Authors of the Bible: The Greatest Plagiarism Ever Believed

a reply to: Ghost147

I just don't get why creationist bother atheists sooooo much. I mean you sound like you spend your every waking moment bothered that people are religious, mostly Christian. Who cares! just let people believe in Jesus his message isn't bad even if you believe its "plagiarized"

maybe all these stories are similar for a reason?

and don't give me that crap that you get preached by Christians because I've lived in the south for almost 14 years and I can only count two times thats happened to me

a reply to: Ghost147

Very good thread and excellent information. Amazing if you want to be religiously famous you have got to have been born of a virgin and fathered miraculously in other words brought in via divine right!

Trouble concerning Christianity is that it was created on top of the older, but unoriginal Jewish religion, created itself from the deliberate adaptation of Mesopotamean myths. Genesis was plagiarised and twisted simply because the Israelites would not have accepted these accounts as their own because they knew these creation stories originated from a much older culture:

e.g. Adapa and the South Wind - The serpent Ningishzida is a friend to Adapa and helps him in his search for immortality.

But this was altered to make the serpent an enemy of Adam and excused his being kicked out of the garden by God because he had been deceived by evil - thereby necessitating the needs for the religious priests to keep man safe! Best qualifier for your making a living off of others.

An interesting point about the role of the serpent is that there existed serpent worshipping religions (from the Sumerians onwards. The serpent was symbolic of an ancient God - so the serpent could not be seen as a benefactor of the Israelites. This is reinforced later by Moses supposedly having control over the serpent and keeping it contained in his staff and his later victory over the snakes.
.
Atrahasis,
The Epic of Gilgamesh
The Enuma Elish.

The Babylonian Gods were also packed together into one being thereby separating the Israelites further from other local cultures and especially the Canaanite Pantheon from which YHWH emanates along with a wife.

The similarities between the ancient Israelite Creation story and the Babylonian creation story prove the claim of plagiarism.

Babylonian Story source - Enuma Elish dated 12 century BCE. Genesis not until 8th or 9th century BCE
Date written down (conservative) Genesis 13th century BCE Enuma Elish , earlier 12 century BCE

Genesis claims the earth's creator was A single God YHWH. Babylonian version tells that a God battled a Goddess.

The initial state of the earth in genesis was a desolate waste, covered in darkness. The Babylonian one tells us it was chaos enveloped in darkness.

They both claim the first development was that light was created and from then on Genesis concurs with the Babylonian version up till the last development (7th day) when:

Genesis claims God rests and sanctified the Sabbath. The Babylonians say the Gods rested and celebrated.

Christianity was created for political reasons and the control of peoples by one ruler at that time, the Emporer who wanted to be regarded as 'Gods chosen one with the right to rule given divinely and that ambition was grabbed by royalty when the bible was rewritten by King James because the divine right to rule given by the one God doesn't exist in the previously used Geneva Bible.

www.reformed.org...://www.reformed.org/documents/geneva/Geneva.html

In the West the state and church are linked, like the symbology of the tree of life with the serpent wound very tightly around it.

Its up to people what they want to believe in but I can't help wondering if one puts ones whole belief system into something that one doesn't really well research it first. For me its something I felt I owed to myself if I was going to fully commit to a belief system. The religious power brokers are no better than politicians and most intrinsically manage both roles. Most 'rulers' align themselves to attending some religious institution etc and are deliberately seen to do so.

a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

Three High Holy Feasts per year (Passover, Pentecost, and Atonement) say you're mistaken.

Nonsense! Those holy days don't celebrate or prophecy a dying god.

originally posted by: DeathSlayer
a reply to: Ghost147

Oh great more zeitgeist crap!

It is easy to BS you. How old are you? 12?

Same question to you really.
Instead of showing the OP he is wrong you retort to calling him 12 years of age.
So you can't can you the OP is correct the Bible is full of plagiarism.

originally posted by: JDmOKI
a reply to: Ghost147

I just don't get why creationist bother atheists sooooo much. I mean you sound like you spend your every waking moment bothered that people are religious, mostly Christian. Who cares! just let people believe in Jesus his message isn't bad even if you believe its "plagiarized"

maybe all these stories are similar for a reason?

and don't give me that crap that you get preached by Christians because I've lived in the south for almost 14 years and I can only count two times thats happened to me

"if it can be destroyed by truth, it deserves to be destroyed by truth" - carl sagan

originally posted by: Murgatroid
I think a much more pertinent question would be why do YOU believe what you do?

I don't hold philosophical beliefs.

I don't 'believe' there are no gods, but rather, I simply lack the believe in them.

I have this lack of belief because there has yet to be any sort of inclination that we've made in the observable universe that suggests any gods exist. Until confirmed observation occurs, it would be a waste of time and energy fearing about my access to heaven, or believing a mystical being created the universe, and so on and so forth.

Furthermore, I lack belief in a generalist view of a deity, one that does not ascribe to any particular religion. I full embrace the fraudulence of religions, as it is impeccably evident that they are all works of fiction, pummeled with false claims about the universe around us, and how things came to be. We know this for a fact because we can see the evolution of Religion, we understand why religion came about in humanity, we can prove 'matter of fact' claims false with evidence, and so on and so forth.

I lack a belief in a general view of gods.

But when you start to place details upon any gods, details that are easy to prove false, that specific god is no longer a possibility.

originally posted by: Murgatroid
Is it because of revisionist frauds such as Acharya S and Zeitgeist?

I've never read anything from either source. I came to this conclusion through the research I've done about the universe around us, and of various religions. I came to this conclusion not because someone else came up with a point and told me to believe it, but because I myself formulated the conclusion based on objective research, logic, and critical thinking.

originally posted by: Murgatroid
Why are so many easily convinced by frauds like this when all of it has been proven false?

False premise much?

originally posted by: Murgatroid
There comes a point in time when each one of us will have to come to terms with the fact that this whole copycat argument is fallacious.

Or, you know, you could just read another religion's scripture, texts, mythology, and stories to find out how factual they are.

a reply to: JDmOKI

Because people believing those stories as truth try to get politicians elected that try to push pro-Christian laws into effect.

originally posted by: JDmOKI
a reply to: Ghost147

I just don't get why creationist bother atheists sooooo much. I mean you sound like you spend your every waking moment bothered that people are religious, mostly Christian.

As Krazysh0t pointed out. It's because religious people don't just sit there and keep religion to themselves. It's pushed into everything around us:

~ Churches are exempt from taxes
~ The religious hold a bias over newfound information (particularly Science), and try to remove it from education
~ People force their children to forgo medical attention and instead use 'faith healing' while the child suffers a terrible death
~ the bible (and other scriptures in other religions) is used more often than not as a tool and excuse to belittle others, abuse others, hate others and to kill others
~ People indoctrinate their children with these barbaric beliefs and teach them not to question any of it, but reject all new information, creating another generation of close minded individuals
~ People vote for leaders, not because of what they say they will do, but because they are of the same religion.

None of this bothers you?

a reply to: TzarChasm

"Truth" is based on perspective

a reply to: Krazysh0t

When was the last time a pro Christian law was passed? I'm not even sure what a pro Christian law is really.
Abortion? that not really Christian. I'm not Christian and I very much don't agree with late term abortion. Maybe I'm missing some examples.

I'll give you that some Christians would like some Christians agenda passed but so would some Muslims. I dunno... I'm just not bothered by people believing in a higher power like the majority of atheists i know.

originally posted by: JDmOKI
a reply to: TzarChasm

"Truth" is based on perspective

Only if the conclusion that something is 'True' came about by the means of Subjectivity.

However, when a conclusion is reached through Objective means, then the conclusion is far more accurate.

a reply to: JDmOKI

Dude, the entire homosexual marriage debate is framed around catering to Christians.

originally posted by: JDmOKI
a reply to: Krazysh0t

When was the last time a pro Christian law was passed?

Here's a link to a Map of Publicly Funded Schools That Are Allowed to Teach Creationism.

Here's a link that goes into more depth (posted in 2014) about Texas Public Schools Are Teaching Creationism

Here's another link that goes into even more depth about the specific situation that occurred in 2013 Where the Texas state Board of Education adopted new science textbooks that will be used in public schools for the next decade that teach Christian Creationism.

a reply to: Ghost147

We live in a free society where people can reject or accept anything they want. I'm also very much against putting people into little boxes and saying all people are like this and all people are like that. I know some serious closed minded atheists and spiritualists. I know pagans who won't vaccinate their children.

also, Jesus taught not to judge others so it doesn't teach to belittle others. and people vote for lots of really stupid reasons. I voted for Obama twice

All I'm really trying to say is that I'm an equal opportunity hater. I can find things that really bother me about athiests, creationists, pagans, etc.

everyone is caught up in their own little world where they think their prospective is more important then everyone else.

and yes, it does bother me

a reply to: Ghost147

Don't forget about this:
Study: Abstinence-Only Sex Ed Up

The only people who think that abstinence only sex education is effective are Christians. Everyone else has acknowledged that sex education should teach birth control and safe sex in addition to abstinence only.

a reply to: Ghost147

I was taught about all world religions in school and is was a history class. They should not be preached to but should be taught the origins and what others believe. I don't have time to read the source you posted but I don't see a problem with students learning about world religions.

I mean if they cancel science classes and have a Christian class at a public school, of course I have a problem.

I'm not surprised at anything Texas tries to pass

originally posted by: JDmOKI
a reply to: Ghost147

We live in a free society where people can reject or accept anything they want.

Agreed, I'm glad it's like that, too. However, these people aren't just 'saying' what they want, they are forcing it on people, and using the money of the taxpayers that don't all hold that same view to pay for the beliefs they are forcing in education.

originally posted by: JDmOKI
a reply to: Ghost147
I'm also very much against putting people into little boxes and saying all people are like this and all people are like that.

I'm not sure how this is relevant to the argument at hand. Who made a claim like this?

originally posted by: JDmOKI
a reply to: Ghost147
I know some serious closed minded atheists and spiritualists. I know pagans who won't vaccinate their children.

Me too, not sure why this is relevant to the argument either.

originally posted by: JDmOKI
a reply to: Ghost147
also, Jesus taught not to judge others so it doesn't teach to belittle others. and people vote for lots of really stupid reasons. I voted for Obama twice

You didn't question that "people are voting for the right things and the right things only" you asked: When was the last time a pro Christian law was passed?, and so I provided you modern cases of when pro-christian laws were passed.

It's also against the constitution.

originally posted by: JDmOKI
a reply to: Ghost147
All I'm really trying to say is that I'm an equal opportunity hater. I can find things that really bother me about athiests, creationists, pagans, etc.

Again, why is this relevant?

originally posted by: JDmOKI
a reply to: Ghost147
everyone is caught up in their own little world where they think their prospective is more important then everyone else.

Atheists do have a specific perspective, or a set of beliefs, or a universal faith. We are against when religious people force their religion on to others and make us pay for it because it's immoral and it's unconstitutional.

originally posted by: JDmOKI
a reply to: Ghost147

I was taught about all world religions in school and is was a history class. They should not be preached to but should be taught the origins and what others believe.

I see nothing wrong with this. We should learn the history of religion in humanity and the various ones.

The issue with the articles I posted is that one specific religion is stating that it's position should be viewed and taught as an equal possibility to that of actual confirmed scientific studies, yet without the scrutiny that science places upon itself

originally posted by: JDmOKI
a reply to: Ghost147
I don't have time to read the source you posted but I don't see a problem with students learning about world religions.

This isn't about learning the worlds religions. This is about one single religion that is claiming to be as factual as science, and to be taught in science class.

It's not presenting itself as "world history" or even in an optional class were you can study christianity, it is changing the actual textbooks of a required course to place it's on personal beliefs in and presenting it as fact.

originally posted by: JDmOKI
a reply to: Ghost147
I mean if they cancel science classes and have a Christian class at a public school, of course I have a problem.

Then you must have a problem with the links I provided, because they did something far worse than 'cancel science class', they actually altered the information within the science textbooks and classes and placed in Christian teachings. And then made the taxpayers pay for it.

I'm not surprised at anything Texas tries to pass

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

Three High Holy Feasts per year (Passover, Pentecost, and Atonement) say you're mistaken.

Nonsense! Those holy days don't celebrate or prophecy a dying god.

Well, you declared it to be "nonsense", so it certainly must be true. Most people support their opinions with facts, but you must be exempt from that.

a reply to: Ghost147

The Bible was written over 2000 years ago, by men, with an agenda. Since then it's been edited several times, by men, with an agenda. It's a book written by men - not the direct word of God, whoever he/she/it THAT is.