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Do Atheist Bow to Anthromophism?

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posted on Dec, 26 2015 @ 11:59 PM
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originally posted by: Kashai
All you are suggesting is that Atheist can be just as Delusional. Stubborn and Arrogant, as extremist members of any other theology.


I'm not quite sure how you could possibly come to that conclusion when I just showed how Atheists don't hold a universal set of beliefs.

If Atheism was a belief system, then your argument would make sense, but, it isn't. Atheist's only commonality is that they lack a belief in gods.

So how can you possibly justify your argument? (please elaborate)


originally posted by: Kashai
Some Atheist refuse to accept that in reality "we do not know" and this should be acknowledged as a positive in relation to Atheist Dogma because truth is secondary when it comes to belief.


You're confusing individual claims with their Atheism. Once again... Atheists can pick and choose what to believe (so long as it isn't gods) and still be Atheists.

Annee can believe that little pink unicorns form planets, I can believe that ghosts exist and there is an afterlife, and Grimpachi can believe that somewhere on Earth there is a place called Middle Earth where Frodo took a quest to destroy the one ring and save us all. All these belief don't stem from Atheism, they are simply individualistic beliefs that are totally detached from Atheism.

Yes, I'm certain that some Atheists do make the claim that 'Gods absolutely do not exist', however, it's pretty evident that the majority do not believe this because every single response you have been given are from atheists who do not believe this claim.

Again, it's not a claim stemming from Atheism, it's a claim stemming from individualistic conclusion.


originally posted by: Kashai
The truth being you have no way of confirming your belief but that is OK because your belief takes precedence over the reality that you really have no idea as to what you are talking about.


You aren't arguing about Atheism. You're arguing about an illogical conclusion, of which every single Atheist here agree's is illogical.

If all the Atheists here agree that that conclusion is illogical, does that not prove that your argument isn't about Atheism at all?




posted on Dec, 27 2015 @ 12:04 AM
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a reply to: Annee

Guys its 1:03 AM on my end.

While I am really enjoying the conversation it is time for me to go offline.

Have a good night



posted on Dec, 27 2015 @ 12:09 AM
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originally posted by: Kashai
Yes it has been 8 pages and you still are having problems addressing that very rational and simple to understand point


Is that so?

post=20193021 Ghost147
~ Atheism does not have a universal set of beliefs.
~ Atheists are not required to follow everything Science says (in fact, more theists accept what science says than atheists).
~ Atheism says nothing about how we determine what is reality in the universe around us.
~ An Atheist can reject anything and everything that Science says and still be an Atheist, because the two terms are not synonymous.
~ The only thing that connects one Atheist to another is a shared lack-of-belief in all gods.
~ Atheism does not claim, absolutely, that Gods do not exist. Rather, they are usually Atheists because there simply isn't anything to suggest that any sort of god does exist, and all of our observations we've made thus far have been natural occurrences.

post=20187887 Ghost147
However, they are indeed atheists because out of the '4%' of what we have observed (arguable much less than 4%) there had been absolutely no evidence of a God.

So holding on to a lack of belief in one is perfectly reasonable.

post=20188019 Ghost147
The majority of atheists do not claim absolute knowledge that there is no God. It's fairly evident that they do not considering that every single secular argument presented by all of the members who have responded to this topic have told you that atheism is not a position or rejection, it is merely a lack of belief.

No atheist in here has claimed that God does not exist, conclusively. Every atheist here has said that, because there is no evidence for one, there's no reason to even suggest the possibility that one exists until observations prove otherwise.

You've been told this several times in every single page of this topic. Why can you not accept this fact?

post=20190101 Ghost147
Once again, no atheist is stating that god is not possible. We are simply stating there is no evidence to suggest it does, therefor no reason to believe it does. You're continuing to argue a false premise.


These are all the comments I made where I directly responded to the particular argument you're referring to. All of which you have yet to actually refute.

The funny thing is, these comments are only in the last 2 pages!

Not only have I already addressed this prior to page 7 as well, but so has everyone else! You are simply plugging your ears, closing your eyes, and screaming at the top of your lungs "I CAN'T HEAR YOU! I CAN'T READ YOU! I AM RIGHT! YOU ARE WRONG!" and then making the same debunked claim over and over again.
edit on 27/12/15 by Ghost147 because: Added a bit of flare



posted on Dec, 27 2015 @ 12:40 AM
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originally posted by: Ghost147
Again, Atheism isn't a belief system. Other members in this thread have already shown that Atheists can believe in a variety of things, and hold any number of positions and opinions. The only thing that universally connects Atheists as a whole, is a lack of belief in gods


A belief system is individual...basically how you reason everything that happens (ie "everything happens for a reason", God, a belief that it was never God, etc). Lack of a belief is indeed an actual belief. Put down the double-speak/smoke/mirrors lol

Alternatively...the entire existence of the atheist following merely confirms the existence of the God/Gods in question, because if they didn't exist then you wouldn't have anything to denounce. But hey...non-believing is the new believing lol



posted on Dec, 27 2015 @ 01:11 AM
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originally posted by: darkwarrior
A belief system is individual...basically how you reason everything that happens (ie "everything happens for a reason", God, a belief that it was never God, etc).


It certainly can stem from individual conclusions that couple together, but it is not the rule, and is more likely an exception than anything else.

Here's the exact definition of Belief System:
A belief system is a set of mutually supportive beliefs. The beliefs of any such system can be classified as religious, philosophical, ideological, or a combination of these. Wikipedia

Atheism has no set of mutually supported beliefs. There is just one commonality, and that is a lack of belief. Atheists are free to accept/reject/believe in whatever else they want, and it wouldn't change their Atheism.


originally posted by: darkwarrior
Lack of a belief is indeed an actual belief.


Right... And Bald is a hair color.

You're confusing a 'negative' with a 'nonexistent'. I do not claim definitively that "there is no god", but rather, I simply lack the belief in gods until evidence proves otherwise.

I don't collect stamps either, that doesn't mean I've made a hobby of not collecting stamps.


originally posted by: darkwarrior
Put down the double-speak/smoke/mirrors lol


Perhaps you just need to work on your reading comprehension skills.


originally posted by: darkwarrior
Alternatively...the entire existence of the atheist following merely confirms the existence of the God/Gods in question, because if they didn't exist then you wouldn't have anything to denounce.


This makes absolutely no sense at all. Does your lack of belief in invisible pink unicorns that gave rise to the entire universe as we know it somehow validate it's position? Your argument is ridiculous and illogical.

Atheists don't hate god. Atheists aren't intentionally going against the bible. Atheists don't denounce god. Why? Because Atheism isn't a form of rejection, it's simply a lack of belief.

Do your beliefs, which counter other religions, thus validate all those religions? Your logic is flawed.


originally posted by: darkwarrior
But hey...non-believing is the new believing lol


~ It's more-so due to the fact that we have more readily available education.

~ It's more-so due to the fact that things like the Internet allow anyone to go and learn something outside of what they are force fed at home.

~ It's more-so due to the fact that now we realize that thunder and lightning don't come from a sky god at the top of Mount Olympus, but through perfectly natural phenomena.

~ It's more-so due to the fact that we don't consider mythological magic explanations that were written 2000 years ago more valid than objective reasoning.

Of course, I am more than willing to come to your side of reality if you are able to prove that Zeus exists.

You were referring to Zeus, right?
edit on 27/12/15 by Ghost147 because: typo



posted on Dec, 27 2015 @ 07:58 PM
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"~ An Atheist can reject anything and everything that Science says and still be an Atheist, because the two terms are not synonymous."


Presenting that Atheist can be just as irrational as theist.

Your comments relate to an opinion of God that emphasizes Anthromophism. In that you relate to ancient definitions of God as if they pertain to the present. As I explained in the beginning of this thread Major religions, in relation to the present. No longer present God in relation to consciousness as related to Anthromophism Philosophically.

And again as mentioned at the beginning of this thread and in respect to Revelations God simply is not defined that way.


"Atheism has no set of mutually supported beliefs. There is just one commonality, and that is a lack of belief. Atheists are free to accept/reject/believe in whatever else they want, and it wouldn't change their Atheism."

A lack of belief is a belief.

"It's more-so due to the fact that we have more readily available education."


Are you certain your ego is not the result of your responses?

Any thoughts?






edit on 27-12-2015 by Kashai because: Added content



posted on Dec, 27 2015 @ 08:17 PM
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I mean you are actually implying that people who support the idea that God exist are less educated that those that do not.



posted on Dec, 27 2015 @ 08:25 PM
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originally posted by: Kashai
I mean you are actually implying that people who support the idea that God exist are less educated that those that do not.


I think it's a new goalpost.



posted on Dec, 27 2015 @ 08:36 PM
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a reply to: Annee

Agreed there are really well educated individuals that support the existence of God and relate to past definitions, in relation to ancient practices as the result of Anthromophism. An issue being that in so far as how God is represented the truth is in context of major systems of Belief, God is understood as an individual that can exist but is well beyond the ability of Human to comprehend. This is not only apparent in Christianity but as well in Muslim Belief where God cannot be described in Art and Buddhism where God is essentially defined in the Tao.

God Is related to as an abstract consciously compared to the human capacity to observe.




edit on 27-12-2015 by Kashai because: Content edit



posted on Dec, 27 2015 @ 08:50 PM
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a reply to: Annee

I think the reason people perceive theists as less educated at least here on ATS is because there seems to be a lot of uneducated theists that are very vocal and continually ignore proper definitions, etc. They make it up as they go.

There are some very educated theists out there, but I see them less and less on these boards.



posted on Dec, 27 2015 @ 08:55 PM
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a reply to: Grimpachi

To suggest that religion can be interpreted as ignorant because 1300 years ago Christianity depicted God as an old man in a white outfit? Denies that in that time humans have developed a different interpretation, which they have.



posted on Dec, 27 2015 @ 08:59 PM
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originally posted by: Kashai
a reply to: Grimpachi

Denies that in that time humans have developed a different interpretation, which they have.



What is it?



posted on Dec, 27 2015 @ 09:14 PM
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a reply to: Annee

Read Revelations as I mentioned earlier in this thread.

God is presented as sitting in a chair and up until his head looks human. As far beyond that this is not the case. In relation Gods head, is part of some structure based in clouds and undiscernible as human.

We are talking about a concept that relates how God was defined around A.D 68 or 69 historically.

Again and in relation to Buddhism, Christianity and Islam, scholars make clear God in respect to consciousness is beyond human conception.

And sure there are a lot of people out their that insist an anthropomorphic definition applies as fact to what Theist believe.

In the same context there were probably of as many individuals that 200 years ago thought the world was flat.



posted on Dec, 27 2015 @ 09:28 PM
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originally posted by: Kashai
a reply to: Annee

God Is related to as an abstract consciously compared to the human capacity to observe.



Or not.

Many atheists become so via trying to "find" God.

You seem to be stuck that an atheist hasn't considered all aspects of what a creative intelligents, such as "The Force", could be.

You are the one trying to apply a limited concept on atheists.

It's not working.



posted on Dec, 27 2015 @ 09:29 PM
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originally posted by: Kashai
God cannot be described in Art and Buddhism where God is essentially defined in the Tao.

God Is related to as an abstract consciously compared to the human capacity to observe.



That isn't an Anthropomorphic God though. Many Atheists I'm sure have an idea of God being something like Tao, or Consciousness, or some transcendent energy or something There is a big difference between someone who thinks of God in those terms versus Biblical terms.



posted on Dec, 27 2015 @ 09:46 PM
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a reply to: mOjOm

Your suggesting that today some majority of Earths population treats God as somehow human in every regard.

Case in point Ghost147 asked for evidence if Zeus actually existed.

Most people in this world wake up in the morning and go to work and a rather large percentage of them engage in religious rituals. If anything and n relation to the majority of then that does not mean, in sincerity.


That they are addressing there day to day life as if God is some white bearded man. Wearing a white outfit that created the 92 billion light year universe just because God decided to create humans on Earth.

I mean if one treats the Holy Bible as a work that is solely based upon Anthromophism that would make sense.

But it is not.


From my perspective God is the result of condition in Nature related to Chaos theory, where randomness is in potential an illusion.



posted on Dec, 27 2015 @ 09:53 PM
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originally posted by: Kashai
Presenting that Atheist can be just as irrational as theist.


When did I ever deny this? I don't know where you've gotten the idea that we think Atheists are superior to anyone else.

Furthermore, does this make any difference in how you were incorrect about your previously held description of Atheism? No.


originally posted by: Kashai
Your comments relate to an opinion of God that emphasizes Anthromophism.


Wow. Do I really need to repost every single comment I've already made explaining to you that Atheists aren't referring to any particular god, but any and all gods, no matter what the description is. Is your mind so impoverished of intellect to not realize that nearly every single person that has responded to you has already explained away this exact misconception you seem to carry around with you like it's some form of herpes? It just keeps showing up again and again and you can't seem to shake it.

No. My comments have absolutely no relation to the opinion of a god that emphasizes anthropomorphism (that's how you actually spell that word, once again). My comments are referring to any and all forms of gods you can imagine. How is this so incredibly difficult for you to fathom?


originally posted by: Kashai
In that you relate to ancient definitions of God as if they pertain to the present.


Feel free to quote me next time you want to refute my words so you can actually prove a point.


originally posted by: Kashai
As I explained in the beginning of this thread Major religions, in relation to the present. No longer present God in relation to consciousness as related to Anthromophism Philosophically.


And that matters to an atheist, why? Atheism = the lack of belief in gods. Why does that not apply to non-anthropomorphic gods to you? (notice how 'anthropomorphic' is spelled correctly)


originally posted by: Kashai
And again as mentioned at the beginning of this thread and in respect to Revelations God simply is not defined that way.


Does an Atheist give a crap? No. Because Atheists don't believe in gods....


originally posted by: Kashai
A lack of belief is a belief.


Yes... and Bald is a hair color.

And not collecting stamps is a hobby

And Sitting still is form of movement

And being dead is a way of living

And being single, without a relationship is a form of marriage

A lack of belief isn't a belief... You're confusing a 'negative' with a 'nonexistent'. I do not claim definitively that "there is no god", but rather, I simply lack the belief in gods until evidence proves otherwise.


originally posted by: Kashai
Are you certain your ego is not the result of your responses?


There's a difference between egotistical responses, and facts. Here are the facts:

~ ...This hunch is supported by data showing that the more educated countries have higher levels of non belief and there are strong correlations between atheism and intelligence.
~ Atheism increases along with third-level educational enrollment
~ First, with better science, and with government safety nets and smaller families, there is less fear and uncertainty in people's daily lives and hence less of a market for religion.
~ Educated people are more likely to be Atheists
~ The more education a person receives, the more likely they are to become atheists (Lynn, R., Harvey, J., & Nyborg, H. (2009). Average intelligence predicts atheism rates across 137 nations. Intelligence, 37, 11-15.)
~ Non belief also increases with intelligence and income. Residents of more educated countries see religion as less important (link is external) in their daily lives (Barber, N. (2012). Why atheism will replace religion: The triumph of earthly pleasures over pie in the sky.)
~ High IQ turns academics into atheists
~ there is a strong correlation between high IQ and lack of religious belief and that average intelligence predicts atheism rates across 137 countries.

Would you like me to post more?


originally posted by: Kashai
I mean you are actually implying that people who support the idea that God exist are less educated that those that do not.


Statistical values prove that this notion is correct.

edit on 27/12/15 by Ghost147 because: Weird post error



posted on Dec, 27 2015 @ 10:00 PM
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originally posted by: Kashai
Case in point Ghost147 asked for evidence if Zeus actually existed.


Lol, I guess you're unable to understand when someone is being satirical.

Nevertheless, Why can't anyone ask that question and not understand that there are other descriptions of what a god is? Your logic is flawed.


originally posted by: Kashai
I mean if one treats the Holy Bible as a work that is solely based upon Anthromophism that would make sense.


The majority of people on earth aren't christian. so this argument makes no sense.


originally posted by: Kashai
From my perspective God is the result of condition in Nature related to Chaos theory, where randomness is in potential an illusion.


Good for you. I don't believe in your god, because why? I'm an atheist. It matters not what you describe god as being.
edit on 27/12/15 by Ghost147 because: typo



posted on Dec, 27 2015 @ 10:00 PM
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originally posted by: Kashai
a reply to: mOjOm

Your suggesting that today some majority of Earths population treats God as somehow human in every regard.



You are the one who keeps telling us that's what we think.

And then ignore that we tell you you're wrong.



posted on Dec, 27 2015 @ 10:01 PM
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a reply to: Ghost147

Well I misspelled the words incorrectly because I figured that in relation to your character you would obviously pounce on that to suggest there was something wrong.

Perhaps you should learn more about Psychology.

You are wrong and everything you have said to date proves that.

I

Get over it or if you cannot perhaps you should secure the services of a Psychologist.

Literally.

For the record I do have a empty slot in my schedule.

I can spare 2 hours.

That would be Sundays after Church.


edit on 27-12-2015 by Kashai because: Added content



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