Coining a new term, "Individual extremism"

I would like to bring a new term into the consciousness of the community.

Individual extremism.

Our financial system is clearly broken and the main reason I believe it's broken is because of its emphasis on the individual. It incentivizes greed and selfishness, breaks down the idea of community of family and creates a situation where it's socially acceptable for people to pursue their own self interests to the extreme.

I apologize for the shortness of the thread but I think it's very clear.

a reply to: onequestion

Unfortunately this is all just a symptom of Capitalism. Survival is no longer a struggle and our technological gains are increasing evermore. Depriving the majority of people from these things is becoming increasingly illogical and something that is bound to fail.

originally posted by: Thetical
a reply to: onequestion

Survival is no longer a struggle and our technological gains are increasing evermore.

The show isn't over yet, and there is an untold number of people in this country alone who would scoff at your statement, if they possessed the media by which to view it.

a reply to: Thetical

I have to say, that it has always been my assertion that unless you live in such a wonderful utopia, that no one gets sick within its borders, that none of its funds are misspent, that all of its spare resource is ploughed into science, space travel, medicine, and the like, and that not a single person in that utopia could want for a damn thing, then you should be struggling.

Simply put, I maintain that if one is not struggling to survive, then one is about the business of surviving off the backs of others, and I do not mean by cheating the benefits system, but by profiting from work you have no right to claim recompense for. Those who are struggling, are living lives I would value as worthy. Those working only eight months of the year, in fancy offices, going home to penthouses, never having done a days solid, manual work in their lives? Frankly, I have no respect for that at all. One either ceases to struggle because one has earned the right by sweat and physical effort, or one dies, and the struggle ends. The only other way to live free of struggle, in my view, is to become part of the problem.

a reply to: TrueBrit

excellent post truebrit. I too feel exactly the same.

a reply to: onequestion

As a lurker I always liked your posts, didn't always agree but I think you do help stretch our minds a bit beyond the obvious MSM topics so prevalent now.

Anyway, I think you are onto something here.

Individualism has indeed run amok. In fact, I think it threatens the very fabric of society. The rights of individuals, no matter how inane, have become more weighty than the success of our collective. That's not to say individual, inalienable rights are not important or even paramount in a free society but we have confused them horribly with privileges and preferences.

To the point that our society is floundering under the burden of accommodating everyone.

Now, to the take it one step further, I am going to posit that it all starts with sex. In the sixties sex became a commodity that the individual could trade more freely. The catch is we traded down. We turned away from more traditional, healthy expressions, we traded more loosely, with more people. While it felt great for parents, the children were negatively impacted. Divorce rates went up, families were torn apart. In that scenario, a child will often look to their own needs, further fueling individualism.

We now have generations of that thinking and the sickness of individual extremism, as you put it, amplifies with each one. Add to that pervasive technology and it's massive advance which allows us to have our own individual experience in just about everything from music to television to working and, yes, even sex - and you have given rise to individuals that really don't need anyone. At least in their minds. And when they are occasionally slapped with the harsh reality that they exist within a collective, a society of shared resources and assets and that there are other individuals besides themselves that also matter , the results can be epic and ugly.

originally posted by: Thetical
a reply to: onequestion

Unfortunately this is all just a symptom of Capitalism. Survival is no longer a struggle and our technological gains are increasing evermore. Depriving the majority of people from these things is becoming increasingly illogical and something that is bound to fail.

and yet capitalism has lifted more people out of servitude and squalor than any other system in place world wide.

No system is perfect, but looking at the numbers tells the story.

Technological gains? Again, where are those gains coming from? Socialist or Communist countries?

Countries with the highest level of technological and medical discovery, tend to be Capitalist societies, the majority anyway.

Again no system is perfect and I abhor Cronie capitalism, however one should not throw out the baby with the bath water.

Love Love,
AlienSupernova

originally posted by: onequestion
I would like to bring a new term into the consciousness of the community.

Individual extremism.

Our financial system is clearly broken and the main reason I believe it's broken is because of its emphasis on the individual. It incentivizes greed and selfishness, breaks down the idea of community of family and creates a situation where it's socially acceptable for people to pursue their own self interests to the extreme.

I apologize for the shortness of the thread but I think it's very clear.

Ironically, individualism has never been more oppressed. Financially, we work harder for less. Politically, more restrictions increasing on an almost daily basis on what is 'acceptable' and foisted on us under the guise of 'equality' , 'fairness' and other manipulated concepts.

Non-conformity has now been labelled a 'mental disorder'.

The omitted data from the OP, and it is critical, is the VAST majority who strive for individual freedoms, be it political or economic, aren't part of those described in the OP.

To dump those of us into the same cubby-hole as he portrays is a travesty and approaches incomprehensible. It implies an agenda.....

a reply to: AlienSupernova

Good points. It's definitely a fine balance that has to be struck. We have to maintain a safe collective environment in which the individual can flourish, without the individual pursuits jeopardizing the collective.

The collective is always dependent on the individuals that comprise it. The collective is literally parasitic in nature as it cant exist without individuals.

Whats wrong with mass society today is that the collective is attempting to suppress the individual, by killing or denying the differences between individuals...and a sickness has resulted.

Encourage MORE self sufficient individualism, not less. That would seem to me to be the only way to true sanity on this planet. A more individually themed society with only a loose and casual collective role: i.e let the 'collective' teach others to grow, to produce, to strive, to live and to learn.

Then let the collective get out of the way.

Loose communication, loose interaction. No pop culture, no mass mob mentality, no hive- like mindset.

Libertarian utopia?

Maybe.

It's greed that is the problem. There is a lack of individualism and it is declining. I see people acting more and more like lemmings and simply accepting what the MSM throws at them as worthwhile and factual. Fewer people than ever explore their inner depths and attempt to find their true selves. Introspection is at an all time low.

People look for others to blame instead of seeing if the problem is within themselves. Business management seems to promote people based on their ability to discern what others do wrong and find them at fault. We reward lying and deception - politicians, lawyers, actors - all among the highest paid people.

Individualism is actively discouraged in modern society, "you're weird" is commonly heard of those who do things differently. Social ostracism is often the reward of those who dress, speak or act differently. The herd mentality is at an all-time high. The net result is people failing to try anything new, a loss in creativity and a waste of hidden talents that are never discovered.

a reply to: AlienSupernova

I don't believe it.

Show me proof of that statement.

Yet all the entitled "give me something for nothing" generation do is complain that they dont want to be part of the machine to be successful.

Being successful isn't a bad thing.
Having a career that I have built on my own isn't a bad thing.
I feel exactly no guilt at all in saying that i have focused on a professional target and im very close to achieving that. If you want to call it Individual Extremism then more power to you because it wont slow me down from achieving the goals I have set for myself.

The real world isn't some Middle Earth utopia where everyone grows veggies and smokes herb to pass the time. You either succeed at it or your left asking for handouts.

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: AlienSupernova

I don't believe it.

Show me proof of that statement.

Your belief isnt required honestly

Thats fairly easy, google tech, medical, advancements in the last 100 years and see which countries the largest leaps and bounds have come from

Love Love
AlienSupernova

a reply to: onequestion

In some sense, you're correct. But I think you have to ask, which came first the egg or the chicken. Yea, we got capitalism, but we've got capitalism in a country that for a whole variety of reasons, has lost all sense of community. US Americans are like gypsies moving from one town to the next to make a buck and then move on. Cities are hollowed out, neigborhoods built like temporary base housing for workers who then move on to another enterprise zone. Nobody knows their neighbor, but they keep an eye on them for fear the neighbor will be the one to bust down the door and kill people for their possessions.

All that creates a society where its every man/woman for themselves and the devil take the hindmost. You stop moving and you become a target of opportunity. Once something like this sets in, there's no solution so discussing it is kind of pointless.

a reply to: onequestion

Yes i can agree with your OP.

The level of greed, ignorance, insensitivity, and wanton fear is absolutely absurd these days. Makes me grateful for the people that are genuinely moral.

originally posted by: AlienSupernova

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: AlienSupernova

I don't believe it.

Show me proof of that statement.

Your belief isnt required honestly

Thats fairly easy, google tech, medical, advancements in the last 100 years and see which countries the largest leaps and bounds have come from

Love Love
AlienSupernova

Why present an argument if your not willing to defend it?

originally posted by: HoldMyBeer
a reply to: onequestion

As a lurker I always liked your posts, didn't always agree but I think you do help stretch our minds a bit beyond the obvious MSM topics so prevalent now.

Anyway, I think you are onto something here.

Individualism has indeed run amok. In fact, I think it threatens the very fabric of society. The rights of individuals, no matter how inane, have become more weighty than the success of our collective. That's not to say individual, inalienable rights are not important or even paramount in a free society but we have confused them horribly with privileges and preferences.

No individualism is not supported enough. History has shown us what collectivism has to offer. I'd take crony capitalism over that nightmare any day.

To the point that our society is floundering under the burden of accommodating everyone.
No our country is not floundering.No coups.We have running clean water with plumbing. The US dollar is still has strong purchasing power. Credit systems ok. Shelves are stocked with fresh food.People are able to get loans and mortgages.No power outages. People are still buying and selling. We are in massive debt because of congressional spending,debt ceiling hikes and QE


Now, to the take it one step further, I am going to posit that it all starts with sex. In the sixties sex became a commodity that the individual could trade more freely. The catch is we traded down. We turned away from more traditional, healthy expressions, we traded more loosely, with more people. While it felt great for parents, the children were negatively impacted. Divorce rates went up, families were torn apart. In that scenario, a child will often look to their own needs, further fueling individualism.

We now have generations of that thinking and the sickness of individual extremism, as you put it, amplifies with each one. Add to that pervasive technology and it's massive advance which allows us to have our own individual experience in just about everything from music to television to working and, yes, even sex - and you have given rise to individuals that really don't need anyone. At least in their minds. And when they are occasionally slapped with the harsh reality that they exist within a collective, a society of shared resources and assets and that there are other individuals besides themselves that also matter , the results can be epic and ugly.

and who shares the resources and how much will they allocate? More authoritarian garbage.

How many people over the past 120 years were killed by a collectivist government?

Get out of here with that communism garbage.

You do have some bored trolls that post threads like this on ATS just to see how we react and get a good laugh.

a reply to: TrueBrit

No offense man, but screw that. We need to advance as a society to the point where no one has to work to survive. If people want to "struggle", let them do it by pursuing a "want" instead of their "basic needs", like a struggle to become the best artist, athlete, theoretical physicist, writer, breakdancer, etc.

I honestly can't imagine a truly "advanced" civilization needing 50-70% of its members to do menial labor just for that civilization to survive. That's not advanced at all. But I can imagine a system where 1% work as esteemed engineers that supervise an automated production, mining, and refining system that creates all of the necessities for the rest of us (energy resources, clean water & efficient sewage systems, basic food supply, automated defense forces, etc). That could even be the entire purpose of a government. Then the civilians can focus on want-based occupations, hobbies, or collectives that advance specific purposes, like space colonization or the such.

Either way, I don't believe the "struggle to survive"/"work or die" push is civilized, advanced, or even logical.