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WAR: Out of 700 dead bodies found in Fallujah, 550 were women and children

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posted on Jan, 6 2005 @ 11:56 PM
Hey all, lets back up a bit.

I mean, shouldn't we be attempting to determine the validity of the article before we rip each other up about numbers that may or may not be accurate. What is the point of posting our views about a senario who's authenticity is not validated. That is not good form, now is it?

So here is what I see. First the article was not written by Rueters. The article was written by IRIN So who is that, and are they a credible news agency, and what is their general position on the war?

Their web site says it is a UN office for the coordination of Humanitarian affairs. Now I dont know if they are a direct part of the UN, or a chartered organization, or just put the letters UN in their name. Perhaps someone can look it up for us.

What I do know is that any organization always slants the story to meet their agenda. Being a Humanitarian organization, they will always make any war look way worse than what it is so that they can justify their orgainzation. That is just human nature.

I also know that for the last few years, the U.N. administration has been bending over backwards to strip the U.S. of any dignity, or validity, and we all know what their view of the war is.

Also, their website has a little disclaimer at the bottom of the page.

IRIN, a UN humanitarian information unit, but may not necessarily reflect the views of the United Nations or its agencies.

Kind of strange for a UN organization to say that their views may not reflect that of the parent company isnt it? Which leads me to belive that it is not really a UN agency but again, I dont know yet.

All in all, I find that I am very sceptical of the validity of this article. It seems to me that although the news agency that created the article is a generally credible organization on the surface. I also see that it has a large bias, both toward the U.S., and to the action in Iraq. Therefore I cannot trust it on face value. Are there any other credible sources reporting these kinds of casualties there?

*OK, back to your debates*


posted on Jan, 6 2005 @ 11:59 PM

Originally posted by cjane
Nope. I do what my cat tells me to.

Hey! Your cat told me I was the only person it gave orders to!

posted on Jan, 7 2005 @ 10:47 AM

Originally posted by cjane
It's not pretty, but the truth is if it doesn't happen how it is now, what you'll be dealing with are the deaths of your own women and children on our own soil in 5 - 10 years. There is no good option. As harsh as it is, this war is an investment in our future security. Hiding your head in the sand will not make it go away.

Touting the party line - Bush would be proud of you. Fact is Iraq was never a threat to the US or any other country. Saddam was only a threat to his own people - and for many years condoned by the US, Britain. etc. BushCo's war or terror has brought the fundamentalists out of the woodwork from everywhere, running screaming to learn terror tactics, because they see the war as an attack on Islam. The war will never be won and the human cost will be dear - American, Iraqi and others. And for what?

As for the the mainstream media - if you expect to get the real scoop there, shame on you. With the wonder of the internet there's no excuse to know what's really going on, just get surfin' and do a little of your own research.

posted on Jan, 7 2005 @ 10:52 AM
But they were JUST following orders!

posted on Jan, 7 2005 @ 11:07 AM
I have heard from my brother who is in the US army fighting in Iraq. He said that they bombed Fallujah(I dont know how to spell it) every 2 minutes for two weeks. The current civilian death toll in Iraq is over a hundred thousand.

posted on Jan, 7 2005 @ 11:29 AM

Originally posted by Killak420
I have heard from my brother who is in the US army fighting in Iraq. He said that they bombed Fallujah(I dont know how to spell it) every 2 minutes for two weeks. The current civilian death toll in Iraq is over a hundred thousand.

I believe it - heard it a few months ago already. Sad, sad state of affairs when they're supposed to be there doing good. I support your troops, but they are there for the wrong reason. I wonder how many are questioning it now.

I read a while ago that during the Vietnam War, for every American soldier killed 4 came back with grave injuries, amputations etc. In Iraq the ratio is 1:9. Their lives altered forever if they're lucky enough to survive. Everyone should be mad as hell.

posted on Jan, 7 2005 @ 11:56 AM

Originally posted by Nygdan
Why? Whenever insurgents have been in existence before they have only done so with collaborators from the general public. They cannot operate with out public support.

I'm sure there were collaborators, but your statement implied they ALL were collaborators.

Since when? A 13 year old can kill one just as dead as a 20 year old.

I wasn't aware Iraqi mothers gave birth to 13 year old babies, what I mean by children are 0-10 year olds, innocent YOUNG children, at 13 your an adult in those countries.

I'm sure they weren't either, thats probably why they were shot and mutilated, because they wouldn't work with the insurgents.

That very well may be, however there is no doubt in my mind that we did cause civilian casualties, maybe not the ones in the report but it IS possible, after all our bombs do a pretty good job of mutilating, do they not? But again, I don't necessarily believe this particular report, I try to take in both extremes, the US is the devil reports, and the US is godly reports, and I look to the middle for the truth.

The same place the majority of the city went during the raid.

Where was that exactly, do we know? Maybe those who did evacuate actually had somewhere to go, and they probably left long before we attacked the city, the others likely had to choose between their homes or the desert, not very good choices.

I have no idea what the setup was, but the people that left did well enough.

Exactly. And how do you know how the people that left did? Were there reporters interviewing them as they left, "Now that you've escaped the city that was once your home but is now a smoldering war zone, what are you gonna do?", "We're going to Disneyland!" I don't think so. We have no idea how they did.

They were ordered to evacuate, and told that the US was going to come in and start killing insurgents.

Again, I'm doubtful we could've effectively warned the population in this instance. And even if so, if we were invaded by the Chinese one day, would you be obedient to them? Would you leave your home when they order you to? Would you take your family out into the desert on foot with only what you could carry on their orders? I sure as hell wouldn't. And if they harmed a hair on any member of my family, they just created a ferocious insurgent, and that's exactly what we've done.

By that reasoning we shouldn't beleive anything we hear, why, there might not even be a war at all, heck there might not even be a place called iraq.

Fine, believe everything our government tells you, you won't be alone. They would never lie to you.

Too late, the US is there.

I know, and we are there to stay. It's amusing to see that people believe we're gonna leave after the new government is established. Wrong. This was a takeover of an oil-rich country. Allawi WILL win the election, just like Karzai did. We will have a US puppet government in place, we will control the oil fields, and we will probably set up a US military base there, upon request of the new "Iraqi" government, of course.

That hardly means that the americans were the ones who killed and mutliated all those women and children

I can't say we did or we didn't, I hope we didn't, but we have still killed many other women and children. As a father and a decent human being, I am ashamed of the underhanded, murderous greed of our leaders and corporations. I still love my country, but I am ashamed of many of my fellow citizens who wait like baby birds to gobble up every bit of propaganda and misinformation the government spits into their mouths, and their view that innocent death is ok, as long as it isn't Americans who are dying. We have no business calling ourselves one nation under god.

[edit on 7-1-2005 by 27jd]

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