Baddogma's Meta Cafe- Polite Discussions About Scientific Mysticism and General Weirdness

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

the universe is in my current View and experience, void of everything!
But not existent, and not not existent. Middle way.

the absorption during meditation into the void is one thing and this is blissful for me when I managed to do it. But I have a strong feeling that complete emancipation or self realization is achieved when one can merge into "the bliss void" during abortion and when we can make this realization stable, than it could potentially stay that way all the time and meditation and ordinary life is merged.

...maybe?
I am just posting my impressions for now from new experiences and insights.

But I am far from qualified to make a certain statement and I will not even say anything more as discussing this with you or others will only limit my own natural insight and experiences and it could take me to unnatural direction...

a reply to: Anaana

Oh purpose... well, why does the moon hang around earth? Natural forces.
The question of purpose is so very human. Probably the reason for our dilemma?
"No life can't be chance! Human evolution can't be coincidence! Oh GAWD!"
I'm mostly joking.
But back to the UFO thing, most of the sightings are unexplained natural phenomenon.
What I am currently looking up is the military sightings and fights, in Vietnam, Korea and Iraq. I don't have a link, but an Australian patrol ship almost got sunk by missiles fired from phantoms about one day before?!?
An American boat got hit by its own bullets. That's just impressive, if it's natural or not.

Add: found a link, Huffington


And I'm in a rambling mood, you don't have to read, but I am constantly going back and forth. Do I believe in aliens? A very definitive maybe. But the human in me immediately asks, what would be the purpose?
Is their interest in our planet? Then why not just wipe us out?
Are they interested in us? Why?
It just seems easier to say it's all psychology and nature. But the truth might be something else. I don't know. I saw zigzag lights. I try remote writing and sometimes I stare into the dark, greer style. But proof is aloof.

a reply to: Peeple

Well if I had the means to travel around the universe and look/investigate other planets I'd be off there now, wouldn't you?

So in the vastness of the universe I would guess/assume there would be other inquisitive species out there and if even one of them is millenia/millions/billions of years and possibly tech we haven't even imagined yet then at least one of the UFO's must surely be real?

Also did Kev not say there was a culture 5 galaxies over, which is neighbours in galactic terms

a reply to: Anaana

Now, beanie I credited you with a little more self-awareness than that, surely you can see that you could easily change at least a couple of those "they"s to "we" or even "I" or "me". I know, at times, I could. We are all part of this situation and we all walk away from explanations that don't continue to satisfy, unless the ties that bind us to those explanations extend into physical or social relationships.

It goes without saying I am clueless about aliens (I hate them) and I can't, with a straight face, and wouldn't, put myself in the same category as UFOlogists like Vallee or Keel. But they have spent ages studying just that, they must have some ideas. Even 'dunno' in other disciplines is tempered with a refined view or advice/notions for future studies in a more specific area. It's never just 'nah, fairies'. Having said that, fairies is my starting point.

"I don't know" is a highly legitimate response, I just find it surprising that so many choose to follow that admission with a cease and desist. I suspect it is one thing to step outside your own box, quite another to step outside of society's, and so they simply retreat to a point from which they can maintain the illusion of certainty, that, seems to be based upon primary indoctrination or conditioning.

I suppose that some of them are demonised (excuse the pun) and ridiculed and unless you've walked a mile in their shoes, how can you (one) judge? It would take a very strong person to persist, despite the reception they got from former peers or family. It could be a face-saving - or sanity saving - exercise for some, or I suppose some might simply lose heart when they can't get any further forwards than the last man who tried.

But also, maybe, I'm being too hard on them. Maybe what I assume is just completely wrong - they didn't study the phenomenon in the way I think they did. Maybe they had to do other jobs too, maybe they only got three months to write up reports etc then moved on to something else. I genuinely have no idea.
It's just such a flaccid exercise, and such a weird conclusion unless you follow on with ok, now we are studying fairies.

a reply to: beansidhe

www.fairyist.com...

You can do a degree in Magick these days (USA - anyway) so why not faeries


edit to add - looking at it now - was set up back in 1927.

originally posted by: KellyPrettyBear

originally posted by: beansidhe
a reply to: Anaana

Isn't it funny how they all just "abandon" their studies when they find themselves bumping up against the boundaries of what they believe in, or when they can no longer confirm their bias? Very few seem willing to challenge their own beliefs, preferring to just walk away or stay stuck in the same mire ignoring everything that contradicts their worldview. There is comfort in the familiar I suppose. I don't know what that is, it's like the opposite of curiousity.

It's bonkers. What is really odd is that they all fall back to the old stories and say well, they must be those 'things' that are always here but we don't know what they are. It then just becomes a circular discussion and they get a get-out of jail free card.
How much did they genuinely believe in what they were investigating in the first place? Or were they just spinning lies from the start? It must be the only 'profession' on the planet where you can retire with the conclusion "dunno".

Did you ever read "Childhood's End" by Arthur C. Clark, or see it on TV a few months back?

In that book, these "devil looking aliens" basically gave humans all the answers, and fixed all their problems.

Humans basically died out intellectually and emotionally after that.. and soon went extinct.

I often wonder if there is a "limiter / safety device" inside of all of us, and once any of us gets too close to "the truth" we instantly shy away to avoid learning what we say that we want to learn so badly.

I often wonder if the "Universe" as a whole might do this on some levels.

Because once you "know the answer", then you die.

Well that's how it worked for me anyway.. I felt sucked 95% dry after junior left the nest.

It's interesting that I'm still alive..

Kev

I never read that, no, but it sounds good. It would mean our Universe is finite, there are finite questions and answers. I can see how curiosity is beneficial from an evolutionary point of view and it's a trait that has brought us here to date. And I guess the intrinsic self-limiter is shame, it keeps us in check with the group norms.

I don't know though if the Universe doesn't want us to know and wants us to keep striving. That has a Calvinist ring to it
(not that I'm suggesting you're a Calvinist ). There might be some instinctual knowledge that we're better off not knowing? Because if that's all there is...then what?

I don't expect you to know the answer to this, and it's just hypothetical, but if 95% of you/soul left, what do you imagine the remaining 5% is? Previous soul or something else?

And hello again, by the way.

a reply to: johnb

How cool is that? Thanks so much for the link! Reading it now.


ETA: Hang on a minute. I suspect this is pish - I wrote that article.

Hidden History of Fairies

a reply to: beansidhe

lmao so you suspect it's pish based on the fact they have an article of yours there - it could mean that's it's pure dead gallus

a reply to: johnb



It could but I rather suspect it's not.
Maybe I just got scraped in by accident, I'll keep reading.

originally posted by: UniFinity
a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

the universe is in my current View and experience, void of everything!
But not existent, and not not existent. Middle way.

the absorption during meditation into the void is one thing and this is blissful for me when I managed to do it. But I have a strong feeling that complete emancipation or self realization is achieved when one can merge into "the bliss void" during abortion and when we can make this realization stable, than it could potentially stay that way all the time and meditation and ordinary life is merged.

...maybe?
I am just posting my impressions for now from new experiences and insights.

But I am far from qualified to make a certain statement and I will not even say anything more as discussing this with you or others will only limit my own natural insight and experiences and it could take me to unnatural direction...

Everyone wants to "sink into buddha mind" and become free from the circle of life and death.

But it doesn't work that way. Not precisely. That's "marketing".

The body, emotions and mind, as well as matter / energy and all of it, are like an ongoing story the Universe tells itself. It is easy to become confused as to one's part in all that.. one's role. (no special part.. no special role.. yet a role nontheless).

When one is 'awakened' if you must use such a terrible word, with terrible baggage, then a 'busy mind' is the same as a 'void mind', as there is no longer a confusion about being something that you never were to begin with.

One can come to this understanding through a variety of means.. some 'mystical' but you can also come to the same unshakable understanding through immersion in science or nature.

One might consider this what people in Zen look for.. and in nonduality cults.. and so many consider this to be 'the end'.

I don't.

I consider that rootedness to be basic purification and elimination of unwarranted confusion. A beginning.

Kev

originally posted by: beansidhe

originally posted by: KellyPrettyBear

originally posted by: beansidhe
a reply to: Anaana

Isn't it funny how they all just "abandon" their studies when they find themselves bumping up against the boundaries of what they believe in, or when they can no longer confirm their bias? Very few seem willing to challenge their own beliefs, preferring to just walk away or stay stuck in the same mire ignoring everything that contradicts their worldview. There is comfort in the familiar I suppose. I don't know what that is, it's like the opposite of curiousity.

It's bonkers. What is really odd is that they all fall back to the old stories and say well, they must be those 'things' that are always here but we don't know what they are. It then just becomes a circular discussion and they get a get-out of jail free card.
How much did they genuinely believe in what they were investigating in the first place? Or were they just spinning lies from the start? It must be the only 'profession' on the planet where you can retire with the conclusion "dunno".

Did you ever read "Childhood's End" by Arthur C. Clark, or see it on TV a few months back?

In that book, these "devil looking aliens" basically gave humans all the answers, and fixed all their problems.

Humans basically died out intellectually and emotionally after that.. and soon went extinct.

I often wonder if there is a "limiter / safety device" inside of all of us, and once any of us gets too close to "the truth" we instantly shy away to avoid learning what we say that we want to learn so badly.

I often wonder if the "Universe" as a whole might do this on some levels.

Because once you "know the answer", then you die.

Well that's how it worked for me anyway.. I felt sucked 95% dry after junior left the nest.

It's interesting that I'm still alive..

Kev

I never read that, no, but it sounds good. It would mean our Universe is finite, there are finite questions and answers. I can see how curiosity is beneficial from an evolutionary point of view and it's a trait that has brought us here to date. And I guess the intrinsic self-limiter is shame, it keeps us in check with the group norms.

I don't know though if the Universe doesn't want us to know and wants us to keep striving. That has a Calvinist ring to it
(not that I'm suggesting you're a Calvinist

). There might be some instinctual knowledge that we're better off not knowing? Because if that's all there is...then what?

I don't expect you to know the answer to this, and it's just hypothetical, but if 95% of you/soul left, what do you imagine the remaining 5% is? Previous soul or something else?

And hello again, by the way.

Howdy ho neighbor!

Well the 'soul' is just a 'Tulpa'. A source of ignorance. Egg yolk for a lifeform.

Nobody says that I have to go around breeding another one.

I'd like to think that I've given at the office, and now i don't have to do such a foolish
thing again.

I can just live.. until I die.. a peaceful life without melodrama.

Souls are all about melodrama you know.. and are completely optional..

but still you would want to know about that 5%.

Why it's the Universe.. the Universe with less BS.. less "foolishness entropy".

It's still unfolding.. I'm an eternal student too... while I exist in this form..
this very optional form.

Hope you are well?

Iv'e been busy with "real life" whatever that is.. haven't been avoiding anyone.

Kev

a reply to: beansidhe

MysticMushroom spoke well about this..

To understand the void.. you must become the void..

To see past the barrier.. you must break yourself..

WE ARE THE BARRIER. All living beings are.

Once broken, you understand..

but then you reel back in horror from what you have done..

and then, having spent a lifetime breaking yourself, you

don't have what it takes to 'go the next step'.

I really understand you know.

I *am* taking a next step BTW.. but I'm awfully broken
physically at least from my life's effort to do the impossible.

Kev

originally posted by: johnb
a reply to: Peeple

Well if I had the means to travel around the universe and look/investigate other planets I'd be off there now, wouldn't you?

So in the vastness of the universe I would guess/assume there would be other inquisitive species out there and if even one of them is millenia/millions/billions of years and possibly tech we haven't even imagined yet then at least one of the UFO's must surely be real?

Also did Kev not say there was a culture 5 galaxies over, which is neighbours in galactic terms

It's my opinion that there is a culture 5 galaxies over or so.. yes.

Kev

originally posted by: UniFinity
a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

oh is that so?

I was under the impression that you have grown a bit differently (or more) than an ordinary shaman would, I don't know why exactly if I am honest ... in reality you are my first shaman I talked to.
but I feel that your insight is greater than it is for "normal" spiritual people or shamans.

And that is why I thought you like to call yourself failed shaman... : )

oh well, you are great no matter what and I will never forget your posts here...well to be more honest...let's say I will not forget a few things you shared about instructions of the two steps and few other things.
...you posted to much to remember ALL : )

I just don't want to go around with "shaman baggage". I don't want to be defined as anything personally.
I call myself a 'failed shaman' so that people who like to tear down 'shaman' won't go after me,
while the people who are desperate for me to be a 'shaman' for their own purposes will still
hope that I really am a shaman.

I serve both the haters and the 'seekers' by doing it this way.

And I don't need no stinking titles.

Better?

And my grandma was a full blooded Lakota medicine woman.. I might as well call myself
a failed shaman.

Kev

Howdy ho ho to you, sir.

Voids... I know all about them, and find myself with an instinctual urge to attempt to fill them... like this thread, lately, and just like the universe seems to attempt to, too (and one can affix a sexual double entendre to void filling as well, as above, etc).

I am now attempting to debunk a certain loved ones conviction that an astronomic catastrophe is nigh... he's an old Sitchen reader (but a scientist and not a total dupe) who's tied the usual internet noise together (underground bases, monetary/govt movements, statements from the queen /poop (er pope) that 2015 will likely be our "last xmas", etc) and is in a tizzy... so biz as usual... sigh.

And yeah, "real life" has also been tugging me to attend to loooooong neglected trifles (including basic hygiene and sanitation and oh, yeah, taxes)... but glad to read you, again.

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear
and I neglected to attach my post to you, but the above was meant to be (attached to you, that is...heh)

Here's my prescription:

Do what makes you happy, stay out of other people's attempts to be happy and just live life.

If we mire ourselves down in mental masturbation about metaphysics we're bound to miss out on a huge chunk of life that's meant to be experienced!!

*shrug*

We all need to once in a while stop taking ourselves so seriously...because in the end? None of it really matters, so you might as well have fun, love, feel happy, feel sad, be excited, disappointed and the entire spectrum of human emotions.

There's a reason I chose to be here ... and I'm pretty sure it wasn't to sit in a lotus position all day in a cave in the mountains all alone lol.

a reply to: MystikMushroom

No disagreement here.

99% of spiritual practice is harmful.

Kev

a reply to: Baddogma

Why is what he believes "bad" compared to say the Astr0 narrative or the symbiotic plasma/trickster/Higgs Boson narrative?

Kev

a reply to: MystikMushroom

heh its funny how we have different feelings and wishes for our life.

There's a reason I chose to be here ... and I'm pretty sure it wasn't to sit in a lotus position all day in a cave in the mountains all alone lol

For me this is a like dream life, to explore the mind and see its full nature and life in that realization with that potential and help other beings, this is my only wish.
And the best way to do that is in my opinion...in a cave for a long time

And I will even maybe go to India of Tibet after I finish my business here with the company and taxes and all the projects and if I will feel I have a chance I will find my cave and absorb myself completely without any attachments to this world and without any distractions.

This is for me the obvious thing it needs to be done, to cut off right from the roots of material world. As I feel I cannot do that here in modern civilization for now, but who knows, maybe I will find a way here and learn and develop among all the noises and distractions.

: )