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Let's talk about Muslims and Republicans.

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posted on Dec, 21 2015 @ 10:01 AM
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If I could publish a cartoon of Muhammed without fearing for my life I'd agree with you.




posted on Dec, 21 2015 @ 10:48 AM
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a reply to: LesMisanthrope

Here's the thing, why do you even care about the Prophet Muhammad? You're not a Muslim. And why does it matter if you can or can't publish a picture of him without consequences? Western countries have all kinds of laws preventing people from publishing images of people, with the threat of consequences for offenders. Isn't that the whole point in having to get legal permission before you can publish someone's image or likeness?

But that's the thing, people in the West can and do publish pictures of him. Or did you already forget the response from the Charlie Hebdo shootings? So what are you complaining about?

To me, it sounds like you just want to publish pictures of him to provoke Muslims. Most Muslims will just ignore it because your purpose would be obvious. But others will get angry, which is understandable. If I publish a sensitive picture of someone's loved one without their permission, they'd probably get pissed too.



posted on Dec, 21 2015 @ 11:14 AM
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a reply to: enlightenedservant




Here's the thing, why do you even care about the Prophet Muhammad? You're not a Muslim. And why does it matter if you can or can't publish a picture of him without consequences? Western countries have all kinds of laws preventing people from publishing images of people, with the threat of consequences for offenders. Isn't that the whole point in having to get legal permission before you can publish someone's image or likeness?

But that's the thing, people in the West can and do publish pictures of him. Or did you already forget the response from the Charlie Hebdo shootings? So what are you complaining about?

To me, it sounds like you just want to publish pictures of him to provoke Muslims. Most Muslims will just ignore it because your purpose would be obvious. But others will get angry, which is understandable. If I publish a sensitive picture of someone's loved one without their permission, they'd probably get pissed too.



And so what if I do? I can draw whatever the hell I want, and I should be able to draw a cartoon without fearing for my life. To take a cartoon as a provocation to murder or violence is fundamentally absurd, and goes against everything western society stands for. Do you accept that?



posted on Dec, 21 2015 @ 11:17 AM
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My point is - Christianity breeds bigoted assholes in the same way Muslim breeds terrorists - it's the person doing the interpreting, not the religion itself. We should point fingers at extreme people, and not use a broad brush - not against any group of people.


Anyone can be an asshole. They do not need religion. The issue, also, is still lost on many and I can see where emotions run high. No one called to deport ALL Muslims. No one called to BAN all Muslims. You can find a soundbite here or a soundbite there but when it comes down to it, when polled, 65% of American citizens want to pause immigration so we can figure it out and make the country safe for everyone, including non-radicalized Muslims. There have been calls from the US Islamic community to pause. It is the smart thing to do, again, the protect all of us.

That said, Islam is not just a religion but an ideology. If you are a true believer you cannot pick and choose. It is not allowed according to the religion itself. I know plenty of Catholics who do not attend mass regularly. I have Jewish Friends who do not go to temple except when parents are in town. I have Muslim friends who eat pork. There are all kinds of people and they may identify with something but they are not zealots. There is no need to fear someone based on how they look. But the zealots, those are the ones that we should be concerned with however with organizations like CAIR protecting them as well as the leaders of some mosques not reporting suspected activity it can take a toll on anyone who is an innocent.

The SB shooting showed that to push their twisted ideology they will kill anyone, even a fellow Muslim.

Don't believe the MSM hype....educate yourself and if you are not Muslim, visit a local imam and talk to him. If you are Muslim, stop in and talk to a priest. You would be surprised to know all priests do not rape little boys and all imams are not strapped with C4.

But do not be naive to the real world, no matter what you follow. It was not 20 Amish men who pulled off 9/11....


edit on 12am31amf0000002015-12-21T11:17:54-06:001154 by matafuchs because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 21 2015 @ 12:08 PM
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a reply to: spirit_horse

Yeah, I actually used to be a little bit on the other side of this situation, but then I got educated.

Question to everyone - When a person takes a citizenship test, do you think the question " Do you pledge to follow the constitution of the united states, and the laws within this country, even in contradiction to any other belief system you may have? "

I realize the exact way I wrote it may not be preferred - But personally, I don't think it would be crazy to at least have it on record that immigrants agree to follow our laws and constitution.



posted on Dec, 21 2015 @ 12:15 PM
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a reply to: LesMisanthrope

I agree that you should be able to draw said cartoon without worrying about major forms of retaliation...

On the other hand, why are you so insistent on always posting about putting your hand in a snakes cage? I read your thread "The right to offend" or something along those lines, and it seems you almost SEEK this type of behavior, that you encourage people thinking " This is going to be offensive, sweet I should do it! " Rather than just advocating freedom for all, true freedom of speech, and such, it seems you advocate "going against the grain"

Character, respect, honesty, altruism, honor.. These words mean something to some people, and while they might have small variances on what exactly these mean, and different people will define people in different ways, why do you advocate for the "Right" to offend? Why does it specifically need to be defined, respected, seen as something we can do? We all know jerks exist that aren't in jail, we all know we can say and do what we want excluding things like harm.... So why do we specifically need to further the cause of being able to offend others?

Someone feel free to expand on my thoughts, I'm not always as eloquent as some others are.



posted on Dec, 21 2015 @ 12:21 PM
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a reply to: deadlyhope

Actually there is no reason to not ask it as it is already part of the law for immigrants.



posted on Dec, 21 2015 @ 12:21 PM
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a reply to: deadlyhope




I agree that you should be able to draw said cartoon without worrying about major forms of retaliation...


I'm glad we agree. Anything else is antithetical to western values.



posted on Dec, 21 2015 @ 12:22 PM
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a reply to: matafuchs

I've seen the word "muslim" in a lot of posts

I am against Islam/Sharia law immigrants myself

I am not against 1.6 billion people

cheers!



posted on Dec, 21 2015 @ 12:22 PM
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a reply to: matafuchs

Oh, okay, thank you. I didn't realize.



posted on Dec, 21 2015 @ 12:44 PM
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a reply to: LesMisanthrope

You can draw whatever the hell you want. No muslim country has ever declared war over offensive pictures of Mohammed. Nobody gets charges pressed for offensive pictures of Mohammed. Crazies might take a shot if they come across you, but that is an individual action, not an official one.

Here in America, if you tag Blood grafitti in a Crip area, you will likely meet the same fate as Hebdo.

In conclusion, you can draw whatever the hell you want, but crazies might do something about it. Crazies who ought to be punished.

If i post a picture all across the world of your mom sucking eight d!cks, would you be pissed?
(I apologize if that offends you, its simply for the purpose of analogy)
edit on 12212015 by MayanBoricua because: I felt like it.



posted on Dec, 21 2015 @ 12:52 PM
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a reply to: MayanBoricua



You can draw whatever the hell you want. No muslim country has ever declared war over offensive pictures of Mohammed. Nobody gets charges pressed for offensive pictures of Mohammed. Crazies might take a shot if they come across you, but that is an individual action, not an official one.

Here in America, if you tag Blood grafitti in a Crip area, you will likely meet the same fate as Hebdo.

In conclusion, you can draw whatever the hell you want, but crazies might do something about it. Crazies who ought to be punished.


Name one other religion that does that when their godhead is caricatured. If you must compare a religion to the bloods and crips, what does that say?



posted on Dec, 21 2015 @ 12:59 PM
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Wow...this escalated quickly...Crips...Bloods...8 dicks? I fell out of my chair on that one.....



posted on Dec, 21 2015 @ 01:05 PM
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a reply to: LesMisanthrope

Christianity, fool. It has a long and bloody history. Crusades? Inquisition? Witch trials?
Many of the violent things written in the Quran also be found in the Bible. Lets not forget they are both branches of the same tree.
Puritans also liked hijabs and putting women on a short leash.

And Islam is not monolithic. Like christianity, it comes in many flavors. Terrorism comes from the wahabi brach started in Arabia with the help of MI6 at the start of the century. Yet they are our allies.
Lets not paint an entire religion with a wide brush.
Thats like calling all Christianity a cult because of David Koresh's electric koolaid.
Like calling all gun owners mass shooters.
You cant condemn the whole based on the actions of a few.
Either that, or you should have your guns confiscated and be jailed because of the batman shooter.



posted on Dec, 21 2015 @ 01:13 PM
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a reply to: MayanBoricua




Christianity, fool. It has a long and bloody history. Crusades? Inquisition? Witch trials?
Many of the violent things written in the Quran also be found in the Bible. Lets not forget they are both branches of the same tree.
Puritans also liked hijabs and putting women on a short leash.

And Islam is not monolithic. Like christianity, it comes in many flavors. Terrorism comes from the wahabi brach started in Arabia with the help of MI6 at the start of the century. Yet they are our allies.
Lets not paint an entire religion with a wide brush.
Thats like calling all Christianity a cult because of David Koresh's electric koolaid.
Like calling all gun owners mass shooters.
You cant condemn the whole based on the actions of a few.
Either that, or you should have your guns confiscated and be jailed because of the batman shooter.


Name one recent case of that occurring. If you want to argue the distant past, be my guest, but even a fool knows the distant past is not the present.



posted on Dec, 21 2015 @ 01:18 PM
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a reply to: deadlyhope

No its not all about religion, but it is a big cultural difference. We have Syrian immigrants coming from a vastly different environment where women are second class citizens and are property of their father or husband. How do you assimilate a twenty something male to a culture of equality and where a woman or young adult wears short skirts and tight tops? How do you think they would react if not properly taught or even if they are able to be taught to obey our way of life? If they ever were exposed to that, you can bet it was in a very derogatory way. I'm sure a lot of the Sharia areas are to control this type of extreme cultural clash which either gets out of hand as well as pee's off the community by restricting who let enter their part of the city.
edit on 12/21/2015 by itsallmaya because: grammar



posted on Dec, 21 2015 @ 01:35 PM
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Ain't Muslims and Republicans one in the same ?

A bunch of right wingers thumping their bibles/korans, and clinging to their guns, and religion.

That don't think too much of women rights, and gay rights, and abortion.



posted on Dec, 21 2015 @ 05:56 PM
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originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: enlightenedservant




Here's the thing, why do you even care about the Prophet Muhammad? You're not a Muslim. And why does it matter if you can or can't publish a picture of him without consequences? Western countries have all kinds of laws preventing people from publishing images of people, with the threat of consequences for offenders. Isn't that the whole point in having to get legal permission before you can publish someone's image or likeness?

But that's the thing, people in the West can and do publish pictures of him. Or did you already forget the response from the Charlie Hebdo shootings? So what are you complaining about?

To me, it sounds like you just want to publish pictures of him to provoke Muslims. Most Muslims will just ignore it because your purpose would be obvious. But others will get angry, which is understandable. If I publish a sensitive picture of someone's loved one without their permission, they'd probably get pissed too.



And so what if I do? I can draw whatever the hell I want, and I should be able to draw a cartoon without fearing for my life. To take a cartoon as a provocation to murder or violence is fundamentally absurd, and goes against everything western society stands for. Do you accept that?


LOL So you completely ignore the fact that this same Western society can & will penalize you for publishing unauthorized images of people? And this same Western society will even imprison you for publishing unauthorized "revenge porn" pictures of someone. And this same western society will even arrest you for posting "anti-Semitic" images, as well (edit: depending on the country). But those don't count?

Besides, the first person killed in the Charlie Hebdo shooting was a MUSLIM security guard. As in, a Muslim was assigned to PROTECT the same business that was publishing images of the Prophet Muhammad. And that same Muslim died trying to convince the shooters not to go through with their crime. But none of that matters either, huh?

edit on 21-12-2015 by enlightenedservant because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 21 2015 @ 09:54 PM
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originally posted by: Raggedyman
I have noted that atheists can be quite contemptible as well

Its not a religious thing, it all people across the spectrum, its this us them mentality
Everybody who disagrees with someone has to treat them as an enemy

Even sporting events

It IS a religious thing!
No one deliberately harms another unless he is host to some strain of 'belief' (religion) or other!



posted on Dec, 21 2015 @ 10:00 PM
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originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: MayanBoricua


Christianity, fool. It has a long and bloody history. Crusades? Inquisition? Witch trials?
Many of the violent things written in the Quran also be found in the Bible. Lets not forget they are both branches of the same tree.
Puritans also liked hijabs and putting women on a short leash.

And Islam is not monolithic. Like christianity, it comes in many flavors. Terrorism comes from the wahabi brach started in Arabia with the help of MI6 at the start of the century. Yet they are our allies.
Lets not paint an entire religion with a wide brush.
Thats like calling all Christianity a cult because of David Koresh's electric koolaid.
Like calling all gun owners mass shooters.
You cant condemn the whole based on the actions of a few.
Either that, or you should have your guns confiscated and be jailed because of the batman shooter.


Name one recent case of that occurring. If you want to argue the distant past, be my guest, but even a fool knows the distant past is not the present.

Seriously?
Xtians are still murdering 'witches in parts of Africa.
And more...
It's all 'out there'!

The search query was "Christians killing witches?"

www.google.com...=Christians+killing+witches%3F

About 9,260,000 results (0.35 seconds)
First Search Results

African Children Denounced As "Witches" By Christian Pastors
www.huffingtonpost.com/.../african-children-denou...

The Huffington Post
Mar 18, 2010 - Nwanaokwo Edet was one of an increasing number of children in Africa accused of witchcraft by pastors and then tortured or killed, often by ...
Seven Accused African Witches Burned to Death : Discovery ...
news.discovery.com/.../seven-accused-african-witches-burned-to-death-1...
Oct 11, 2014 - Seven people in East Africa were killed earlier this week after being ... The Christian bible, for example, explicitly calls for accused witches to be ...

Seven Accused African Witches Burned to Death : Discovery ...
news.discovery.com/.../seven-accused-african-witches-burned-to-death-1...
Oct 11, 2014 - Seven people in East Africa were killed earlier this week after being ... The Christian bible, for example, explicitly calls for accused witches to be ...

Children abused, killed as witches in Nigeria - CNN.com
www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/africa/08/25/nigeria.child.witches/
CNN
Children abused, killed as witches in Nigeria. By Christian Purefoy, CNN. August 28, 2010 -- Updated 1208 GMT (2008 HKT) ...




edit on 21-12-2015 by namelesss because: (no reason given)




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