"Why do non-Christians come here?" Here's why -

a reply to: TNMockingbird

That is a specific subset of evangelical Christianity.

I went to catholic school and we were never encouraged to evangelicize. In high school we actually spent more time studying comparative religion and were required to attend services of other faiths.

a reply to: Deny Arrogance

Thank you!
I wasn't aware of that (Catholic experience).

My birth Mother was catholic and that is my only experience with that religion, her stories.
I suppose I had preconceived notions about that religion.

a reply to: Deny Arrogance

I went to catholic school and we were never encouraged to evangelicize. In high school we actually spent more time studying comparative religion and were required to attend services of other faiths.

Wonderful!

Fabulous. I'm very glad to hear that.

thanks for posting.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
So, by extrapolation......

if ISIS members are discussing something among themselves about their religion,
then there's no sense in anyone needing to interject their disbelief....
right?.

Presumably "ISIS members" would be discussing the fine points of Islam ,e.g. the relationship between two verses in the Koran.
In that situation, a non-Muslim who had read the book might contribute an opinion on the point, but that would not be the place to start denigrating Mohammed.
Or there might be a thread about whether Mahayana Buddhism was truer to the teachings of Gautama than other kinds of Buddhism, and that would not be the place to question whether Buddhism had any value at all.
Similarly if I write a thread discussing the meaning of a chapter in the epistle of James (and this is a real example), I don't expect someone to come along with an imperious demand that I prove God wrote the Bible.
Both courtesy and the general rules of ATS demand that participants should at least keep within the topic of a thread, and reserve the *Is God real?" questions for the kind of thread where they are relevant.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs
I do like your OP a lot. I have seen this occasionally, but not too often. I do post in this forum occasionally, it is religion and theology, not the Christian Forum.

I do know what you mean though. Even a thread just about Christianity should be open to all to respond. Even to the point where I see people saying 'I don't believe in your fairy tale book'. That is a little harsh, but it could be harsher, as you say...there is no more proof than there is for Santa Claus. I would rather see comments that stay on topic, though. You can be a non-believer or a spiritual person or even an atheist, yet a reader of the Bible and interested in the topics.

I don't know why people would ask why one comes to any thread. The simple answer would be to discuss the topic at hand.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs
Worried leads one to fear.
Fears is what makes the world go round. Sets our way of thinking. Forms our opinions. Stops us form going forward as a species. Man became his own worst enemy when he/she learned how to use fear as a weapon.

I've noticed that I talk about religion, or address particular posts that are religious for three reasons (Generally):

1) because I'm honestly curious about a particular fact within someone's religion

2) I wonder how a person can believe in a particular part, or all of their religion when seemingly logical fallacies within their religion are intrinsic to it

3) (and by far the most common) a religious person makes a claim about something based on a false premise or misunderstanding of the topic at hand (and so I provide them information that shows how their information is inaccurate)

So, why can't I ask about your religion in general?

Why can't I see something that seems illogical and ask how you've overcome that trait?

Why can't I correct a person who is using incorrect information in an argument?

I would expect anyone and everyone to act the same way towards everything I think about or believe in. To go through life without asking a humble question or simply ignoring someone when they are in a position of fallacy isn't living, it's just being a shell of a person with blinders on, ready to work, sleep, eat, repeat and die.

a reply to: DISRAELI

If one had a thread discussing aliens and they used a bogus video as part of their discussion, the validity of said video is paramount. Would it be fair to dismiss someone pointing out the bad video? The same can apply to any religious discussion. The credibility of the source material is always part of the discussion or its not an intelligent discussion.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

I am a Christian and understand why you join Christian threads and I am glad you do. What you might not understand is why some Christians look forward to discussing their faith with nonbelievers .........it is due to love. We are commanded to love our neighbor and that includes everyone.

If you reject my message OK.....I got it.....BUT some people change their mind. Have you ever changed your mind after making a decision? We all have and if you do there will be someone standing by to welcome you into a new family

Is it possible my faith is wrong? IMO no but possible that I am wrong with some biblical interpretations due to poor or incorrect translation but again it is my hope that nonbelievers will one day see that God is alive and well and waiting on you.

originally posted by: TNMockingbird
a reply to: Deny Arrogance

Thank you!
I wasn't aware of that (Catholic experience).

My birth Mother was catholic and that is my only experience with that religion, her stories.
I suppose I had preconceived notions about that religion.

I went to Catholic school for 9th grade. My mother and brother and I had moved back from California where I had attended private school. Money was a little tighter, and it is often believed that a Catholic school, where one pays tuition is better than a public school education. There was 1 class per day about religion, the rest were all normal subjects. I do remember them teaching the basics of other religions.

As a side note, and I hope this is not too OT-
it became weird, at points, though. The Afro-American History Class teacher ( a NY state mandated class at the time), who was a nun, would complain we had been too loud in Friday mass. We had mass only once a week-friday morning for about an hour. She was upset because our interruptions interfered with 'her time with her husband' and she would hold her 'wedding ring' as she admonished us.

I took a small job 1.5 hours 3x a week to help cover my tuition there. It was cleaning the chapel. In the choir 2nd level, I found wooden chests containing wedding dresses. They were not for general weddings, they were for ceremonies where nuns would marry God.

I did eventually convince my mother to let me go to public school. Those odd things were only part of the reason. But I clearly remember them to be odd.

a reply to: DeathSlayer

What you might not understand is why some Christians look forward to discussing their faith with nonbelievers .........it is due to love.

That's fine. But I am addressing the 'some Christians' who get pissed off when nonbelievers participate and/or comment on threads regarding their version of "Christianity."

We are commanded to love our neighbor and that includes everyone.

I understand that is your motive. And I commend that you endeavor to do so......
YOU are not the object of this thread, then - if you 'welcome' non-believers (for whatever reason), then good for you!!

I am addressing, rather, the "Christians" who get incensed (disturbed and kerfuffled and pissed off) that 'non-Christians' would have the audacity to participate in "their" threads.....

fact is, not all of the world believes the things that "American Christians" believe.

I have no objection to reaching out on behalf of love. I do that, too - in my own way......to encourage others to accept whatever others believe as long as that other is harming no one else.
I just hope you all understand that those of us who are not "Christian" (by your definition) are indeed perfectly aware of the 'bottom line' that Jesus taught. The Golden Rule.
Treat others the way you'd like to be treated.

You "Christians" don't have a monopoly on truth, or forgiveness....
and (I pray) you will desist in trying to make the entire population of the US of A believe what you do.

originally posted by: Ghost147
I've noticed that I talk about religion, or address particular posts that are religious for three reasons (Generally):

1) because I'm honestly curious about a particular fact within someone's religion

2) I wonder how a person can believe in a particular part, or all of their religion when seemingly logical fallacies within their religion are intrinsic to it

3) (and by far the most common) a religious person makes a claim about something based on a false premise or misunderstanding of the topic at hand (and so I provide them information that shows how their information is inaccurate)

So, why can't I ask about your religion in general?

Why can't I see something that seems illogical and ask how you've overcome that trait?

Why can't I correct a person who is using incorrect information in an argument?

I would expect anyone and everyone to act the same way towards everything I think about or believe in. To go through life without asking a humble question or simply ignoring someone when they are in a position of fallacy isn't living, it's just being a shell of a person with blinders on, ready to work, sleep, eat, repeat and die.

Exactly! Those are my reasons, generally. I do have some spiritual christian-based belief and I participate in those discussions as well. But mainly for the reasons you noted. I studied the bible in college and these threads grab my attention. It is one of the greatest books ever written.

a reply to: ApparentlyStupid
In a previous post, I mentioned a thread on the subject, wriiten by a Mod and made sticky in this forum.
As a comparatively new member, you may not have seen it, so I attach a link;
Moving past Religion 101 and staying on-topic
My point is that discussions may be started within the parameters of a belief system, and as dbates observes, they should be allowed to continue on that basis. They should not be derailed by challenges to the belief system itself.

Similarly, if people are discussing a political issue, they don't expect to be interrupted by someone questioning whether the physical universe is real or an illusion. For the moment, they want to be able to take that point for granted and get on with discussing a particular detail about life in the physical universe.
That's what I mean by conducting a discussion within the parameters of a belief system.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: DeathSlayer

What you might not understand is why some Christians look forward to discussing their faith with nonbelievers .........it is due to love. We are commanded to love our neighbor and that includes everyone.

I understand that is your motive.

I am addressing, rather, the "Christians" who get incensed (disturbed and kerfuffled and pissed off) that 'non-Christians' would have the audacity to participate in "their" threads.....

fact is, not all of the world believes the things that "American Christians" believe.

I have no objection to reaching out on behalf of love.
I just hope you all understand that those of us who are not "Christian" in your book are indeed perfectly aware of the 'bottom line' that Jesus taught.

You don't have a monopoly on truth.

I admit I use to be one of those impatient zealous Christians you speak of but after awhile I realized I was going about it all wrong! Where was my patience, where was my understanding and respect for others, where was the love? Instead of bringing souls to God's family I was pushing them away and it was my fault. I wish I could go back in time and change things but that is not possible.

Even Christians make mistakes........ can you believe it?

Travelling the boards, Ive noticed that various atheists seem to be disgruntled former xtians who were fed christianity by fundie parents... Now that theyve liberated themselves, they feel the need (or just for funsies) to try and talk sense (or belittle) into those silly Christians who still hold faith.

originally posted by: ApparentlyStupid
a reply to: DISRAELI

If one had a thread discussing aliens and they used a bogus video as part of their discussion, the validity of said video is paramount. Would it be fair to dismiss someone pointing out the bad video? The same can apply to any religious discussion. The credibility of the source material is always part of the discussion or its not an intelligent discussion.

NO, no. A video about, say a UFO from a source already known to be bogus is not the same as discussing religious ideas. Once in the religion and theology forum, the bible or the Quran or any number of other religious books BECOME the source material. Almost none of them have been debunked, as far as I know, nor do they come from spamming youtubers.

a reply to: DISRAELI

(Read the op in your link) Fair enough, I tend to stay out of those threads. This one however is specifically regarding the topic of why non believers want in on the conversations. Questioning the credibility of the source materials is part of the answer IMO. Do you disagree?

originally posted by: Tucket
Travelling the boards, Ive noticed that various atheists seem to be disgruntled former xtians who were fed christianity by fundie parents... Now that theyve liberated themselves, they feel the need (or just for funsies) to try and talk sense (or belittle) into those silly Christians who still hold faith.

I don't see that. I have yet to see 'disgruntled' atheists of any kind. I think that this aggressive atheist THING has been made up by right wing media.

I, as a non-Christian, frequent these boards because I see religion in general (not just Christianity) as a conspiracy and control mechanism. What better place to voice my opinion on that conspiracy than a conspiracy website?

I think the better question would be: "Why do Christians visit a conspiracy website then get offended when people call their belief system a conspiracy?"