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posted on Jan, 3 2016 @ 02:51 AM

originally posted by: SkepticOverlord
a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

Why is it necessary to categorize people? That's a form of passive aggressive personal attack.

That's a form of human interaction, we talk with much more than just words.
Get rid of stars, flags, karma, avatars - all of it.

You are criticizing people for categorizing each other, while we're on a board where categorizing is more present than any other board I've ever seen on the inernet.

Edit: This is just a suggestion, I personally don't post in the 9/11 forum because of the chaos that exists.
edit on 3-1-2016 by Danowski because: (no reason given)

posted on Jan, 3 2016 @ 03:37 AM
I dont understand, I see much worse on ATS regularly.

OS is not an insult. Why is it taken that way?

Im confused.

Manners are essential, ever seen an NLBS video? They can be insulting to those who believe in certain conspiracies (on a conspiracy site too). Much worse than some of these threads.

posted on Jan, 3 2016 @ 03:46 AM
a reply to: SkepticOverlord

I dont understand, Athiest, Christian, conspiracy theorist, truther, OS'er....what is wrong with categorizing people, there are not insults they are just words used to describe certain mind sets. Why would these be taken as insults when used in a respectful manner. I dont usually use the word 'truther' and never even heard the phrase 'os'er', I have never been offended by 'truther' though. Its just a term some choose to use and it can be used respectfully. Maybe its just a cultural thing. PC is big in the US, more so than anyother country, so as ATS is based there it isnt too surprising we see this here.

I have never posted in the 911 forum but this seems strange. NLBS does it!!!!!!!! That has used real derogatory terms to describe certain believers in conspiracy theories. On a conspiracy website too.

Ever been in the religion forums and seen how the threads are derailed by people who just disagree with religion?

Its just that I see much worse on ATS when no action has ever been taken. Why the 911 forum?????????? I understand if people are being immature and insulting but I fail to understand these terms themselves as being insulting. This could be a conspiracy of some kind in itself.
Anything to do with the current scyscraper fire???? I am half joking but it still crossed my mind.

Surely this has to apply to everyone. Including NLBS.

Anyway ATS, you are the experts, do what you think is best.

edit on 3-1-2016 by brancolinoxx because: (no reason given)

edit on 3-1-2016 by brancolinoxx because: (no reason given)

posted on Jan, 3 2016 @ 04:21 AM

Trolling: The repeated posting of content that supports any specific position, without interacting with members regarding that position will be considered Trolling in the 9/11 Forum. Depending on the severity, you may experience an immediate account termination with no warning.


posted on Jan, 3 2016 @ 04:34 AM
Guys, holy #. What is so hard about discussing a topic without having to label the people you are engaged with?

What you are saying is you have no desire for a genuine discussion and are hell bent on debating in a them vs us mindset. That was not the intended purpose as clearly outlined by the websites owner. Ball not player right?

Like talking to a wall.....

ATS is trying to make it a better experience (hopefully) for us all and everyone seems mad because you don't want to share a star on your belly. *sigh*
edit on 3-1-2016 by Rosinitiate because: (no reason given)

posted on Jan, 3 2016 @ 05:57 AM

originally posted by: Grimpachi
a reply to: Swills

IMO you shouldn't get your hopes up. Did you see the other thread? If people had just calmed down and agreed that calling others names is not what we should be doing on here the threads probably would have been reopened.

Instead from what I read there were a few insisting that they should be able to call people names because they were certain they were correct. I have seen children more understanding. That is not the way to start off a new year.

If People? the majority were in agreement in my opinion

There were a few! exactly, a few ..... less than 2 responders making the same statement over and over but sticking to T&C's

I'll quote Mr Pointy Ears here ........ the needs of the one outweigh the needs of the many

In conclusion, one / few people have caused this forum to be closed, i hope they are proud


posted on Jan, 3 2016 @ 06:30 AM

originally posted by: brancolinoxx
I dont understand, Athiest, Christian, conspiracy theorist, truther, OS'er....what is wrong with categorizing people,

ATS is not youtube or twitter. I used to lurk the boards for years before registering and what I noticed was the decline in the quality of posters the more new members arrived because of the youtube/twitter generation.

We are here to debate information.

I subscribe to the view of thousands of professional architects, engineers, airplane pilots, and firefighters who have their own official websites and who have come up with information that needs to be investigated over the past decade.

Now these people are not “conspiracy theorists”, mostly they have just debunked the official narrative or come up with evidence that goes against the official narrative.

When I have offered my view in the 9/11 forum. I have immediately been put into the category of “truther” or “conspiracy theorist”. I would admit that I am a "truther" in the sense that do not believe in the official narrative. However there are "truthers" who believe in the irrational. This is used by posters in the forum who take a contrary position and who categorize me and associate my views with the absurd.

For example, I believe the only explanation for Building 7 collapsing is because of controlled demolition. However it’s quite easy for another poster (and they did do) to write “You truthers who believe in Building 7 collapsing and space rays from outer space”.

My rational point of view was used to be associated with the irrational because I was categorized with the same people who hold irrational views. This tactic has been used time and time again.

Categorizing is wrong, but especially when talking about the 9/11 subject because people hold a wide range of views and so it's also pointless.

What happens then is that threads are derailed and the information is not being debated. Information is absolute key and I welcome this stance from ATS.

posted on Jan, 3 2016 @ 06:52 AM
I can see what the mods are attempting to do but I really do not think it will have the desired effect. Banning the use of words because they cause offence has never worked. It isn't the words, it's the ideas behind them that are offensive and those can't be stopped.

For example- do you remember The Spastic Society? I'm guessing many younger people (am I allowed to categorise them as "younger"?) probably wont. You see Spastic was the correct, appropriate term for certain disabilities. I think, iirc, it was Cerebral Palsy. Before long, Spastic had become a pejorative term, so we were discouraged from using it as it made the sufferers feel bad. Well we don't use that word any more and yet many people still mock the disabled. We just use new words.

My point being, if you ban the use of certain terms then new ones will just appear to serve the same purpose. If you decide that OSer is a pejorative term then people will just say "believers of the official story" which will become "BOTOS" and there you have it - the new pejorative.

I applaud the attempt but have little hope for its success.

posted on Jan, 3 2016 @ 07:57 AM
It's a shame it has gotten to this point. We should be able to rationally debate things without name calling.

If you are going to ban the use of terms like OS'er (which I think is rather silly) then please also ban the use of "conspiracy theorist" which is also used by "defenders of the official story" (man that is a lot to type) to demean "truthers".

posted on Jan, 3 2016 @ 08:16 AM
We have 27 Super Moderators, 23 Moderators, and the rest are owners/admin (out of 57 staff members).

In the past 24 hours there have been 3,539 posts made. There have also been 37 new accounts made in those same 24 hours.

Moderators are assigned various forums. There are 104 different forums that are public (there are some only staff can see). Out of that 104 there are 19 that I'm "assigned" to.

However, we are volunteers here (no, stop, don't ask where to volunteer. Anyone asking to be a mod will never be made one). We do this on our own free time. We are not paid and help out when we can.

We have not set schedule to moderate. SO and Springer do not post a schedule as to when I'm suppose to be here. I'm here when I can be, and that is how it is for all of us on staff.

We are members first, staff second. That means we get to do what we've always done here at ATS: Read threads, make threads, post comments and enjoy being here. That's part of the deal of becoming staff. When I was asked to join, that was one of the first things I asked about. I didn't want to no longer be able to make threads and enjoy being a member here.

Moderating is hard work. I've been one before at other forums. ATS is nothing like those places as far as how the staff works.
We mostly do things by consensus. One of you uses the Alert button to complain about a post or thread. Those of us that happen to be on can see that, and we talk about it first before we do any action.

Sometimes it's a no-brainer deal. One member called another member a "#$%^&*", well that's pretty clear, cut and dry. We remove that post.

Sometimes it's a grey area. Someone is claiming some thng is a hoax, or it's a political complaint (and we're just as polarized back here in staff as you all are on the boards. We have Left leaning, Right leaning, and Don't Give A Fly Snip leaning back here. But I promise you, we always try to set those beliefs aside when discussing a complaint.

We look at our Terms and Conditions. That is our "bible" back here. We always use those, and any other standing policies made by the ATS owners, to determine if something needs to be removed, or action against a member is needed.

Majority rules. We vote on it. If majority says a post needs to go, it goes. If majority says a thread stays where it is, it stays. I majority agrees that a member needs to be banned, they get banned.

We also talk about ourselves back here: Are we being too iron fisted in our modding? Am I being too biased about something? Do you guys think I'm being a jerk about this?

We constantly ask ourselves these questions and ask our fellow staff members for their opinions on our actions.

We are not the blood thirsty people that some here think we are.

Would you like to know what the first thing I was assigned to do when I first came back here a year and 2 months ago?

The first thing I was asked to do wasn't to go find posts to remove. It wasn't to go find threads to trash. It wasn't to go find people to ban.

The first thing I was asked to do was go out there and give members applause. I was asked to go out and applaud posts and threads.

Which I did with joy. It was wonderful to finally be able to give people applause for well thought out threads and well made posts.

And not just because I agreed with their opinion either. I applaud those that I completely disagree with!


Because of the effort and thought they put into making a thread. Because they were debating in a good manner. Because they were not calling other people names or acting like a damn troll and because they were debating the subject and not posting about each other!

9/11 is one of my "assigned" forums. I never posted there before I was made staff. Avoided it like the plague.

What is the problem with the 9/11 forum? Is it because Staff believes the OS? Is it because Staff is into the conspiracy ideas of it?

No. I can tell you right now we are mixed bunch when it comes to 9/11. So no: owners and staff do not have some agenda in pushing the OS or conspiracy theories on it.

Anyone thinking that is barking up the wrong tree.

This is the problem with that forum: You all just can not seem to debate 9/11 things without calling each other names. Insulting each other. Talking about each other. Trolling each other.

That's the damn problem. It takes up more and more of our time. And we already spend a lot of time trying to take care of other parts of ATS. There are other alerts from other forums. We have to deal with members that are being problematic (IE they are on post ban, trying to circumnavigate it, or are a returnee that is no longer welcome on ATS, etc).

So add more staff, right?


First, yah, I'd LOVE to have more of you back here. I would give ANYTHING in the world to jerk some of you back here, especially those that go on and on and on about how we are out to get you, that we have an agenda, or the many, many other crap things you all accuse us of, so that you'd have your eye's jerked wide open to see what it's really like back here.
It would be great to do that. It would be great to watch as your eyes widen and you go: "OMG! So that's why so and so was banned! I understand now!"
And then also have you guys go through the abuse that we have to endure.
You know, let you remove a post and then get a PM calling you all sorts of names in the book, tell you to go SNIP yourself, etc.

Or even better: telling you how to do your job, or why you and the TCs are wrong. would be great, and most of you would quickly change your tune and attitude.

However, adding more staff is not going to fix the 9/11 forum (or any part of ATS).

You.....all of you are what needs to be fixed: You need to stop talking about each other, stop calling each other names.

If you all did that.........then there is no need to add more and more staff.

That's all each of you need to do. Stop talking about each other. Talk about the subject. Stop calling each other names (seriously people, this isn't grade school).

If everyone one of you stopped doing that? Hell, we could actually cut staff.

posted on Jan, 3 2016 @ 08:45 AM
Glad to hear this has been done, I've been on ATS for a loooooooong time and I'm generally a nice friendly guy who says his piece and then goes without dropping to name calling, I was always told as a kid that people who insults others do so because they don't have the intelligence to talk properly. I have lots of interests, political, UFO, conspiracies but the only forum I stopped going to was the 9-11 one, from the get go the attitudes were awful, it was like a queue of people just posting so to insult you rather than have a valid USEFUL discussion SO its good to see Skeptic Overlord has drawn the line but I fear people will revert to type.

Good luck S.O. and greetings to everyone..

posted on Jan, 3 2016 @ 09:03 AM
a reply to: eriktheawful

Very well put Erik and I would give you applause if I could. I think the biggest problem when it comes to any forums in any site is we are dealing with age and culture along with the anonymous nature. Get banned? Not many care. They will just go somewhere else and pull the same crap.

I think that it is easy to determine though who the trouble makers are and nip them in the bud. If anything, from what I have seen ATS has allowed much crap to continue when it was obviously going down the wrong road. I think you guys have done a masterful job of doing your best to allow debate to happen and removing post that are offensive as quickly as you can.

Unfortunately, members or guest do not have a clue what was being censured once it happens, they just see the little notes, so they really do not understand what was removed. I think everyone is a bit sensitive about 9/11 and because of the way the government handled the outcome they are leery of being shutdown elsewhere even 15 years later.

There are many that were very young and have only learned the bulk of what transpired from newly minted history books that probably do not have much truth to them, so they look for other information to wrap their heads around. ATS should be proud of what they have accomplished and all the moderators and owners should just take a deep breath and allow themselves to enjoy what they have created.

I applaud you all.

posted on Jan, 3 2016 @ 09:12 AM
So did ATS staff ever check the validity of shill accusations? It is one thing to fight the symptoms of a problem, it is another to actually tackle the problem.

This is a difficult issue. You are right, people should just refrain from discussing and labeling each other, but on the other hand, how are such things not bound to happen when you have these posters that are clearly devoted to debunking 911 conspiracy, exclusively.

Or should members just ignore this?

Maybe you should make the 911 forum off limits to people that only ever post there. It's not natural.

Easy to work around that I know, just making a point here.

posted on Jan, 3 2016 @ 09:18 AM

originally posted by: HardBoiled

So did ATS staff ever check the validity of shill accusations?

How exactly can you accomplish something like that? As someone who as been frequently labeled with that tag I am very curious.

posted on Jan, 3 2016 @ 09:46 AM
a reply to: baglady333

Thank you.

Nip the "trouble makers".

Well....we do. But the story doesn't end there.

You see, it's against ATS TCs for me to discuss banned members, why they were banned, etc. Not because we have secrets to hide, but because of our golden rule:

You do not talk about other members. Period. Even banned ones.

But we're all about 2nd chances.....and 3rd chances....4ths, 5ths........yah, that was a real eye opener for me when I came back here.

We have a LOT of members here on ATS that have been banned......and we've allowed back.

We're all about 2nd chances.

Sometimes it works. Person that was banned comes back and they are fine.

Some times it doesn't work....oh they might be good to go for a while, but then they slip back into the behavior that got them banned in the first place.

However, more important: we discuss before we ban.

I can't go into details, but I will tell all of you this: We do defend you guys too. Not everyone get's banned who was brought up for discussion.

We really do hate to ban people.

We know that sometimes y'all are having a bad day and just taking it out on others. We know that sometimes y'all may of had just a little bit too much to drink and started drunk posting. We also know that sometimes you may have been provoked by another member.

We know these things. We look at them. We take then into consideration.

So sometimes you just get a "time out" for a while. Many times y'all come back with a message letting us know that you were having a bad day and sincerely apologize for it. Those people? They get just that slap on the wrist, and we move on. Everything is okay.

Others? Holy crap.

Do you have any idea what it is like to sit here and defend someone, and advocate for them not to be banned, only to have them tell you to go SNIP yourself?

Not much I can do after that.

But we still try. We don't give up. We get accused of playing "favorites" and that's is complete bunk. We don't play favorites. I've personally defended members who I dislike, think are full of BS, and can not stand debating them.

Yet if I think they've not broken a rule, or that their post/thread should stay, I will side with them in our discussions back here.

There have been plenty of posts that I have removed, Threads I have trashed, or even voted to ban certain members that I really liked and enjoy their posts.

Why? Because they broke the rules. That's why. No favoritism is back here. Every action we take is logged in one way or another. We know when a staff member has done something like that.

I really wish that there was a way to have an "Open House" day so that all of you can actually see what goes on back here and how we work. It would be a real eye opener for those that make the hilarious claims that we play favorites or have agendas.

posted on Jan, 3 2016 @ 09:48 AM
a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

Check to see where the IP's are coming from, and check if multiple posters are using the same or similar IP adresess.

This off course could also be bypassed, but as staff this is the first thing I would check. Simple enough.

posted on Jan, 3 2016 @ 09:50 AM

originally posted by: eriktheawful
I really wish that there was a way to have an "Open House" day so that all of you can actually see what goes on back here and how we work. It would be a real eye opener for those that make the hilarious claims that we play favorites or have agendas.

Reminds me of the adage about how sausage is made.

posted on Jan, 3 2016 @ 09:51 AM

originally posted by: HardBoiled

Check to see where the IP's are coming from, and check if multiple posters are using the same or similar IP adresess.

This off course could also be bypassed, but as staff this is the first thing I would check. Simple enough.

I think the better idea would not to be calling people names as the moderators suggested.

posted on Jan, 3 2016 @ 09:55 AM
a reply to: SkepticOverlord

If I had my wish, you would apply strict T&C rules to all of ATS. It might just become a little closer to the place for intelligent discussion and fun that it once was. I don't have any hope that time will turn backward, nor do I want it to, but I am not a member of Twitter, Facebook or any other social media for a reason... I would love to have a good reason to be an active member here again. And the one difference between all the others and ATS is the T&Cs and the implementation thereof.

posted on Jan, 3 2016 @ 10:00 AM
a reply to: Swills

This is what Bill said in the OP:

Beginning shortly, the forum will reopen. However, no new threads will be allowed. If you have an issue to discuss, please choose from the 9,204 existing threads, and contribute your new information.

(Bolding mine) (Note: the forum is now re-opened for replies to existing threads.)

With over 9,000 threads available, any "new information" worthy of its own thread would have to be pretty major and not just some wrinkle on something that's already been covered ad nauseum.

If that situation ever arises, there's always the option of using "Contact Us" to get the attention of all the site's owners.

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