It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

19.6 Trillion Dollars in Tax Increases...Can you feel the "Bern" now?

page: 3
34
<< 1  2    4  5  6 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Jan, 19 2016 @ 11:05 AM
link   

originally posted by: eXia7
a reply to: Brotherman

So what you are telling me is that it's easier for you to blame the system than it is to come up with a solution? I'm not trying to be a jerk, but I came from nothing, and I found a niche to make money to create something. Perhaps you should consider these options.


Outstanding, you are then implying that there is nothing wrong with the system.




posted on Jan, 19 2016 @ 11:05 AM
link   

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: eXia7

If you believe everyone on state aid is a freeloader, then I can see the problem you are having.

Oddly enough, its people working three jobs with little or nothing to show for the inhuman effort they put in, who most often need the help. But I do not expect that to be properly understood, since thinking complexly and intelligently, and from an informed perspective on serious subjects has not been cool for a very long time.



I'm not limiting the term freeloader to just a group of people. Government is the largest sack of freeloading crap I've seen in my life. And that's all socialism is.



posted on Jan, 19 2016 @ 11:07 AM
link   

originally posted by: LSU0408
a reply to: BatheInTheFountain

Yep. And America's population is about 300,000,000 more than those countries. So you can't really find success (in your mind) in following those smaller countries. Bernie is too old and senile.


The population isn't a factor as many of these studies are on a per capita or percentage basis.

The problem with the U.S. is that we have NO REAL BASELINE readings of economies and industries. Carly Fiorina (Republican Candidate) is the only one so far that appears to know what this IS, or understands it.

(Not supporting Carly, just pointing out her economic knowledge is correct)

We also have larger SUB-CLASSES and SUB-CULTURES which are inherent MOOCHERS and dependent since birth, who would love nothing more than free stuff. White, Black, Hispanic...right across the board.

So a lot of this is cultural. European nations are different than us CULTURALLY. And the nations that Bernie points to as an example are VERY wealthy by way of CAPITALISM. They are different culturally and can AFFORD their social programs.

They aren't in debt, they keep good records, they have smart managers, they have sparse populations compared to GDP and resources (your point). It's a win win for them

Bernie thinks he can magically transform America into the BEST of the very CAPITALIST Europe, point to "Socialism" of 19th Century Marxists...and call it all "profound".

He's either very senile, or he's LYING.



posted on Jan, 19 2016 @ 11:08 AM
link   
a reply to: eXia7

Fantastic, so not only do you not have the slightest understanding of the issues involved with providing for those less fortunate than yourself, but you also have no understanding of the concept of socialism, as evidenced by your remarks thus far.

Why do you consider yourself fit to comment, when it is clear that you have not the data required to make a value judgement on?



posted on Jan, 19 2016 @ 11:11 AM
link   

originally posted by: Brotherman

originally posted by: eXia7
a reply to: Brotherman

So what you are telling me is that it's easier for you to blame the system than it is to come up with a solution? I'm not trying to be a jerk, but I came from nothing, and I found a niche to make money to create something. Perhaps you should consider these options.


Outstanding, you are then implying that there is nothing wrong with the system.


Wrong. I have found a way to work within the system. I blame the system as much as you, but I still found a way to make something work for me.

You just told me you are a welder. Well, there's the answer to all your problems. Free lance welders are $$$. I don't know if you aren't able to physically do this type of work or not, but I'm just giving you an idea.



posted on Jan, 19 2016 @ 11:12 AM
link   

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: eXia7

Fantastic, so not only do you not have the slightest understanding of the issues involved with providing for those less fortunate than yourself, but you also have no understanding of the concept of socialism, as evidenced by your remarks thus far.

Why do you consider yourself fit to comment, when it is clear that you have not the data required to make a value judgement on?


You are quite the condescending fellow aren't you?

You sound like you love government, and take hand outs and that I have offended you.


There is a reason America split from the brits, we see things differently.
edit on 1/19/2016 by eXia7 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 19 2016 @ 11:13 AM
link   
The very Socialist Hollande just announced yesterday how his Socialist policies have failed.

2-3 decades of rampant unemployment, with an overvalued stock market that looked wonderful on paper.

I wonder how France is even existing.

And lo and behold, he initiates and OVER TWO BILLION DOLLAR job stimulus emergency plan?

JOBS??? oh?? You mean jobs are important? Not the stock market which shot up while your people were OUT OF WORK?

Ahhhhhhhh, Socialists....so 'profound"



posted on Jan, 19 2016 @ 11:14 AM
link   

originally posted by: grey580

originally posted by: LSU0408
a reply to: grey580

What the hell are you gonna rob from the poor? You gonna take back your handout that you gave them?


Not just the poor. but also the federal government.

And do I really need to go into how a multitude of companies exploit the poor?

Just to name one thing. How lenders charge, usually poor people with bad credit, a higher interest rate on loans?

The list goes on and on and on.



Do you even read what you write? Lenders charge poor people with bad credit higher interest rates because the risk of not getting paid back is much higher! The interest rate is a reflection of risk. WTF? Are you serious? Why don't you go lend your money out to broke mofos and see how long you last after 2 out of 5 don't pay you back.



posted on Jan, 19 2016 @ 11:15 AM
link   
a reply to: eXia7

Welders are not making an awful lot these days, the system is making the profession take a turn for the worse. As I had illustrated before in this thread being able to weld and be good at it makes a little bit better then someone starting in the fast food career. (Yeah I said career ppl do FF as a career these days)

10 an hour to start at mickey Ds no experience

13 an hour to weld at a big company with 5 years experience

You don't see a problem with this?



posted on Jan, 19 2016 @ 11:16 AM
link   
a reply to: BatheInTheFountain


2) Treatment at County facilities is a MUST. You CANNOT turn away people for E.R. care. And these costs are passed off to actual citizens through rise in care and medical equipment. Nobody really speaks of this as not to 'offend', but it's pervasive.


Which is why if you have everybody pay premiums it helps offset those costs. People are going to go to the ER regardless and taxpayers are going to pay for it.


Why? Because there are more MEDICARE participants than not, and the pool is inundated with sick and poor, instead of Middle Class "average" patients'.


This is the fault of the industry itself for leaving those millions of people without the option of even buying insurance for decades. Their policies of non coverage and pre existing conditions are theirs, not the government's fault.

The ACA was a handout to the insurance companies. They are going to make record profits from this. The only reason they are complaining is because the profit margins are a bit lower in first 5 or 10 years because they have to actually honor claims for procedures they'd have happily denied.

We already have the nightmare. The health care system in it's entirety in the US sucks, and it sucks really bad. Costs are too high, quality of care is mostly sh.t unless you're rich, and don't even get me started on the way Vets are treated.

Now, mind you, I don't support this plan Bernie has 100%. And in order to get it passed, he would have to make drastic changes to it.

So, I don't see an issue with a bold, even crazy proposal, if it brings people to the table in order to provide a better solution that the shoddy system in place now.

~Tenth



posted on Jan, 19 2016 @ 11:16 AM
link   
a reply to: matafuchs

I personally believe one of the major effects that too many fail to realise is the hidden profit (for example increased productivity from less stress and better health, more educated people etc) from the changes which would far outweigh the current system long-term as well as the fact that whether the


Universal healthcare would increase the taxes, although if insurance companies were removed, people would save extreme amounts from unexpected illnesses, as there would be no deductibles. After all healthcare is one main causes of personal bankruptcy in USA. I do not know the full statistics, but personally, among closer friends in USA, when one feels sick, they too often try to get by somehow, especially when finances are not good, as doctor checkups might lead to high costs. This leads to lower productivity at work. An ill person, a person who does not feel good is not able to perform at maximum capacity.


Considering the future scenarios, automation taking over majority of "easier" jobs, the need for increased higher education (especially in STEM) is a necessity for any nation in order to compete in the world of the future. When people do not have the extra costs of extreme tuition, they can spend the money in the economy, as well as make more due to better knowledge


The main problem I see lies in the implementation. For some reason USA is not able to implement social policies effectively. Countries where cost of living is similar or even higher, are able to implement universal healthcare, cheap higher education most cost-efficiently. US pays more per capita than nearly any other nation for healthcare, for education (whether public school system or public university system), yet the difference lies in the other nation being able to run the system more efficiently. Salaries are similar, US pays more per capita when it comes to health, yet the other nation is able to provide universal healthcare for every person, while American citizen has to pay the insurance fees as well as deductibles...


Additional cash on the hands of people due to saving from extreme health care costs and tuition fees, is healthy for the economy. No one is protected from unexpected strong diseases, yet when these happen these easily bankrupt families, individuals, which is not good for the economy.



posted on Jan, 19 2016 @ 11:18 AM
link   
Ask any former sufferer of the former Soviet Bloc of Eatern Europe how they fared under pure Socialism.

Tell them it was good, you MIGHT get off with a light smack to the face.

Ask some former Cubans too!

Ask some North Koreans that actually made it OUT.

Then tell me me which European nations are SOCIALIST in economic model purely.

NONE, they're all Capitalists....with good social programs because they aren't as wasteful and corrupt as the U.S. and can actually AFFORD it.

And the refugees from other failed states KNOW THIS.
edit on 19-1-2016 by BatheInTheFountain because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 19 2016 @ 11:18 AM
link   
a reply to: Edumakated

All bank loans are insured against loss. The bank doesn't lose a thing. Regardless of credit scores and the ability to repay.

~Tenth



posted on Jan, 19 2016 @ 11:18 AM
link   
a reply to: matafuchs

Question: Are you rich?



posted on Jan, 19 2016 @ 11:19 AM
link   

originally posted by: Brotherman
a reply to: eXia7

Welders are not making an awful lot these days, the system is making the profession take a turn for the worse. As I had illustrated before in this thread being able to weld and be good at it makes a little bit better then someone starting in the fast food career. (Yeah I said career ppl do FF as a career these days)

10 an hour to start at mickey Ds no experience

13 an hour to weld at a big company with 5 years experience

You don't see a problem with this?


I know you will hate this, but it may just be location. I run a business where I'm in need of a welder from time to time, and as my business grows I'd need a good welder I could trust to do the job. But around my town its hard to find THAT guy sometimes.

I'm sure there are many business owners desperate for a solid welder that can get work done.

And I mean running YOUR OWN BUSINESS. Not working for the man. Get a decent rig and beat the street.
edit on 1/19/2016 by eXia7 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 19 2016 @ 11:19 AM
link   
a reply to: eXia7

I hate government. I hate the idea that any authority other than that of the direct will of the people, should ever hold sway over affairs.

However, given that it is deemed necessary, I would rather live in a state which takes responsibility for its failings (i.e. It is a FACT that it is the job of government to ensure that businesses create enough jobs for all working age, physically capable people, and when they fail to do it, they MUST provide alternative means for those affected by either low pay, or lack of work, to feed themselves and provide for their living), than live in one which fails to create enough jobs for all its citizens, and then makes that their fault by starving them to death.

I happen to be very proud of the fact that our healthcare system in this country is paid for via taxation, because many of my ancestors died through lack of access to healthcare, owing to their being poor, despite working harder than any man living today, their entire lives. That we can say in this age that people will be treated, that it matters not one whit whether they are poor, whether they are rich, whether they are mentally ill or physically disabled, we WILL NOT see them suffer unnecessarily and will seek to aid them without putting them in debt...That is worth being proud of.



posted on Jan, 19 2016 @ 11:21 AM
link   

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: eXia7

I hate government. I hate the idea that any authority other than that of the direct will of the people, should ever hold sway over affairs.

However, given that it is deemed necessary, I would rather live in a state which takes responsibility for its failings (i.e. It is a FACT that it is the job of government to ensure that businesses create enough jobs for all working age, physically capable people, and when they fail to do it, they MUST provide alternative means for those affected by either low pay, or lack of work, to feed themselves and provide for their living), than live in one which fails to create enough jobs for all its citizens, and then makes that their fault by starving them to death.

I happen to be very proud of the fact that our healthcare system in this country is paid for via taxation, because many of my ancestors died through lack of access to healthcare, owing to their being poor, despite working harder than any man living today, their entire lives. That we can say in this age that people will be treated, that it matters not one whit whether they are poor, whether they are rich, whether they are mentally ill or physically disabled, we WILL NOT see them suffer unnecessarily and will seek to aid them without putting them in debt...That is worth being proud of.


Do you honestly think I see disabled people and the such as freeloaders? Can we be serious here? Do you think I don't have common sense or something?



posted on Jan, 19 2016 @ 11:21 AM
link   

originally posted by: Brotherman
a reply to: eXia7

Welders are not making an awful lot these days, the system is making the profession take a turn for the worse. As I had illustrated before in this thread being able to weld and be good at it makes a little bit better then someone starting in the fast food career. (Yeah I said career ppl do FF as a career these days)

10 an hour to start at mickey Ds no experience

13 an hour to weld at a big company with 5 years experience

You don't see a problem with this?


$10 an hour???

Remember there are entire STATES that want to jump to $15 an hour...to work in SERVICE.

Welders are starting out at that in many of the jobs I see. I inspected welds and a good welder is hard to find.

But these jackholes think Welders should be on the same rung as a waitress??



posted on Jan, 19 2016 @ 11:21 AM
link   
a reply to: BatheInTheFountain


Ask some former Cubans too!

One of my good friends and neighbors is a Cuban, who defected and came here....
(he's not a "former" Cuban, he is Cuban - and brought his culture and sensibilities with him)......
he is self-employed and his wife is a head nurse.......they are lovely people. Happily married, down to earth, normal people.

Guess who he supports? (They both do)
BERNIE

Guess who he thinks is the worst? (They both do)
TRUMP

Go figure.

edit on 1/19/2016 by BuzzyWigs because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 19 2016 @ 11:23 AM
link   
a reply to: eXia7

I have my own rig but this is not about me. I am almost 600 miles away from my home as we speak, I haven't been home in almost 2 years. It is not cheap to run a rig and it isn't easy to just an go when ppl want to rip you off, taxes, and other issues involved.




top topics



 
34
<< 1  2    4  5  6 >>

log in

join