How does a chemtrailer explain this?

a reply to: visitedbythem

Jet engine parts have been made out of titanium for decades. The temperatures in the combustor require extremely high temperature alloys to protect them from damage. The most common is a nickle-titanium alloy. The problem isn't the combustor, it's the fan blades. Fan blades are quite easily damaged, due to the high speeds they rotate at among other things.

I don't see a JP6, but do see a JP7 online. I now remember the wording they used. "as specified" by the government. I think I started coming to ATS after finding the MSDS, because prior to that, I thought people like the crowd here were nutts. That they had vivid imaginations. I was certain that the government of the US 'be involved in any of the nonsense people who frequented ATS believed in. I now think our government is like a cheating wife, who cannot be trusted on all things. A wife you cant afford to leave, but don't trust just the same. One that you question and check up on constantly

a reply to: Zaphod58 I understand that. I thought I saw something about blades too. Have they been incorporating other alloys too? Do they use any titanium now? I know what I saw on the MSDS. I also saw that there were 3 levels as specified. There were other JP fuels that had none of those ingredients. Most fuels didnt have them. They mostly had Kerosene, benzine I think, and naphtha or something like that

a reply to: visitedbythem

JP-6 was never used large scale. The Navy uses JP-5, and the Air Force uses JP-8 now. JP-6 was developed for the XB-70 program, and when it was cancelled, so was the JP-6 production. I've looked at multiple MSDS sheets, as far back as 2010, and all show the same thing. Kerosene, Napthalene, and distilates.

a reply to: visitedbythem

Fan blades, combustor chambers, and the exhaust chamber have all been made out of titanium. The only things have have changed are some of the other parts of the engine. For example, they now line the casing with kevlar instead of fiberglass. Some of the alloy mixes have changed, but titanium has always been a significant component for those parts.

If something was propritory information they can withold some information. It was a legit refinery site. It cost money to make an extensive online site like that. I doubt someone hacked them either. I know what I saw, and its one of the reasons Im here. Most of what I see is contrails. but years ago I used to see something quite different. Im in the San Joaquin Valley. I would see clear skies, several jets fly over, and the contrails would not disperse. They didnt go away. Instead they fanned out and within hours it was as if the whole sky was cloudy. I would be outside and see a few jets fly over, with trails that stayed. I would step back into the plant and tell employees on a sunny day that it would soon be overcast and cloudy, and it would within hours.... In the spring and summer

originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: smurfy
The picture is of no consequence in just about any parameter, it's a waste of time.

I guess you don't know much about the chemtrail theory. The crux is that contrails can't persist. Only chemtrails can.
The ones who bring science into this (the debunkers) state that contrails are man made cirrus clouds. This is a perfect example of that theory. The contrails are only persisting around the cirrus. Explaining visually, why conditions at altitude are what drives contrail persistence, not some chemical additive.

You know very well that I have posted on the subject many, many times since 2009, and enough to know that your picture means nothing, perhaps not even truthful in essence. Anybody that says contrails, or chemtrails for that matter, cannot produce clouding is talking through their nether regions. So stop this silliness once and for all, and instead try looking for alternative reasons for why a contrail should be easily a chemtrail...more than that, what is so innocent about a 'contrail' anyway? You will have a long trail ahead yourself, much more than in your quarterly same posts here.

Absract,

"Condensation trails (contrails) are aircraft induced cirrus clouds, which may persist and
grow to large cirrus cover in ice-supersaturated air, and may cause a warming of the atmosphere.
This paper describes the formation, occurrence, properties and climatic effects of contrails. The global
cover by lined-shaped contrails and the radiative impact of line-shaped contrails is smaller than assessed
in an international assessment in 1999.
Contrails trigger contrail cirrus with far larger coverage than observed for line-shaped contrails, but still unknown radiative properties. Some model simulations indicate an impact of particles and particle precursors emitted from aircraft engines on cirrus
clouds properties. "

Polymers?

a reply to: visitedbythem

A front was moving through and the contrails were persisting. Contrails don't always disperse quickly, especially when there's a front coming.

I was one of those people. Im very Logical. It used to infuriate me. It just makes no sense that someone could run aluminum through an engine without any repercussions. Its too abrasive. In my mind, that would lead to early failure. The government is not going to tell citizens everything it is doing or why, and I still think it may have to do with something else, such as protecting the country from some type of attack, or to experiment with causing cloud cover for what ever reason

a reply to: Zaphod58 Im an older guy. Ive lived here all my life, and thats not what I saw. Im fine with you believing that, as did I for a long time.

originally posted by: visitedbythem
...Im in the San Joaquin Valley. I would see clear skies, several jets fly over, and the contrails would not disperse. They didnt go away. Instead they fanned out and within hours it was as if the whole sky was cloudy. I would be outside and see a few jets fly over, with trails that stayed. I would step back into the plant and tell employees on a sunny day that it would soon be overcast and cloudy, and it would within hours.... In the spring and summer

Persistent trail and spreading trails have always been a characteristic of contrails, if the atmospheric conditions are right for it. Those conditions can happen any time of the year -- even in the spring and summer (the temperatures at altitude are consistently cold during any month of the year). Furthermore, the effects of the jet age and the increase in persistent contrails and the artificial cloud cover that goes along with it has been a concern for agriculture (and others) for many decades now.

Here is a study done in 1970 on the effects persistent contrails may have on sunlight and temperature, which is a concern for agriculture:

1970 Study of Contrails: Airborne Observation of Contrail Effects on the Thermal Radiation Budget

...The spreading out of jet contrails into extensive cirrus sheets is a familiar sight. Often, when persistent conditions exist from 25,000 to 40,000 feet, several long contrails increase in number and gradually merge into an almost solid interlaced sheet...

By the way, the atmospheric conditions that are in front of an approaching weather system are often conducive to trail persistence, so when you see trails that persist and spread, that can often mean that a weather front is tracking its way toward you.

The trail is not creating that approaching weather, but rather it is signaling that the weather is on its way. Sure -- contrails do create cloud cover, as mentioned in that study from 1970 that I linked above, and that is an unfortunate by-product of the proliferation of passenger airline flight, but it isn't being cause by the intentional spraying of secret additives put into jet fuel.

a reply to: visitedbythem

A GE90-115B engine runs $16M each new. You're looking at several million to overhaul them. Running aluminum through would require an overhaul every couple of months at best. A modern engine can normally go 25,000 hours between overhauls. That means each aircraft would be out of service for over a day every couple of months while they changed the engines. That's a lot of money being spent, and lost.

a reply to: visitedbythem

That's exactly what you described. There's a boundary of air and moisture ahead of a front that allows contrails to persist and spread into cloud cover.

originally posted by: visitedbythem
I was one of those people. Im very Logical. It used to infuriate me. It just makes no sense that someone could run aluminum through an engine without any repercussions. Its too abrasive. In my mind, that would lead to early failure. The government is not going to tell citizens everything it is doing or why, and I still think it may have to do with something else, such as protecting the country from some type of attack, or to experiment with causing cloud cover for what ever reason

I see where you are coming from, and in your case you managed to get some information from the horses mouth.
Thing is, all the stuff running through jet engines is microscopic in nature and anything in it will be burned to some degree or another, but I think it is safe to say that that what goes in, is not what comes out, novel chemistry is at work in the high temperatures of a jet engine. In that, there are two key unknowns, (1) proprietary ingredients as additives in the fuel for a variety of reasons, (2) because (1) they are secret, then what comes out of a jet engine cannot be known because the chemistry is novel.
Now, proprietary secrets are well protected, and those ingredients serve a purpose and are allowed, but still, they don't know exactly what comes out of a jet exhaust, after being heated and burned at high altitude.
Take that to a so-called 'higher' level say, any military experiment requiring the use of aircraft for any reason at altitude, and whatever, that experiment will be classified, and will remain as such for as long as, when it becomes unclassified.

originally posted by: Soylent Green Is People

The trail is not creating that approaching weather, but rather it is signaling that the weather is on its way.

I agree with much of your post, I don't agree with that, the thermodynamics of a contrail settle that.

a reply to: smurfy

Persistent contrails have been well documented ahead of a frontal system. There's more moisture in the air so they persist more.

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: smurfy

Persistent contrails have been well documented ahead of a frontal system. There's more moisture in the air so they persist more.

No what you mean is they may be even more persistent.

Like I said the thermodynamics of a contrail have been defined,

Engine exhaust contains water vapour due to the combustion of hydrogen containing fuels with air.
Because of high temperature, the relative humidity is low initially. Therefore contrails, like fog forming
from breathing people in outside winter air, form only in cold ambient air, anything else is a mix.

In very humid air, for instance, contrails are sometimes observed to form also from wing tip vortices and edges
of the high-lift devices at the wings because of local pressure reduction by the strong curvature of air
flow around such tips and edges.
Not much use in defining contrails that persist at higher altitudes.

a reply to: smurfy

but I think it is safe to say that that what goes in, is not what comes out, novel chemistry is at work in the high temperatures of a jet engine.

But this is combustion, not alchemy. I don't think any elements are being transmuted in a jet.

originally posted by: DenyObfuscation
a reply to: smurfy

but I think it is safe to say that that what goes in, is not what comes out, novel chemistry is at work in the high temperatures of a jet engine.

But this is combustion, not alchemy. I don't think any elements are being transmuted in a jet.

If you don't think so, ask.

a reply to: smurfy

No, I mean that they persist when they wouldn't previously. If you watch contrails not persisting for a week, and suddenly they start persisting, then that's a damn good clue that a front is moving in.