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NEWS: 85-year-old black male beat by police

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posted on Jan, 8 2005 @ 07:58 AM
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In St. Paul, Minnesota police are currently investigating a case that happened yesterday that was elevated from a routine traffic stop to what seems to be the grounds for a hate crime. Michael Lee sprayed the black male, Leon Nins with pepper spray because he 'took too long to stop his car.' St. Paul African American Leadership Council alleged that race was a factor.
 



www.cnn.com
Nins said at a news conference Thursday that he was bringing sandwiches and cupcakes to his wife during his daily visit to her nursing home December 27 when Lee tried to pull him over for having expired license tags.

Nins, a World War II veteran who stands about 5-feet-7 and weighs 145 pounds, claims Lee was angry that he didn't stop his car right away.

"I told him, 'If I'd have seen you, I would have stopped,"' Nins said earlier. "He got really mad about that. He told me to get in his car, and he started beating me on the leg and on the side of the arm. He pushed me down on the floor, and he was slamming the door on my legs."


Please visit the link provided for the complete story.


For this, Nins was arrested and jailed for two days. Nins went to the hospital and was released with no sever injuries. Police reports said Nins did not stop for nearly a half mile after Lee began trying to pull him over, Nins differs.

Lee has said that he did indeed use pepper spray on the 85-year-old man, but only after he refused to produce identification. Again, Nins differs.

This is not the first time Lee has been involved in a case like this. In 2001, Charles Craighead had taken a gun from a man trying to carjack him. Lee mistook Craighead, who was black, for the carjacker, and shot him to death.

In my opinion, race was a factor.

[edit on 8/1/05 by MacKiller]




posted on Jan, 8 2005 @ 08:03 AM
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If I had a million dollars I would give it to Mr. Nins. That wouldn't fix the wounds of ingratitude and prejudice, but at least he could afford to arrange for Guido the Face-breaker to accidentally meet Mr. Lee in a dark alley.

But then again, Mr. Nins is probably very much above that.



posted on Jan, 8 2005 @ 08:04 AM
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Didnt take into account that the oldtimers reflexes maybe are not as good as the younger set, this, compounded by the fact that he was a minority gave the cop cart blanche to beat him up.

I hope that cop gets tossed out of the force, at the very least.



posted on Jan, 8 2005 @ 08:13 AM
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Given the fact that Mr. Lee also had a controversial role in another coloured case, I am to inclined to believe Mr. Nins version about what happened rather than mentioned police-officer, once can be co-incidence, two times is a pattern..

Also, beating up an oldtimer in general whatever colour seems a pretty unmeasured response. I do respect the police for doing often pretty dangerous and stressfull jobs, putting themselves in the line of fire, but there are a few elements that love their work too much...



[edit on 8-1-2005 by Countermeasures]



posted on Jan, 8 2005 @ 09:14 AM
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Almost positive this will not be the case.

Lee will be let off again, just like he was the first time.



posted on Jan, 8 2005 @ 09:21 AM
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just another proof of "tolerant" american nation,
where police officers, which stand by words "SERVE AND PROTECT",
write the rules for themselfes.

if mr.nins was a white world war two veterean, i belive mr.lee wouldnt dare to touch him.
and the saddest part is, that he will be let of again, just like mister MacKiller said.




posted on Jan, 8 2005 @ 10:00 AM
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St. Paul police Chief John Harrington confirmed that Lee used pepper spray to subdue Nins, but only after Nins refused to produce identification and began flailing at the officer.

"I do not believe (Lee) was acting with excessive force and I don't have any intention of suspending him or moving him to any administrative assignment at this time," Harrington said.


My question is, where's the video? That will prove who's telling the truth.



posted on Jan, 8 2005 @ 10:36 AM
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This is simply disgusting, and it's the kind of story that make me despise the police force. Too many are abusing their power, their should be some more serious punishement for police officer who are proved to be guilty of such power abuse.

He admitted he used the peper spray against him. I thought this was only for their self-defence? I mean, come on! The guy is 85! Sure mister the police officer, if someone doesn't want to show his paper, peppering him in the eyes will certainly help him to cooperate? How's he supposed to find his paper if he's blinded? I think he shot him BEFORE he tried to show his paper, so he could then say "he never showed me his paper".

So beating coloured people isn't satisfying enough anymore for our corrupt police officers, now they gotta attack elderly coloured people? Way to go, dumb asses. I also hope this cops gets beaten in a dark alley and that the beaters make him suffer a long time.

To the poster above, (because I'm not sure), are ALL police cars equiped with videa-camera now?


[edit on 8-1-2005 by m0rbid]



posted on Jan, 8 2005 @ 10:46 AM
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Originally posted by elderban
[

My question is, where's the video? That will prove who's telling the truth.
You need a video to prove this? Pleazzzzz



posted on Jan, 8 2005 @ 10:58 AM
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From what I've experienced, even if the police car had a video camera, the videos are only used if they aid the cop.



posted on Jan, 8 2005 @ 11:29 AM
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Can a court force the police to sacrifice the tape that would indeed help out the victim?



posted on Jan, 8 2005 @ 11:29 AM
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....If there was a video device onboard and it proved the story of Mr. Lee to be correct, I would suspect this video to be all over the news, just to clear the name of the police department ?


Out of curiosity, those policecars with videocamera, are they automatically/mandatory witnessing everything all the time, or only when a police-officer decides to use the recording option ??? What are the protocols for manual recording, are there instructions for police-officers to start recording when they are in pursuit or pulling over a car???


[edit on 8-1-2005 by Countermeasures]



posted on Jan, 8 2005 @ 11:47 AM
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Just another proof that the world is not colourblind afterall, that there is still hate and anomisity towards us. as coloured ppl. hmmm...... jeez...... maybe blacks , coloureds should keep separate from white ppl,. cause in effect we are not one. and we will never be, even though all of us are God's children. This statement is not racist, it's an observation.



posted on Jan, 8 2005 @ 01:55 PM
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This is simply disgusting, and it's the kind of story that make me despise the police force

Don't let it make you hate all police. The majority of them are well-intentioned public servants. This particular officer needs to be fired, though.

Poor old guy - taking cupcakes and sandwiches to his wife in the nursing home. I wonder what she was thinking, as she awaited his arrival.

Whoa - I'm starting to talk like a liberal here! < splashes cold water on his face>. But pepper spray? On an old man? Jeezus, is that what he has earned after living 85 years? And so it took him a half-mile to stop. Big f'ing deal. Old timers don't stop on a dime, thank goodness.

Minneapolis, fire that cop!


[edit on 8-1-2005 by jsobecky]



posted on Jan, 8 2005 @ 02:04 PM
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I just can't believe that some people would find this as an excuse to dish and bash at all police officers....it's really mindblowing.

I agree that in this case, and some others, the police officer has proven to be a bad apple, but it can't be said the same for "all police officers." In fact most police officers are good people, the same can be said of soldiers and sailors.

What I don't agree with is that according to some people this proves that all police officers are bad....only fools and criminals looking for an excuse to bash and blame every police officer would say this is the case for all of our men and women in blue.

If i was to stereotype every blue state in the country, from New York, to LA, and every other blue state in between by the actions of the groups and individuals i have seen in the news and newspapers, i would have to say that all democrats/liberals and non-republicans are criminals, gang members, and drug dealers/drug users, but i know it is not the case. It would be just another stereotype.



posted on Jan, 8 2005 @ 02:28 PM
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This is what you get when you cross two menaces to society.
A loose cannon of a police officer and someone who is
probably to old to be driving (expired tags and a half mile to
figure out that he is being ordered to pull over). A sad case.



posted on Jan, 8 2005 @ 04:45 PM
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It is difficult to draw any firm conclusions from the news story. But, overall, I tend to favor Mr. Nins side on this one.

The question whether there was a video system in the police cruiser is an excellent point. I wonder whether the St. Paul PD's cruisers are equipped for video, what its policy is regarding when officers are to use the video cameras, and whether officer Lee had the video running and, if not, why not? If the policy is that officers are to turn video on for all stops and Lee claims there is no video of this particular incident, then in my view there is nothing Officer Lee can be heard to say in his defense. He violated policy and procedure, acted improperly, and maybe should be prosecuted for assaulting Mr. Nins.

Yet, apparently because of bias, the PD and prosecutors say they are considering filing charges against Mr. Nins rather than Officer Lee.

Placing an 85 years old man in a police cruiser for expired license tags? That's a traffic infraction in my state. It calls for a citation and off you go.

Nins says that Lee pepper-sprayed him in the face, beat him on the arms and leg, and slammed the car door on his legs. Officer Lee doesn't deny these charges but claims his actions were justified.

Nins was held in jail for two days and wasn't able to get medical treatment until he went to the hospital after he was released. Way to go Minneapolis! Hold him in jail while the bruising and evidence of mistreatment dissipates.

St. Paul police Chief John Harrington said "I do not believe (Lee) was acting with excessive force and I don't have any intention of suspending him or moving him to any administrative assignment at this time."

That's good judgment, Chief Harrington, just like that of Officer Lee. Gotta arrest, pepper spray, and beat those old black folks when they commit a non-arrestable non-moving traffic infraction. That'll show 'em whose boss! Yessiree bob, er, John!

The article says that in 2001 officer Lee mistakenly shot and killed a black man who was the victim of a carjacking. Lee thought the victim was the carjacker. Oh well. It was just a mistake. So that was OK. Protect and serve, by God! Collateral damage happens. No foul, no harm?

Shooting the victim of a crime to death "by mistake" shows poor judgment on its face. Why is Officer Lee still on the streets carrying lethal weapons, pepper spray, driving a police cruiser, and possessed with the authority of a law enforcement officer. A "mistake" like that should have some serious repercussions even if there is not a basis for criminally prosecuting the officer. That "mistake" ought to disqualify Officer Lee from continuing to act in that role.

Chief Harrington's attitude makes it sound like a systemic problem.


[edit on 8-1-2005 by dubiousone]



posted on Jan, 8 2005 @ 05:00 PM
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Originally posted by Valhall
If I had a million dollars I would give it to Mr. Nins. That wouldn't fix the wounds of ingratitude and prejudice, but at least he could afford to arrange for Guido the Face-breaker to accidentally meet Mr. Lee in a dark alley.

Or Pisky with a red hot poker


There is no reason for this. Cops like Lee give the force a bad name. I think it's time he was booted out.



posted on Jan, 8 2005 @ 08:39 PM
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I have some friends who live in Rochester Minnesota who said a police officer shot a man point blank in the head during a routine traffic stop; and it was shown the victim of that could not have been in position to be seen as a threat to the officer. There are plenty of situations in the United States where officers take their authority too far; but Minnesota and other nearby states seem to have a big problem with officers being over-zealous to the point of using deadly force. I guess it's obvious at this point what is shown in "Cops" videos from that area of the country makes its way onto television on a carefully screened "PR" possibility, or lack thereof. I was an SP in the USAF about 10 years ago, and that doesn't make me feel bias about this situation. I think officer "Lee" should be kicked off the force for good. If that happened more often when situations like this happened you wouldn't hear so many people having to complain about the same bad apples. Yeah, some situations can be bad--really bad; but never will lay an excuse for behaving like the "Gustabo" (pardon mispell). Someone needs to look heavily into problems in that area of the country when it comes to line crossed by publicly paid persons in authority who obviously have even told, a psychological problem. Some people just don't get the color of someones skin doesn't make who they are. It goes to a psychological point when that someone initiates a moment of un-civilization resulting in bodily harm. The same goes for those who initiate a crime, so I see punishment of similar function for those in abuse of authority.



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