LaVoy Finicum (BUNDY) was NOT shot with his hands up! He charged at LEO's. (from others arrested)

a reply to: Phage
Ya I agree, just watching the video you can see that it is a bend at best, was more for a sake of argument that I said it was corner.

a reply to: anon72

What I saw in today's video, looked to me like they were trying to go around the blockade, and one of the agents jumped out in front of their truck, and the truck swerved to miss him. The old man then walked out with hands up...and the cop just shot him dead. Facts are facts, and my eyes don't lie.

a reply to: IlluminatiTechnician

You are correct facts are facts.

But what you offered was subjective interpretation.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: Sremmos80
Not really a corner. A bend.
There is a Google Earth view of the site here.
www.oregonlive.com...

Clint Van Zandt, a former supervisory special agent for the FBI who spent 25 years at the agency, said it "makes all the tactical sense in the world" for police to stop the Bundy convoy where they did. The objective, he said, would be to confront the leaders when they had separated from the rest of their supporters.

"It can be the downside when you can see for miles and miles because you don't want the individuals to see what's happening," Van Zandt said. "You don't want them to see anything. You don't want them to hear anything."

Search "Joaquin Miller Horse Camp" on Google Earth.

Not disagreeing, but he he did everything he could not to plow strait into the road block. It was very clear to me he tried to avoid running anyone over, he then got out of the vehicle and put his hands up. He got shot at and then tried to defend himself. Why would he have put his hands up first if he had any intent of going for a gun? If he was hell bent on shooting he would have got out of the truck shooting, not with his hands up.

Once again, with that said... These "protesters" chose badly how to go about their agenda.

originally posted by: Hefficide
a reply to: IlluminatiTechnician

You are correct facts are facts.

But what you offered was subjective interpretation.

It's not subjective interpretation, if the video shows it. You see it, or you don't. There's no need for psychology on this one.

a reply to: IlluminatiTechnician

Except your 'facts' fail to mention him dropping his hands. It is not a fact he was shot first, no possible way it could be at this point.

What I saw in today's video, looked to me like they were trying to go around the blockade, and one of the agents jumped out in front of their truck, and the truck swerved to miss him.

Um what? The agent would have had to jump in front of the car he was behind for that to make sense, what video did you even watch?

originally posted by: GeisterFahrer
He was unarmed.

Except for the gun he had on himself...

He was grabbing at his waist because that is where he was shot

Wrong, he was grabbing for his gun, that is when he was shot.

he clearly had his arms in the air.

Until he went for his gun, after that he was shot.

Try actually watching the video!

originally posted by: IlluminatiTechnician
a reply to: anon72

What I saw in today's video, looked to me like they were trying to go around the blockade, and one of the agents jumped out in front of their truck, and the truck swerved to miss him. The old man then walked out with hands up...and the cop just shot him dead. Facts are facts, and my eyes don't lie.

What I saw was the old man get out of his truck, hands up then reach towards his waste area 2 times at which point he was shot. Facts are facts and my eyes don't lie.

What I believe I saw is just as valid as what you believe you saw.

originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: IlluminatiTechnician

Except your 'facts' fail to mention him dropping his hands. It is not a fact he was shot first, no possible way it could be at this point.

What I saw in today's video, looked to me like they were trying to go around the blockade, and one of the agents jumped out in front of their truck, and the truck swerved to miss him.

Um what? The agent would have had to jump in front of the car he was behind for that to make sense, what video did you even watch?

He dropped his hands because he got shot at. And what? The agent was behind a FED vehicle, saw the truck coming around the corner and then jumped into the path of the truck as it tried to avoid a collision with the road block.... Once again, why would the guy come out of the truck with his hands up if he had any intent on shooting? The feds messed up. Plain and simple.

a reply to: Orionx2

Once again, why would the guy come out of the truck with his hands up if he had any intent on shooting?

To give the law a chance to get closer before he fired?

originally posted by: hellobruce

originally posted by: GeisterFahrer
He was unarmed.

Except for the gun he had on himself...

He was grabbing at his waist because that is where he was shot

Wrong, he was grabbing for his gun, that is when he was shot.

he clearly had his arms in the air.

Until he went for his gun, after that he was shot.

Try actually watching the video!

I watched the video - unfortunately, there was no audio from any body cams or dashcams - how convenient. the 18 year old that was inside the truck claimed Finicum was shot at during the initial stop, which is why he bolted. When he arrived at the roadblock, he attempted to drive around it (unlike a person intent on suicide by cop would do - they would have smashed through it) then got stuck in the snow (all of this was in the video I saw and collaborates the eyewitness account). the eyewitness then claims that Finicum exited the vehicle with his arms in the air (earlier reports were that he charged at the police - these reports were a bunch of BS) - this can also be seen in the video. The eyewitness then stated that Finicum began shouting that he was not armed when he was shot at.

So, the eyewitness is fairly credible, wouldn't you say?

Where is the audio?

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: Orionx2

Once again, why would the guy come out of the truck with his hands up if he had any intent on shooting?

To give the law a chance to get closer before he fired?

To show them he wasn't armed?

The eyewitness inside the truck claimed they shot at Finicum when he stuck his head out the window at the earlier stop.

originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: IlluminatiTechnician

Except your 'facts' fail to mention him dropping his hands. It is not a fact he was shot first, no possible way it could be at this point.

What I saw in today's video, looked to me like they were trying to go around the blockade, and one of the agents jumped out in front of their truck, and the truck swerved to miss him.

Um what? The agent would have had to jump in front of the car he was behind for that to make sense, what video did you even watch?

Right here. You can clearly see an agent jump in front of their vehicle at frame 9:15. So, the FEDS pretty much instigated this threat.

a reply to: GeisterFahrer

To show them he wasn't armed?

How does putting your arms out show you are not carrying a weapon?

a reply to: IlluminatiTechnician

So, the FEDS pretty much instigated this threat.

No. The Bundites instigated the whole affair. From the get go.
They were the ones strutting around armed on youtube. They were the one's who called on other "patriots" to join them. Finicum is the one who said he would rather be dead than imprisoned.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: GeisterFahrer

To show them he wasn't armed?

How does putting your arms out show you are not carrying a weapon?

It is universally understood to be a gesture of surrender.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: IlluminatiTechnician

So, the FEDS pretty much instigated this threat.

No. The Bundites instigated the whole affair. From the get go.

As I recall, they were not the one's who put the Hammonds in prison for 5 years.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: IlluminatiTechnician

So, the FEDS pretty much instigated this threat.

No. The Bundites instigated the whole affair. From the get go.
They were the ones strutting around armed on youtube. They were the one's who called on other "patriots" to join them. Finicum is the one who said he would rather be dead than imprisoned.

I disagree. The government cannot just usurp land at their leisure, without going through the proper channels as the rest of us. First mistake. How about them burning 127 acres of land, and lots of the Bundy livestock?

a reply to: GeisterFahrer

It is universally understood to be a gesture of surrender.

If he were surrendering he probably should not have left the vehicle until told to do so. If he were surrendering he should have lain down, face down, arms out.

That is surrendering.

a reply to: IlluminatiTechnician

Yes a normal reaction when you see a pickup coming straight for you, you try and get out of the way. Your freeze is at the same time he is swerving, he moves as the truck moves.