Oregon protest leader Ammon Bundy is arrested, says source

originally posted by: tweetie
He also said in one of the subsequent interviews that "there are more important things than a life." I understand that. He was willing to lose his for his principals.
Peace.

Perhaps suicide bombers feel the same way ... is that concentrated "feeling" enough to justify what happened?

Or worse, what may happen? More lives lost. More needless dissension and division.

One death, even a willing one, for such irrationality is too many. In my opinion.

a reply to: onequestion

Give it up. These guys don't do research. They watch the pretty girls on tv turning up their noses at those awful, scary guns. They are msm addicts. It shows. Just like you can tell a meth addict by their teeth, you tell the msm addicts by the talking points. CNN or MSNBC said so and how dare you say otherwise?!

a reply to: tweetie

As I stated, he came out with his hands raised so he could get away from the vehicle without any shots being fired. He didn't want anyone else hurt.

Again, subjective. But likely. He came out with hands up not, gun drawn.

Just in shooting him? I highly doubt they wanted to and tried to avoid it but were prepared if things did not go according to plan. I can give them that.

Just from direct observation of the video, they didn't 'hang back' and try to stop them by peaceful means. That roadblock was placed around a blind corner. He had to crash one way or another. Then they closed on him, with guns drawn, breaking cover and exposing themselves to fire, this would then require them to open fire first to preserve their own lives, in case he pulled a gun.

They are supposed to remain behind their vehicles or other cover until the subject lies down or resists. It goes against the simplest training to not remain behind cover out of the line of fire so they don't get shot. These two guys were less than twenty feet away in the open, one snuck up behind him, startling him.

Seen that before, they press forward, pressuring the subject into a flight or fight response, where they can then justify deadly force, at the slightest move on the subjects part.

They are much more well trained than this. They know the rules of a felony stop better than anyone.

originally posted by: Gryphon66

originally posted by: tweetie
He also said in one of the subsequent interviews that "there are more important things than a life." I understand that. He was willing to lose his for his principals.
Peace.

Perhaps suicide bombers feel the same way ... is that concentrated "feeling" enough to justify what happened?

Or worse, what may happen? More lives lost. More needless dissension and division.

One death, even a willing one, for such irrationality is too many. In my opinion.

I wouldn't know what suicide bombers feel, nor do I want to , but I don't think they can be compared to LeVoy.

In LeVoy's mind, and I'm going by statements he made to the public, he made it clear in a calm, rational way that it would be the solution if anyone tried to arrest him. He said he would never point a gun at someone unless one was pointed at him first. He was not advocating violence. Quite the opposite from what I can see.

Was what happened justified? I don't know right now as an observer and not being related to him or close to him in any way. I don't know what reverberations are occurring towards the future because of his death. Maybe in the future I can answer that question. I would have to give it some serious thought.

I can say, just from places I happen to visit on the Internet, there are people expecting civil war in this country and some, not all, of those people are chomping at the bit for it to start. I'm not one of them.

We differ, I don't think his death was irrational.

a reply to: tweetie

Notice that I was talking about the "feeling" or "belief" that is common between suicide bombers and Mr. Finicum.

You stated above that he believed that there are things more important than a life, and that he was willing to give his life for his principles.

Suicide bombers also believe that, and suicide bombers are also willing to die for their crazy-assed, nutjob "principles."

I don't see how his death cannot be seen as "irrational" ... there was no reason for him to die. He chose it.

Choosing death is 99.9 times out of a 100 irrational.

Sorry, on that we do disagree. It's always such a damned waste.

a reply to: Gryphon66

WEll I am sensitive that way...

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: DelMarvel

I've done the necessary research to conclude that the BLM takes land and then rents drilling and mineral rights out to companies like Genie Energy for 20% of the profit.

If you did any research and stopped jumping to conclusions you would have found out for yourself.

Now I'll leave you too it.

Thanks for all the links.

a reply to: DelMarvel

Your welcome.

Or you could simply Google Genie Energy.

originally posted by: zazzafrazz
a reply to: Swills

Thank god.

I find the highly ignorant comments on this thread disgraceful. Do you thank God Bundy is serving 5 years for $100 in damages too, while the Feds did the SAME thing but did tens of thousands in damages, and they get rewarded for their behaviors? The same thing. Wow, sickos! Our world is hopeless if people on ATS continue such ignorance.

originally posted by: Gryphon66

originally posted by: tweetie
He also said in one of the subsequent interviews that "there are more important things than a life." I understand that. He was willing to lose his for his principals.
Peace.

Perhaps suicide bombers feel the same way ... is that concentrated "feeling" enough to justify what happened?

Or worse, what may happen? More lives lost. More needless dissension and division.

One death, even a willing one, for such irrationality is too many. In my opinion.

But it wasn't your life, it was his.

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: DelMarvel

Your welcome.

Or you could simply Google Genie Energy.

I've spent a good deal of time since my last post searching under a number of different combinations of terms and have found nothing about the Bureau of Land Management seizing land and leasing it to Genie Energy.

So unless you're going to provide me with links to substantiate the claim I'm done with it.

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: tweetie

Notice that I was talking about the "feeling" or "belief" that is common between suicide bombers and Mr. Finicum.

You stated above that he believed that there are things more important than a life, and that he was willing to give his life for his principles.

Suicide bombers also believe that, and suicide bombers are also willing to die for their crazy-assed, nutjob "principles."

I don't see how his death cannot be seen as "irrational" ... there was no reason for him to die. He chose it.

Choosing death is 99.9 times out of a 100 irrational.

Sorry, on that we do disagree. It's always such a damned waste.

there was a great American that once said "if a man has not found something worth dying for, he is not worthy to live".

And .. the FBI tried, in vain, to frame him too.

originally posted by: GeisterFahrer

originally posted by: Gryphon66

originally posted by: tweetie
He also said in one of the subsequent interviews that "there are more important things than a life." I understand that. He was willing to lose his for his principals.
Peace.

Perhaps suicide bombers feel the same way ... is that concentrated "feeling" enough to justify what happened?

Or worse, what may happen? More lives lost. More needless dissension and division.

One death, even a willing one, for such irrationality is too many. In my opinion.

But it wasn't your life, it was his.

... and it wasn't your comment, it was mine.

Sure, it was his life ...

... and the lives of the people riding in the truck with him ...

... and the lives of the LEOs he drove a truck at ...

... and the lives of any and everyone who thinks that what he did was "heroic" and wants to follow him ...

... and the lives of any and all innocents who may be harmed or killed if he and people like him get their way ...

Life doesn't happen in a vacuum. Choices matter.

originally posted by: GeisterFahrer

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: tweetie

Notice that I was talking about the "feeling" or "belief" that is common between suicide bombers and Mr. Finicum.

You stated above that he believed that there are things more important than a life, and that he was willing to give his life for his principles.

Suicide bombers also believe that, and suicide bombers are also willing to die for their crazy-assed, nutjob "principles."

I don't see how his death cannot be seen as "irrational" ... there was no reason for him to die. He chose it.

Choosing death is 99.9 times out of a 100 irrational.

Sorry, on that we do disagree. It's always such a damned waste.

there was a great American that once said "if a man has not found something worth dying for, he is not worthy to live".

And .. the FBI tried, in vain, to frame him too.

Lavoy Finicum was not framed. He committed suicide by cop, just as he told us he would. What a cheap meaningless comparison to MLK!

genie.com...

American Shale Oil, LLC (AMSO) holds a U.S. Bureau of Land Management Research, Demonstration and Development lease to develop oil shale on federal lands in the Piceance Basin of Colorado. There are an estimated 10 billion barrels of oil equivalent in place within AMSO’s 5,120 acre preferential lease right area, and its plan for commercial operations targets approximately 20 percent of the available resource. Genie Energy holds a minority stake in AMSO, which is a joint venture with Total, SA, the world’s fifth largest integrated oil and gas company.

There.

originally posted by: diggindirt
a reply to: onequestion

They watch the pretty girls on tv turning up their noses at those awful, scary guns. They are msm addicts. It shows. Just like you can tell a meth addict by their teeth, you tell the msm addicts by the talking points. CNN or MSNBC said so and how dare you say otherwise?!

That's where you lose all credibility, by claiming a book can be judged by its cover... you are the one who has actually been hoodwinked here.

In reality, some of the most scamming & untrustworthy "methheads" on earth, have a perfect set of teeth. Also, plenty of the people who actually care about freedom & the rights of the people as a whole, are incredibility passionate about common sense gun reform.

Either way, if you actually did have any kind of skill at reading human intentions, then you would realize that the Bundy's are nothing more than a bunch of freeloaders who want to increase their bottom line by grazing on land that does not belong to them.

The blatant ignorance of anyone who thinks that because they wear cowboy hats, own guns and constantly rant on about the constitution, that they must obviously have your best interest in mind... lol, you've been played like a fine violin.

originally posted by: Gryphon66

originally posted by: GeisterFahrer

originally posted by: Gryphon66

originally posted by: tweetie
He also said in one of the subsequent interviews that "there are more important things than a life." I understand that. He was willing to lose his for his principals.
Peace.

Perhaps suicide bombers feel the same way ... is that concentrated "feeling" enough to justify what happened?

Or worse, what may happen? More lives lost. More needless dissension and division.

One death, even a willing one, for such irrationality is too many. In my opinion.

But it wasn't your life, it was his.

... and it wasn't your comment, it was mine.

Sure, it was his life ...

... and the lives of the people riding in the truck with him ...

... and the lives of the LEOs he drove a truck at ...

... and the lives of any and everyone who thinks that what he did was "heroic" and wants to follow him ...

... and the lives of any and all innocents who may be harmed or killed if he and people like him get their way ...

Life doesn't happen in a vacuum. Choices matter.

yet, he was the one who died. not the people in the back of the truck, not the LEO's, not the lives of any potential followers.

Please remember that the words you choose to use matter too, when talking down your nose at others

originally posted by: Gryphon66

originally posted by: GeisterFahrer

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: tweetie

Notice that I was talking about the "feeling" or "belief" that is common between suicide bombers and Mr. Finicum.

You stated above that he believed that there are things more important than a life, and that he was willing to give his life for his principles.

Suicide bombers also believe that, and suicide bombers are also willing to die for their crazy-assed, nutjob "principles."

I don't see how his death cannot be seen as "irrational" ... there was no reason for him to die. He chose it.

Choosing death is 99.9 times out of a 100 irrational.

Sorry, on that we do disagree. It's always such a damned waste.

there was a great American that once said "if a man has not found something worth dying for, he is not worthy to live".

And .. the FBI tried, in vain, to frame him too.

Lavoy Finicum was not framed. He committed suicide by cop, just as he told us he would. What a cheap meaningless comparison to MLK!

the FBI framed MLK but we should trust them when they say Finicum he charged at them with guns blazing ..

riiiight

The letter the FBI sent to MLK in hopes he would read it and commit suicide is on public display in the National Archives. I anticipate that there will be other items, in the future, on public display which show the efforts made by our government to drag perfectly good people through the gutter.

originally posted by: Subaeruginosa

originally posted by: diggindirt
a reply to: onequestion

They watch the pretty girls on tv turning up their noses at those awful, scary guns. They are msm addicts. It shows. Just like you can tell a meth addict by their teeth, you tell the msm addicts by the talking points. CNN or MSNBC said so and how dare you say otherwise?!

That's where you lose all credibility, by claiming a book can be judge by its cover... you are the one who has actually been hoodwinked here.

In reality, some of the most scamming & untrustworthy "methheads" on earth, have a perfect set of teeth. Also, plenty of the people who actually care about freedom & the rights of the people as a whole, are incredibility passionate about common sense gun reform.

Either way, if you actually did have any kind of skill at reading human intentions, then you would realize that the Bundy's are nothing more than a bunch of freeloaders who want to increase their bottom line by grazing on land that does not belong to them.

The blatant ignorance of anyone who thinks that because they wear cowboy hats, own guns and constantly rant on about the constitution, that they must obviously have your best interest in mind... lol, you've been played like a fine violin.

Wow, that certainly was a judgmental earful. Did any of the Malheur Occupiers shoot the police?

Simple question .. i am sure you can answer it. I mean, they had the opportunity to .. did any of them do it?

a reply to: GeisterFahrer

Please, get off your high-horse, stop talking about your estimation of other posters and deal with facts. With your comments here, you have no standing to critique anyone's words, least of all from the position of citing arrogance.