history and learn it right now. I am sick and tired of having people say I am not a judge and asking me in what sense I am a judge and coming up with all these silly suppositions and accusations, so I am going to answer you and then I am going to post this letter and let everyone else read it to their heart’s delight.

Please bear in mind that if you feel stupid or overwhelmed at the end, that’s normal, and we all go through that in the process of waking up. Just realize that you were intentionally defrauded and kept uninformed, so it isn’t your fault that you never knew any of this. You simply weren’t told. 

So, what kind of Judge am I?

I am their worst nightmare. I am a Judge of the actual Alaska State, one of the Several States of the Continental United States. I occupy the actual public office and operate the actual Alaska State Superior Court.

Note the difference:

Alaska State = actual State on the land, actual public office, using actual Public Law and operating under the American Common Law, which is the law of the land.

State of Alaska, STATE OF ALASKA, ALASKA = all various corporate franchises, private offices, operating under either administrative (purely private in-house corporate “laws”) or international law in the jurisdiction of the sea.


Source

I encourage everyone read her info on the source page. It is an education.



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 08:34 AM
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The "Sovereign Citizen" malarkey is not "an education," it's fantasy, fabrication and ignorance.

Let's go with the logic for a moment. If there is no legitimacy for the US Government after 1868, then Alaska is not a State and she is without (even her pretend) jurisdiction.

Further, who elected her to office? What recognized elected authority appointed her? By what legal virtue, aside from her own declaration, does she hold jurisdiction?

/shrug Not much to see here.



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 01:13 PM
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originally posted by: NewzNose
a reply to: DelMarvel
I encourage everyone read her info on the source page. It is an education.


Yeah, I already read that and posted an excerpt. To repeat just one of her claims there:


The Federal United States is British-controlled and always has been.


It's nonsense.



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 01:56 PM
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originally posted by: Gryphon66
The "Sovereign Citizen" malarkey is not "an education," it's fantasy, fabrication and ignorance.

Let's go with the logic for a moment. If there is no legitimacy for the US Government after 1868, then Alaska is not a State and she is without (even her pretend) jurisdiction.

Further, who elected her to office? What recognized elected authority appointed her? By what legal virtue, aside from her own declaration, does she hold jurisdiction?

/shrug Not much to see here.



Yes it is.

My neighbor was foreclosed on and she was a "Sovereign Citizen." She filed all the crazy paperwork that was suppose to allow her to keep her house without making any payments. She had fake diplomatic plates on her cars, because she was sovereign. The day of the foreclosure there were 6 sheriff deputies in 6 cars escort the people who emptied their house onto the street. The first thing the deputies asked was where were the guns. They just secured them while the process was unfolding.

Near the end of the process my neighbors were going to go go buy a storage locker so they could get their stuff off the street and the deputies said they would be arrested if they used those cars with the fake plates on the street.

So yes I saw first hand that the "Sovereign Citizen" is complete bulls##t.



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 02:13 PM
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originally posted by: blargo
My neighbor was foreclosed on and she was a "Sovereign Citizen."


So she takes out a mortgage and then claims she's a "sovereign citizen" and stops paying?

More of the "I have a constitutional right to free stuff" mentality.
edit on 12-2-2016 by DelMarvel because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 02:51 PM
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a reply to: DelMarvel

It happens to be true.



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 02:52 PM
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a reply to: DelMarvel

A National American, not citizen.



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 02:59 PM
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a reply to: DelMarvel

The Corp. USA went bankrupt along with 60 other countries in early 2015. Jacob Rothschild attempted to buy the US debts from bankruptcy. HE WAS BEAT TO THE PUNCH BY Judge Anna's strategic judicial moves.
The proof is everywhere. You just have to look.

Lot of interesting times for us this year.



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 03:22 PM
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originally posted by: Flatfish

originally posted by: TheBadCabbie

Flatfish was saying that he would shoot anyone who was moving their hand toward their pocket, as if that's just okay.


Apparently, You people can't even repeat or quote the words from someone's statement that's in print right in front of your face.

WHEN EXACTLY, did I say that I'd shoot "anyone" who was moving their hand towards their pocket?

Who in their right mind would think it's OK for anyone to shoot someone else for simply moving their hand towards their pocket?

In the context of what happened the day LaVoy was shot, coupled with the armed takeover of federal property that led up to it and the fact that he refused to follow orders of law enforcement during a stop, yes I would shoot him when he dropped his hands and reached.

That's a helluva big difference than "I would shoot anyone who reached for their pocket."

Please don't misquote me in order to support your delusional idea of fairness and/or Justice.


No. You're right. You were only referring to Finicum, and a hypothetical bank robber. I was mistaken in the context. I retract my earlier assessment. Guess that's what I get for not reading back before replying. Perhaps you had written it in another thread. Oh well. Apologies.
edit on 12-2-2016 by TheBadCabbie because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 03:28 PM
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originally posted by: NewzNose
a reply to: DelMarvel

The Corp. USA went bankrupt along with 60 other countries in early 2015. Jacob Rothschild attempted to buy the US debts from bankruptcy. HE WAS BEAT TO THE PUNCH BY Judge Anna's strategic judicial moves..


All right. I'll play. Do you have any documentation of this other than the word of "Judge Anna"?



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 03:39 PM
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originally posted by: NewzNose
HE WAS BEAT TO THE PUNCH BY Judge Anna's


So some nutter claims she is a judge, and you believe her!



posted on Feb, 12 2016 @ 03:56 PM
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originally posted by: NewzNose
a reply to: DelMarvel

The Corp. USA went bankrupt along with 60 other countries in early 2015. Jacob Rothschild attempted to buy the US debts from bankruptcy. HE WAS BEAT TO THE PUNCH BY Judge Anna's strategic judicial moves.
The proof is everywhere. You just have to look.

Lot of interesting times for us this year.


Okay.



posted on Feb, 15 2016 @ 08:57 AM
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a reply to: NotTooHappy

no. like what is Alleged to have happened, unfortunately in these two scenarios we have only the word of the parties who would be guilty to go by, it is his word against theirs,

luckily in america we have a standard in place to prevent that from making a difference, its called innocent until PROVEN guilty,

for you to simply assume which of the two parties is guilty is the opposite of that, it is guilty until proven innocent logic, and that logic is the very reason we rebelled against a corrupt establishment and founded america instead.

you cannot assume the reason he reached to his side based off of someones word no matter who that someone is (in this case its his killers) you instead must assume innocence until guilt is PROVEN BEYOND A REASONABLE DOUBT.

it has NOT been proven why his arm went to his side, therefor it must be assumed it was an innocent movement. THAT is the justice system we established in this country long ago to ensure our freedom.

the only piece of evidence that he was reaching for a gun and not to grasp at a wound is the gun found on his body but THAT is highly suspect considering this man owned many weapons registered to his name, there is ZERO logic in him carrying one that wasnt registered to him as was the one found on him, rather it makes more logical sense that the gun found on him came from one of the men who shot him, they are well known to carry unregistered firearms for this very reason, to be able to plant them on anyone they kill so as to get away with it, this is all well known behavior by LEO's and Feds alike and it certainly appears to be exactly what happened here.
edit on 15-2-2016 by NobodiesNormal because: (no reason given)




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