Galatians; The promise to Abraham

a reply to: Akragon
he equates curse with scapegoat. That's a new one for me. I think people make unbelievable stretches when it comes to Pauls church. They will never accept the fact that there is a Gospel(good news) that was complete without need for a man to preach to the gentiles, Peters ordained assignment already filled that need.
Then you have legalism in Pauls preaching, compared to the laid back Apostles who preached the correct message. There is an altercation between Paul and Peter where Paul slanders Peter. Peter found out what Paul was really up to and was not pleased.
Paul was desperate for followers, changing his message from town to town "I have become all things to all men" The comment of a man with a messiah complex. He even justifies lying to gain converts if it works. And making a living off the Gospels. That's a cult leader, the first christian cult. And I object to the term gentile because there are not two kinds of people, Jews, and non Jews as if they are a separate species. They use the term goyim(cattle) to describe non Jews now.

a reply to: DISRAELI

Abraham trusts God, and the state of trust itself is defined as “righteousness”; that is, being in a right relationship with God.

For the rest of the argument, this is understood as the definition of Abraham’s character.

And from his behaviour as described in the rest of Genesis, we can form our own estimate of his character.

If that’s the kind of person God wants us all to be, then God’s character is somewhat questionable — to say the least.

a reply to: Astyanax
Indeed. Thank the Most High God Im not Jewish and YHWH isn't my God.

a reply to: areyousirius360

You worship that guy who curses unoffending trees, gratuitously kills pigs — other people’s pigs, at that — that he doesn’t plan on letting anybody eat, steals donkeys and encourages people to abandon their family and work responsibilities to follow him?

Not much of an improvement there that I can see.

a reply to: Astyanax
I know nothing of the Most High God, as he is unknowable. Who is this crazy pig god,? You don't usually speak such gibberish.

a reply to: Astyanax
I know nothing of what you speak. Why do you assume you know who The Most High is, and attach what you said to him? Who the christ are you talking ? What are you talking about?

a reply to: areyousirius360You gonna tell me any more about who I worship or you gonna tell me about the pig god, because I am lost. I might be missing something but CAN stealing be gratuitous? Isn't it the opposite?

a reply to: areyousirius360

He/she is talking about specific acts and things Jesus said...

Not that any of those things matter much...

All of them have reasons

a reply to: Akragon

She was strill stretching.

a reply to: areyousirius360

Well said person is assuming you worship Jesus as God... Even though you claim to be gnostic...

Which is not a Gnostic thing

a reply to: Akragon

Jesus is worshipped as the incarnation of Sophia in many Gnostic systems.

originally posted by: areyousirius360
Clearly Paul feels the law has ended, no longer in effect. So he can't be saying your cursed if you DON'T obey a law he considers finished.

Paul's point is that IF they take the law seriously, THEN they find themselves under a curse because the law says so.
That is one reason not to submit themselves to the law.
The fact that Christ is the end (TELOS) of the law is another reason for not submitting themselves to the law (and also another way of saying that he has "removed the curse of the law").

Paul's object is not to prove that they are under a curse. His object is to show why they should not be submitting themselves to the law. Either reason will do.

originally posted by: Astyanax
If that’s the kind of person God wants us all to be...

Nobody is suggesting modelling ourselves on Abraham in every detail.
We were focussing on the one specific point that he is one who trusts God. That was the definition.

originally posted by: Astyanax
a reply to: Akragon

Jesus is worshipped as the incarnation of Sophia in many Gnostic systems.

worshiped?

Nuuu... perhaps exalted as the son of the Father...

But there is only one God in Gnosticism...

a reply to: DISRAELI
I think you're rationalizing away the obvious but you're entitled.

a reply to: Akragon
Some Gnostics, I don't know exactly which, equate Sophia with the Holy Spirit. They don't believe in the Holy Spirit impregnating Mary because they are both female.

a reply to: Akragon
I don't claim to be Gnostic at all, I have no religion.

a reply to: Akragon

Either way, a scapegoat is not a curse even in the ancient definition of the word. Why would she assume I worship Jesus and why would you assume I'm Gnostic. I've never said that. They have ideas I agree with, and I think they would be happy if they knew what we knew today that YHWH was not originally the highest God. That's what they were missing.

a reply to: areyousirius360

My apologies...

I was confusing you with someone else

Some Gnostics, I don't know exactly which, equate Sophia with the Holy Spirit

I don't know of any such group... I suppose its possible though...

In gnostic belief there is nothing that is equal to the Father... Even Jesus

For reference feel free to read the following thread I wrote a few years ago...

Directly from the Apocryphon of John... which is the main "gospel" in Gnosticism

Understanding the Indescribable

a reply to: Akragon
It was the first Greek Gnostics, I just Googled it real quick. They identified the Holy Spirit as wisdom and wisdom as feminine. Wisdom in Greek is Sophos thus Sophia. It would vary ever after as Gnosticism is not a one dogma unified official church. But they must have been Greeks who put their own spin on the Christos as she was also incarnated in The Virgin Mary and known as his syzygy, some kind of wife. Doesn't sound at all like the clan that left the Egyptian texts. Egyptian Gnostics have a great many texts with legitimate potential. I am thinking they were stained by the Greek Gnostics and could have worked with the early church. I think it's a travesty, whatever happened. Why did Catholicism adopt so much paganism and so cruelly persecute everyone else? You can learn a lot in 5 minutes.