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Ancient Stone Tool Find Suggests Mystery Human Species

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posted on Jan, 15 2016 @ 07:59 PM
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a reply to: peter vlar

I find the divergences and then later reintegration fascinating myself.




posted on Jan, 15 2016 @ 08:23 PM
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it's just another example of genetic manipulation hundreds of thousands of years ago. they finally settled on modern man around 150,000 years ago. the body wears out but they stay on task and follow orders plus they like to fight wars against each other. who was doing it? the Atlanteans? Anunnaki? it only makes sense that the people who were doing the work would just let the species die off and maybe that's what they are doing with us now? I hope they throw us a bone and force/teach us how to upgrade our energy paradigm away from fossil fuels and nuclear power. we don't seem to be able to do it on our own maybe just a little short sharp shove?


a reply to: SLAYER69



posted on Jan, 15 2016 @ 09:36 PM
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a reply to: SLAYER69

The fact that in some cases, the lineages were separated by a quarter of a million years of genetic divergence before meeting up for the first time still blows my mind and gets me excited. To compare it to how the inhabitants of the America's looked at and dealt with Europeans is the closest analogy. Even then, it's a poor one because that separation was only in the tens of thousands of years versus 100's of thousands of years of unique culture and customs, languages etc... And in some cases when AMH met up with their long lost cousins they managed to cooperate and learn from one another as they did in the Levant. In other cases, we see cannibalism in Spain and France.

The Spanish site is almost certainly Neanderthal cannibalizing other Neanderthal but other sites are not quite as clear if they were eating each other or we were eating them. In a way though, we saved each other from near extinction. Neanderthal genetic diversity was at an abominable low when AMH began crossing the Caucuses into Western Europe but through admixture, they live on through us.

There is new research indicating that because of admixture early on in Europe, some of the HN genes that "we" inherited helped us to avoid the same fate as First Nation people of the new world... we were able to absorb their immunities to disease that would have brought us even closer to extinction than we already were.

An area that I find to be vastly under appreciated and lacking study, is the timing of AMH's mass diaspora out of Africa and how much of an impact the Toba event had on this mass migration. It brought HSS to the very edge of extinction, wiped out the last remnants of H. Erectus and sent Neanderthal even farther into a downward spiral than they already were. I'm hoping for some field work to happen upon some tangible Denisovan remains so that we can get a better idea of who they were beyond a genetic profile. I'd take a cranium at this point but post cranial remains would be a huge game changer in my opinion.



posted on Jan, 16 2016 @ 03:02 AM
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originally posted by: OpenMindedRealist

'Out of Africa' never made sense. Not from a sociological perspective, nor a biological one.

With each new hominid find, it seems increasingly obvious to me that humanity grew from several different evolutionary sprouts.

OOA is a fact and has been since 2007
www.sciencedaily.com...



posted on Jan, 16 2016 @ 05:12 AM
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a reply to: DexterRiley

The very fact of co-existence has to make one question the evolution theory



posted on Jan, 16 2016 @ 05:27 AM
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originally posted by: PhyllidaDavenport
a reply to: DexterRiley

The very fact of co-existence has to make one question the evolution theory


Why ?

For most of the existence of the Homo line, going back millions of years, there have been numerous homo species co existing.
We have only become the sole inheritors of this planet in the last 25,000 years
edit on 16-1-2016 by Marduk because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 16 2016 @ 06:01 AM
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originally posted by: PhyllidaDavenport
a reply to: DexterRiley

The very fact of co-existence has to make one question the evolution theory


Not at all. Coexistence demonstrates further evidence of evolution as each member of our genus adapted to its own ecological niche as H. Erectus slowly conquered nearly all of Europe and Asia.



posted on Jan, 16 2016 @ 06:23 AM
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Evolution only occurs out of need/necessity hence the reason there are numerous groups that have NEVER evolved still in existence. If evolution as theorised existed, then it would be a natural occurrence and as such uniform throughout humans and even animals, however it is not. Certain animals evolve according to circumstances & habitat but they do so as an entire species. If as theorised we evolved from apes, why are there still apes? One ape didn't decide one day "Hey think I'll climb out of these trees and do a bit of walking" whilst the other apes said "nah we'll stay put thanks". There would have had to have been something that occurred that made this necessary for survival. What this and other discoveries indicate is that there were and maybe still are different human species, not more or less evolved species living side by side.



posted on Jan, 16 2016 @ 06:29 AM
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originally posted by: PhyllidaDavenport. If as theorised we evolved from apes, why are there still apes?


Oh Jesus Christ, here we go with the credulity




Humans did not evolve from present-day apes. Rather, humans and apes share a common ancestor that gave rise to both. This common ancestor, although not identical to modern apes, was almost certainly more apelike than humanlike in appearance and behavior. At some point -- scientists estimate that between 5 and 8 million years ago -- this species diverged into two distinct lineages, one of which were the hominids, or humanlike species, and the other ultimately evolved into the African great ape species living today.


I'm guessing that you have either never really been interested in what science says or that you are incapable of accepting it because you are a born again Christian...



posted on Jan, 16 2016 @ 06:40 AM
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a reply to: Marduk

Please don't start with the veiled insults. This is a discussion. I have an opinion whether correct or not isn't actually for you to say, as you too only have an opinion. Science changes constantly in fact science is in the business of ooops sorry we were wrong. I have no qualms about being wrong, however, I can still discuss without insulting folk!



posted on Jan, 16 2016 @ 06:42 AM
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originally posted by: PhyllidaDavenport
a reply to: Marduk

Please don't start with the veiled insults. This is a discussion. I have an opinion whether correct or not isn't actually for you to say, as you too only have an opinion. Science changes constantly in fact science is in the business of ooops sorry we were wrong. I have no qualms about being wrong, however, I can still discuss without insulting folk!


You are asking questions which most school children can answer, if you are ignorant to the facts and think your opinion is valid then I truly pity you..
Born again Christian then...
lol



posted on Jan, 16 2016 @ 06:46 AM
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originally posted by: PhyllidaDavenport


Evolution only occurs out of need/necessity


No, not at all true. What was the necessity behind the mutation for blue eyes? Or the convergent mutation for red hair in both HSS and HN on the same gene but different strands?



hence the reason there are numerous groups that have NEVER evolved still in existence.


Really? Could you list some of these organisms that have never evolved please?



If evolution as theorised existed, then it would be a natural occurrence and as such uniform throughout humans and even animals, however it is not.


Why would it be uniform throughout an entire species? Adaptation often occurs as a result of ecological niche, every organism does not share the same ecological niche. For that to occur, the entire planet would have to be completely uniform.




Certain animals evolve according to circumstances & habitat but they do so as an entire species.


No they do not do so as an entire species. It's not what the fossil, geologic or genetic records show at all. But please feel free to provide a citation supporting this hyperbolic conjecture and I will gladly eat crow and admit my transgressions.


If as theorised we evolved from apes, why are there still apes?


Apparently you don't know the difference between an Ape, a Gorilla, A Chimpanzee, a Bonobo and an Orangutan.
Could you please describe to me what an ape is?



One ape didn't decide one day "Hey think I'll climb out of these trees and do a bit of walking" whilst the other apes said "nah we'll stay put thanks". There would have had to have been something that occurred that made this necessary for survival.


Yes, change in ecological niche from forests to Savanah.


What this and other discoveries indicate is that there were and maybe still are different human species, not more or less evolved species living side by side.


There is no such thing as more or less evolved. There isn't a tally or a score being kept. The concept is ludicrous.



posted on Jan, 16 2016 @ 07:29 AM
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a reply to: peter vlar

Surely blue eyes red hair etc are as you say mutations not evolution
I still stand by what I believe that creatures will only evolve out of necessity NOT as a matter of course therefore animals such as crocodiles etc have barely evolved as they have had no need to.
Its an opinion and a belief
Evolution is not continuous and only occurs out of the need to survive



posted on Jan, 16 2016 @ 07:40 AM
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originally posted by: PhyllidaDavenport
a reply to: peter vlar

Surely blue eyes red hair etc are as you say mutations not evolution

And if human society suddenly decided that only blue eyes were attractive, what result would that have on the next generation of humanity, that would then be evolution by sexual selection, look it up, its a fact


originally posted by: PhyllidaDavenport
I still stand by what I believe that creatures will only evolve out of necessity NOT as a matter of course .

Animals mutate, if the mutation causes more offspring to be born than the rest of the species then the mutation will become the norm as the species evolves, its that simple. You seem to think that evolution works by deciding what to mutate into and I have to tell you that idea is complete and utter nonsense


originally posted by: PhyllidaDavenport
therefore animals such as crocodiles etc have barely evolved as they have had no need to.

200 MILLION YEARS OF CROCODILE EVOLUTION


originally posted by: PhyllidaDavenport
Its an opinion and a belief
Evolution is not continuous and only occurs out of the need to survive

Your opinion is unqualified and your belief is that of a religious fundamentalist. Don't come on here preaching, no one wants to hear it


Now can you tell me, why are there still apes when apes and humans evolved from a common ancestor, or are you still going with your belief ?



posted on Jan, 16 2016 @ 07:47 AM
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a reply to: Marduk

hahaha religious fundamentalist....now THAT's funny if you only knew but alas you don't and never will. Please don't stick me in a box that suits just because of my apparently ill-informed opinions
I think I'll take my leave but thank you for the insights



posted on Jan, 16 2016 @ 07:54 AM
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Nice find! It really makes me wish we could go back in time to see exactly what it was like back then. Everyone has their opinion and it's hard to tell who is right (if any?).

Although I guess that would take away from most of the mystery of our past and ruin the fun



posted on Jan, 16 2016 @ 08:08 AM
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originally posted by: PhyllidaDavenport
a reply to: Marduk

hahaha religious fundamentalist....now THAT's funny if you only knew but alas you don't and never will. Please don't stick me in a box that suits just because of my apparently ill-informed opinions
I think I'll take my leave but thank you for the insights


My belief that you are a religious fundamentalists revolves around the question you asked humans and apes, which is a known red flag for a creationist.
rationalwiki.org...
So yanno, if that's not the case, you need to re-educate yourself on what you know about evolution, because if your knowledge of the subject is on a par with creationism, then you don't know anything about evolution at all




posted on Jan, 16 2016 @ 08:19 AM
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a reply to: Marduk

As I stated in a similar thread, simply because someone's beliefs don't tally with your own, is no need to resort to insults. I like to learn, its why I'm here and admit this is not my subject of expertise but I know enough to have a decent conversation about it and more than willing to research more and learn more, but if that's your intention then your pompous attitude makes that completely unlikely

Yes I believe we were created by whatever whoever, loved the film Prometheus
the Book of Enoch indicates strongly that there have been outside influences.

My opinions may be ill informed but they are mine and until I have verifiable proof that evolution occurs constantly and consistently I can' think otherwise



posted on Jan, 16 2016 @ 08:29 AM
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originally posted by: PhyllidaDavenport
a reply to: peter vlar

Surely blue eyes red hair etc are as you say mutations not evolution


evolution is, at its most basic descriptor, a measurement of changes in allele frequency over time. A change in allele frequency is the result of mutations. An organism can't evolve if there are no genetic mutations.


I still stand by what I believe that creatures will only evolve out of necessity NOT as a matter of course


And this belief is based on what exactly? It's not based in science. I'm not trying to be rude, I'm genuinely attempting to understand your view point.


therefore animals such as crocodiles etc have barely evolved as they have had no need to.


And the goal posts begin such sudden movement that innocent bystanders may get whiplash. So which is it? Some animals have never changed or crocodiles have only changed a little? You emphatically stated

hence the reason there are numerous groups that have NEVER evolved still in existence.


So if there are numerous organisms that have NEVER evolved and still living today why could you not name a single one?

dinosaurs.about.com...
www.preceden.com...


Its an opinion and a belief


And that's fine. However, you are posting in a science based forum. Here we deal in facts. Not conjecture. The Origins and Creationism forum Origins and Creationism is probably more your speed if you are unable to support your position with actual data.


Evolution is not continuous and only occurs out of the need to survive


Dr. Collins and the Human Genome Project vociferously disagree with that. Every second of every day that you draw breath your cells are mutating, the allele frequencies are changing. If you had a child 5 years ago and another last week, the genetics you would impart on the second child will be different from those imparted upon the first. Likewise, every fossil is a transitional fossil. Evolution doesn't cease to work because of an individuals skepticism of science. The whole concept of evolving to survive/survival of the fittest is a century and a half old anachronism that was displaced by MES


So since you have evaded answering any legitimate questions while building your house out of strawmen, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt...

What is an ape?

What are some organisms that have NEVER evolved per your claim?

Why do you believe that evolution occurs simultaneously and uniformly throughout an entire population?



posted on Jan, 16 2016 @ 08:36 AM
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originally posted by: PhyllidaDavenport
My opinions may be ill informed but they are mine and until I have verifiable proof that evolution occurs constantly and consistently I can' think otherwise


So the 100,000+ peer reviewed papers on the subject don't carry any weight then? Just to be clear, evolution itself is a fact. Every time you turn on your TV, operate your microwave, fly in an airplane, get an X-ray, MRI or CT scan, you are altering your DNA. Too much time in the sun? Altering your DNA. Every single species dead or living, is a transitional species, every fossil a transitional fossil. Evolution is indeed a fact. The theories encompassing the Modern Evolutionary Synthesis serve to explain HOW the process works. The theory isn't an attempt to prove the existence of it.




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