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The reason I stopped posting on ATS

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posted on Feb, 8 2016 @ 12:11 PM
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originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
There is very little incentive to write threads—do research, spend time editing, fact-checking, and participating in the subsequent debate—that one does so at a sacrifice to his own time and energy. Might as well just copy and paste something. Copy and pasting has become the norm. Very little thought have been put into them.

The reason I continue to write here is the odd thank you and words of encouragement that I get now and then, not to mention the one mod who applauses nearly every one of my threads. Besides writing for practice, I basically write for her and the one or two people who have said thank you—props to all my foes.

The ATS community needs to work harder to reward it's fellow members with gratitude, and not expect the management to do it for them. Thread writers will return if they learn their work is appreciated.


In case I never told you...

I like your Threads.

Criticism comes quick around here. Pats on the back...Not so much.




posted on Feb, 8 2016 @ 12:11 PM
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originally posted by: NihilistSanta
I felt I needed to respond because your view is the one that causes people to feel that ATS isnt "what it was".



And...um.... WTF?
My view is the reason ATS is a worse site than it used to be... OK then.
I've been around to see many changes on ATS, seen lots of great members banned and leave because threads about conspiracies regarding drugs and drugs in general were banned... then ATS decided they were OK?
That was ridiculous.

There have been lots of different "hot" issues and we've had all manner of trolls and shills sign up to try and influence the site, many racists and all kinds of a-holes.
MOST people on this site are decent, considerate and are here to learn, investigate and read informative, conspiratorial, unreported topics and have good conversation with like minded individuals, and make friends and have a sense of community.

Not "rag on the Mussies" and bash gays and generally be an ass.
ATS has always had those members and those threads but some of it it goes WAY WAY over the top and deserves to be banned.

There has always been far too much racist, sexism, homophobia, islamaphobia and general ****ishness by a small number on here and almost ALWAYS the membership reacts and stamps that crap out.

edit on 8/2/16 by blupblup because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 8 2016 @ 12:12 PM
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originally posted by: SkepticOverlord
For the sake of context, I'm going to repost something something I wrote from 2009, that is appropriate here...

Forum Fatigue

And the wheels on the bus go round and round, round and round...

ATS is not what it used to be - 2003
On ATS, Ignorance Is Winning - 2004, before he was a mod
Get rid of points system on ATS. - 2004
content going downhill??? - 2004
ATS selling out: Membership quantity over quality - 2005
"Deny Ignorance" and the ATS Conspiracy... - 2005
is ats being hached/subverted from within or ? - 2005

Some quick examples (from hundreds) of how "everyone complains about the weather, but no one ever does anything about it."

As you can see, the phenomenon you point out has been a part of our community for years. Not to diminish from some valid concerns, but I call much of this a phenomenon for a reason... I've seen it before, I'll see it again, and I fully expect never to stop seeing it.

Forum Fatigue

For the most part, I suspect what you are (mostly) experiencing is a valid phenomenon of the digital age, "forum fatigue." While you may not be aware of such a thing, and there's precious little written about it, it does exist. I've been managing online forums and groups since it was possible to do so... beginning with BBS groups in the slow dial-up days, moving to the largest CompuServe forum in the faster dial-up days, and onward to ATS. It's real. It happens every day. It will never not happen. It's human nature.

When you (or anyone) first join a new digital community, there tends to be four phases of involvement:

1) Exuberant participation due to an overwhelming amount of content on subjects that interest you.

2) Fitting into the flow as you have a solid comfort level with the community and its members.

3) Frustration as the lack of new interesting content that led to #1 begins to be hard to find.

4) Ongoing contribution to compensate for the perceived lack of interesting content.

Think about it... you come to ATS... are excited to find all this interesting content from so many different people... spend time soaking it all in... spend more time figuring out how to fit in... start to become comfortable in providing contributions... then, as you get your fill of topics, become frustrated over repeat topics... and more frustration as new users don't exemplify your own level of advanced "ATS sophistication"... and even more frustrated as your personal investment in time is subverted by what you perceive to be poor topics... brining us solidly into the third item above. The same happens on any forum/board/community of focused topics.

About 53% of members post anything... but less than 1% of those members (0.5% of all members) ever move past #3 and make an effort with #4.


Now, to be clear, I'm not attributing all of your concerns to "forum fatigue," only that it's a common phenomenon for users of our type of venue. There's always room for improvement, and we've been proactive in figuring out what needs to happen, but we also temper that with our collective experience (more than myself) in running big online communities.



==================================


And a related bit I also wrote from 2010: www.abovetopsecret.com...


If you (and others) are feeling the threads are lacking of late... why not work on some good threads, instead of thread about the lack of good threads?





Also... there's a well-documented phenomena (we have at least three or four threads on the subject somewhere in here) about forum fatigue that has something to do with what you think you're seeing. The short version is something like:

(1) When you first encountered ATS, you were floored at all the content.

(2) You joined with excitement.

(3) You devoured threads and marveled at some of the topics and replies.

(4) You jumped in, excited to be a part of it.

(5) Over time, you've come to be very familiar with the topics.

(6) Over more time, you're seeing fewer "new" topics (because you've nearly seen it all)

(7) You post less because you're not seeing as much new information as when you first joined (when it was all new)

(8) You make a thread on how there's not so many good new threads any more, rather than make a good thread.




You just summed up my entire existence here on ATS.

I thought I was special


ATS has changed over the years but then so has the internet. When I first started out on a pentium powered PC running windows 95 and a massive 16mb of ram only true crackpots would discuss alternative topics as most people did not even have an internet to voice their opinion on.

Nowadays when everyone between the age of 9 and 90 has about 5 difference devices to access the web and the advent of social media meaning more and more people are going to find their voice and that will change things.

To those older members that are bemoaning the changes we see I would say that you may by sticking to what you think is "right" be causing the problems you complain about.

There are in my opinion far too many conspiracy hipsters that have been everywhere and seen it all, their minds are already made up and all they have left is frustration towards newer possibly valuable members who turn up with their crazy notions about things(as we all did at one point) only to be shot down, bullied and mocked and then leave.

The other problem is that as ATS is such a big site is becomes a target for certain groups to promote their cause which is as I understand something ATS was never meant to be.

I may have given more than my 2p's worth here(5 cents to you yanks) but It is good to see that this is being allowed to be discussed out in the open.



posted on Feb, 8 2016 @ 12:17 PM
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a reply to: blupblup

No need to take things personally. Its your dismissal of the thread before its posted based on your own bias that I was referring to. You immediately leap to "gay bashing" when that had nothing to do with it.

People are discouraged to post anything that isn't regurgitated from the mainstream because anything that takes you outside the box gets reeled back in by people who are all too comfortable in there.

Flat earth is all BS but I find it interesting in understanding science denial and skepticism. Instead of a discussion those threads turn into "What I was told is right and what you were told is wrong" and thats about as far as it goes.


edit on 8-2-2016 by NihilistSanta because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 8 2016 @ 12:18 PM
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a reply to: whyamIhere

I appreciate that, but I've been thanked enough. We should go out of our way to thank others for contributing, especially if they are doing so with quality in mind.



posted on Feb, 8 2016 @ 12:23 PM
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a reply to: NihilistSanta


ATS used to be almost entirely "out of the box" topics until politics became the number one most posted topic.
Now it's all just partisan nonsense and there is very little conspiracy talk on here at all.
At one time is was ancient civs, cryptozoology, 9/11, UFOs and Mars/Moon pics etc.

Now you'll be lucky to get one of those topics a day... it's all politics, mainstream news stories that are on the news anyway and have no real need to be here - but hey. that's the way of the internet apparently.


I like alternative stuff, I'd imagine most of us do, it's the reason we joined.

ATS is no longer out of the box or weird or different because it wanted to be the same as the other sites, to compete, keep up, stay ahead of the curve etc.

It wants to be social media, news-feed, make its own videos.... All sorts.
edit on 8/2/16 by blupblup because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 8 2016 @ 12:26 PM
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a reply to: zazzafrazz

Squelching opinions that don't conform to a group's perspective, is simply censorship. If opinions can't be discussed no matter how extreme, a persons negative or extreme perspective can't be changed. If we can't debate about an explosive subject like race, the real core of the problem is swept under the rug. All it does is it builds resentment and makes people dig in with their beliefs.

We have more conflicts and enemies in this world because countries refuse to talk with their enemies. It creates a powder keg ready to explode. If people always walked away because their friend said something they didn't like, nobody would have any friends. Communication and understanding someone's perspective is how you build a consensus among each other.

You can have decorum without having censorship.



posted on Feb, 8 2016 @ 12:28 PM
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a reply to: WeRpeons

Amen. People with unpopular viewpoints are attacked by gangs here who drive out anyone who doesn't agree with the current paradigm.
edit on 2/8/2016 by Restricted because: -



posted on Feb, 8 2016 @ 12:29 PM
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a reply to: WeRpeons

You make an excellent point. Right now especially due to the immigration issue in Europe an alternative right is rising. We cant even discuss those topics here for the most part because they deal with race, Hitler, and other topics which have been banned. Instead of getting ahead of what is becoming controlled opposition and discussing those issues here with balance someone will just go watch The Greatest Story Never Told and take it at face value.



posted on Feb, 8 2016 @ 12:37 PM
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originally posted by: blupblup
a reply to: NihilistSanta


ATS used to be almost entirely "out of the box" topics until politics became the number one most posted topic.
Now it's all just partisan nonsense and there is very little conspiracy talk on here at all.
At one time is was ancient civs, cryptozoology, 9/11, UFOs and Mars/Moon pics etc.

Now you'll be lucky to get one of those topics a day... it's all politics, mainstream news stories that are on the news anyway and have no real need to be here - but hey. that's the way of the internet apparently.


I like alternative stuff, I'd imagine most of us do, it's the reason we joined.

ATS is no longer out of the box or weird or different because it wanted to be the same as the other sites, to compete, keep up, stay ahead of the curve etc.

It wants to be social media, news-feed, make its own videos.... All sorts.


I do agree with what you are saying but have you asked yourself how many conspiracies we still have left to talk about?

The classics, moon landings/jfk/area51/Titor/9/11 have been done to death.

The crazy ones, David Icke/flat earth/inner earth ect just get ridiculed before they even have a chance by serial debunkers.

I used to come here and only ever read skunkworks every day. I never even signed up or looked at other forums for years now it's all but a dead forum as anyone who dares to post is mashed up as soon as the gang arrive.

Everything changes and I still like ATS personally. I am more into the off topic stuff these days though as it is less intense and as you say less political.



posted on Feb, 8 2016 @ 12:43 PM
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If people post immature crap , profanity, etc its quite amazing. The site doesn't grind to a halt and descend into anarchy. Instead the adults don't feed the trolls so to speak.
a reply to: NihilistSanta

I think many can relate to this. You'll always find an immature post. So just ignore it. I understand keeping some kind of decorum, but using a few small non-offensive swear words to express yourself isn't exactly offensive (I'm not talking about the F-Bomb) I hear more offensive language on TV or when I'm out in public.

What I feel is really offensive is when posters personally attack members because they don't like their opinions. Or sometimes they insinuate something about somebody when they don't even know the person.

A quote from Bambi - If you don't have something nice to say about someone, don't say anything at all. We can all disagree, but name calling will affect the decorum of the site itself.



posted on Feb, 8 2016 @ 12:45 PM
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a reply to: NihilistSanta

Thanks, I appreciate you seeing my point.



posted on Feb, 8 2016 @ 12:48 PM
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a reply to: anxietydisorder

+ owl soup = TLC ATS

I am making unicorn goulash next

Sir don't stop posting you sound like a redicilous amount of fun

Thank you



posted on Feb, 8 2016 @ 12:49 PM
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a reply to: LesMisanthrope

I have always thought your posts were interesting and informative. I cant say I haven't learned from your mind so THANK YOU!

I dont think its more exaltation that people need to make them contribute more. I think most would post more if there was a way to minimize the level of work you have to put in just to then have to go through scrutiny afterward. The thing is not doing that would reduce the quality of the content. Cut and paste is favored by people sometimes because it kind of puts the responsibility and burden of proof onto the source. If its a good source then you can feel strong to deflect criticism. If its more on you and your homework, then the weeds begin to thin.

I think all this is growing pains. It will just now be a part of the discussion every year or so. Think about it: With this many members it would be insane to expect perfect agreement always. Even on simple things, like accepting that somethings have been a certain way always and others will change. The perception of things like the enforcement of rules or the imagined motive in direction just evolves as the group does. We notice certain details like a member going, or an ad change, or what ever. We see the world through what singular details our minds and eyes manage to pick up on. The thing is there is always more that we cant possibly see and know.

I see people look at things like ATS and impose their own ideas of why it exists. I remember a Charlie Rose episode where a guy from south America came on and was swinging his revolutionary rhetoric around while thanking Charlie Rose for fighting the establishment by having his show. It was belligerent considering the question he completely missed answering while lost in the process of finalizing his fantasy.

People assume that any positive outlet for them that is full of like minded people MUST agree with their own path and direction always. They think that BECAUSE they are supposedly linked somehow by like minded ideas that everyone is going where they are from what ever parting point of agreement a conversation is founded on. A sense of betrayal of loyalty comes into play in their minds when they see a multitude of voices not being made into more perfect reflections of their own singular ideal. They forget the complexity of grey when dealing with black and white minded people on certain ideas.

Its cool though. Its not a deal breaker. When people move on we all get wherever together.

Have good one.
Hold it down.

edit on 2 8 2016 by tadaman because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 8 2016 @ 12:49 PM
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a reply to: Restricted

I hear you. Partisan politics, gun control, religious beliefs, immigration, just to name a few



posted on Feb, 8 2016 @ 12:52 PM
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Mmmm owl soup? Mr Burns, is that you?


edit on 8-2-2016 by stargatetravels because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 8 2016 @ 01:02 PM
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a reply to: daaskapital

Actually this is to everyone. Sorry, I'm in an automatic and still looking for the clutch...

I'm only half way through this but I'm jumping in. I'm just one week on this site and I am a bit sad and confused by what I'm reading here. In fact I'm having trouble seeing through the tears swelling in my eyes. I'm also impressed by how long this thread is that didn't exist a few hours ago. It's only two days that I figured out what S&F means. Talking with initials is new but disturbing. Off subject, I remember when Toys R Us began with that backwards R. You speak of quality but this is something that seems to be rapidly deteriorating at both a global and fractal level. Don't blame ATS for that. Many of you have been here for ten years or so. That's almost a new generation. What would these younger people know of quality without example?

Sorry, I'm babbling. It's just that you folks saved my life last week. And yes, I've noticed the same people posting and wish these names were easier to remember. I go by many of the pictures. That fellow with the drinking glass, I so admire your patience and kindness towards another poster who certainly challenged my patience. I was glad to tell myself to go back to some other post, but grateful to know he was probably still there for this other person. This other person with the ghost name...your picture scares me so it has taken me longer to appreciate your posts. Now you are thinking of leaving too?

The original poster (oh, should I say OP?) doesn't like the subjects? Start a new one and see what happens. Actually, you just did and look at the responses already.

You people with so many S&F's that they have commas, please try to look at things with fresh eyes. I'm still red-light-green-lighting my way around and still don't know what a flag is or how to continue, split or erase a reply.

I just started to be brave enough to make some comments but soon noticed that my fake name, carefully chosen, often remained the last post so I stopped posting, thinking that I killed the thread or they may not want me in their sandbox. The other thing is that I figure that whatever "brought me to the dance" has probably already been rubbed into the ground already (sorry, I think I have the wrong metaphor) and I just need to find it.

Also I see something that has me wincing. One of you said that you figured out who someone was. I am overburdened with some things I know and things I've witnessed. If I just let it out I am certain I'd have some sort of accident or I'd be laughed into silence, or worse, just disappear. If it were just me, that might be okay but I have a husband who likes my cooking.

Sorry, this isn't about me, but yes it is, and it's about each of you. We are all in this together. We just haven't figured out yet what "this" is. But isn't that what brought all of us to the dance? If they aren't playing your song, then you play it. You might discover that lots of people were waiting for that type of melody.

edit on 8-2-2016 by ClownFish because: Replying in the wrong place.



posted on Feb, 8 2016 @ 01:06 PM
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a reply to: ClownFish

Great post. Welcome!



posted on Feb, 8 2016 @ 01:09 PM
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a reply to: Restricted

Whoa. Yea. Thank you.



posted on Feb, 8 2016 @ 01:18 PM
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originally posted by: ClownFish
a reply to: daaskapital

Actually this is to everyone. Sorry, I'm in an automatic and still looking for the clutch...

I'm only half way through this but I'm jumping in. I'm just one week on this site and I am a bit sad and confused by what I'm reading here. In fact I'm having trouble seeing through the tears swelling in my eyes. I'm also impressed by how long this thread is that didn't exist a few hours ago. It's only two days that I figured out what S&F means. Talking with initials is new but disturbing. Off subject, I remember when Toys R Us began with that backwards R. You speak of quality but this is something that seems to be rapidly deteriorating at both a global and fractal level. Don't blame ATS for that. Many of you have been here for ten years or so. That's almost a new generation. What would these younger people know of quality without example?

Sorry, I'm babbling. It's just that you folks saved my life last week. And yes, I've noticed the same people posting and wish these names were easier to remember. I go by many of the pictures. That fellow with the drinking glass, I so admire your patience and kindness towards another poster who certainly challenged my patience. I was glad to tell myself to go back to some other post, but grateful to know he was probably still there for this other person. This other person with the ghost name...your picture scares me so it has taken me longer to appreciate your posts. Now you are thinking of leaving too?

The original poster (oh, should I say OP?) doesn't like the subjects? Start a new one and see what happens. Actually, you just did and look at the responses already.

You people with so many S&F's that they have commas, please try to look at things with fresh eyes. I'm still red-light-green-lighting my way around and still don't know what a flag is or how to continue, split or erase a reply.

I just started to be brave enough to make some comments but soon noticed that my fake name, carefully chosen, often remained the last post so I stopped posting, thinking that I killed the thread or they may not want me in their sandbox. The other thing is that I figure that whatever "brought me to the dance" has probably already been rubbed into the ground already (sorry, I think I have the wrong metaphor) and I just need to find it.

Also I see something that has me wincing. One of you said that you figured out who someone was. I am overburdened with some things I know and things I've witnessed. If I just let it out I am certain I'd have some sort of accident or I'd be laughed into silence, or worse, just disappear. If it were just me, that might be okay but I have a husband who likes my cooking.

Sorry, this isn't about me, but yes it is, and it's about each of you. We are all in this together. We just haven't figured out yet what "this" is. But isn't that what brought all of us to the dance? If they aren't playing your song, then you play it. You might discover that lots of people were waiting for that type of melody.


Well said.

Very well said in fact, so well I would like to continue to say things here on a regualr basis.

That chap with the drinking glass has looked after pretty much anyone who is anyone here at some point and very often someone who thinks they are no one.

Your voice is as important here as someone that has been here for a decade and has a gazillion stars and flags. We all have to start somewhere and it seems you are starting well.




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