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US calls on Turkey to withdraw ‘unauthorized’ troops from Iraq

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posted on Dec, 17 2015 @ 05:45 PM
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Turks entered Cyprus in 1974 .

Anyone who asked Turks to leave Cyprus has gotten the same answer since 1974 ;
- Make me .

Musul & Kirkuk's population is predominantly Sunni Kurd , Turk , Arab and they will not be left at the hands of Shia Bagdat backed by Shia Iran.

Kurds will declare independence and Turks will be the first with the recognition of independent Kurdistan in Iraq .

Kurds then will ask for an official protection force and Turks & US will bring out the UN troops to protect Kurdistan .

Newly founded Kurdistan will obviously be vulnerable at the front line of Sunni - Shia division and they will hold a referandum which will see them joining with Istanbul properly .


None of the above is a secret or a nationalistic explanation for the situation in Mesopotamia .

Nebuchadnezzar to Rameses to Julius Caesar to Xerkes ; they all came & they all gone .

This is how things are in Mesopotamia .




posted on Dec, 17 2015 @ 07:21 PM
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a reply to: 23432

You are sure that iraqi kurds will play your game and let you slaughter other kurds just to have your "protection"?
I'd bet on kurdistan will to get more land in Syria and Turkey after getting recognition. And once they'll be able to trade with other partners I'd also bet they'd call the US and the UN to revenge.

You talk like you are privy to amazing informations and never source your claims, so I have to take them for what they are: words on the internet, and pretty much a very strange view about the role of your country in this war.



posted on Dec, 17 2015 @ 07:41 PM
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originally posted by: Mastronaut
a reply to: 23432

You are sure that iraqi kurds will play your game and let you slaughter other kurds just to have your "protection"?
I'd bet on kurdistan will to get more land in Syria and Turkey after getting recognition. And once they'll be able to trade with other partners I'd also bet they'd call the US and the UN to revenge.

You talk like you are privy to amazing informations and never source your claims, so I have to take them for what they are: words on the internet, and pretty much a very strange view about the role of your country in this war.



But you already think that Turks lost any future battle , don't you ?

According to your world view Turks are of a no factor in the area anyway .

I don't really need to source public knowledge ; those who speak Turkish can verify what I say with ease .

You are underestimating Turks which indicates a strong bias . I am taking into account of history and current events to explain events from a strictly Turkish point of view .

A Russian Jew was joining Red army ;

His mother was preparing his bag and also was busy giving advice to her son .

Son , she said , don't over exert yourself , when you kill a Turk , take a breath and get some rest then kill the next Turk .

Son asked jokingly , what if the Turk kills me mom ?

Golly gosh my son why would a Turk want to kill you , whoever heard you done wrong to Turk , she said .


................

My views about Turks role is not strange , it is just that you don't really understand where Turks are coming from and lack of this knowledge makes your analysis incompelete .

Iraqi Kurds can not sustain an independent Kurdistan without help from Turks and they know it .

Kurds will be warred against Shia of Iran & Iraq & Syria , no matter what .

Turks & Kurds are not the enemies you like to think they are .

In fact pushing them to fight one another can only result in their unification because neither nation is THAT stupid to not know their own respected histories .






edit on 17-12-2015 by 23432 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 18 2015 @ 03:02 AM
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originally posted by: Mastronaut
We have a series of events which are somehow related imho:
- EU seems to encourage Turkey for the admission


Pure bla bla. They just re-opened a few 'chapters' and the most problematic ones - Justice, Freedom and Security among others - are not going to be green-lighted any time soon in regards of the current 'Midnight Express' remake that's is being played in Turkey atm.



posted on Dec, 18 2015 @ 03:18 AM
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a reply to: Mastronaut




- "proto incident" in the sea between a fishing boat and a russian frigate
The answer to that may be in this short vid ....



posted on Dec, 18 2015 @ 04:27 AM
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originally posted by: 23432
But you already think that Turks lost any future battle , don't you ?


Can you quote me saying that? And what battle?


According to your world view Turks are of a no factor in the area anyway .


No, it's according to YOUR world turks are some kind of superpower based on ottoman and ancient history. From the same point of view we should expect Italy to rule the mediterrean. Things change.


I don't really need to source public knowledge ; those who speak Turkish can verify what I say with ease .


So it will remain a mistery for everyone but brainwashed turks


You are underestimating Turks which indicates a strong bias . I am taking into account of history and current events to explain events from a strictly Turkish point of view .


You are vastly overestimating your power with a strong imperialist bias.


My views about Turks role is not strange , it is just that you don't really understand where Turks are coming from and lack of this knowledge makes your analysis incompelete .


You might have missed a hundred years of history or so, you may want to update your books.


Iraqi Kurds can not sustain an independent Kurdistan without help from Turks and they know it .

Kurds will be warred against Shia of Iran & Iraq & Syria , no matter what .


Or they most likely will struck a deal like Israel and find a bogieman in Iran or maybe Turkey.


Turks & Kurds are not the enemies you like to think they are .

In fact pushing them to fight one another can only result in their unification because neither nation is THAT stupid to not know their own respected histories .


But that's not how it works. Turks are slaying kurds in Turkey and Syria and weren't exactly friendly until the oil deal of october.
Making up recent history based on nothing isn't going to help you.



posted on Dec, 18 2015 @ 07:33 AM
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originally posted by: Mastronaut

originally posted by: 23432
But you already think that Turks lost any future battle , don't you ?


Can you quote me saying that? And what battle?



According to your world view Turks are of a no factor in the area anyway .


No, it's according to YOUR world turks are some kind of superpower based on ottoman and ancient history. From the same point of view we should expect Italy to rule the mediterrean. Things change.


I don't really need to source public knowledge ; those who speak Turkish can verify what I say with ease .


So it will remain a mistery for everyone but brainwashed turks


You are underestimating Turks which indicates a strong bias . I am taking into account of history and current events to explain events from a strictly Turkish point of view .


You are vastly overestimating your power with a strong imperialist bias.


My views about Turks role is not strange , it is just that you don't really understand where Turks are coming from and lack of this knowledge makes your analysis incompelete .


You might have missed a hundred years of history or so, you may want to update your books.


Iraqi Kurds can not sustain an independent Kurdistan without help from Turks and they know it .

Kurds will be warred against Shia of Iran & Iraq & Syria , no matter what .


Or they most likely will struck a deal like Israel and find a bogieman in Iran or maybe Turkey.


Turks & Kurds are not the enemies you like to think they are .

In fact pushing them to fight one another can only result in their unification because neither nation is THAT stupid to not know their own respected histories .


But that's not how it works. Turks are slaying kurds in Turkey and Syria and weren't exactly friendly until the oil deal of october.
Making up recent history based on nothing isn't going to help you.




You did say that in your opinion the Turks are loser because of their backing if Nato , didn't you ?

I never claimed that the Turks are a superpower , however I do claim that they are a regional power which you seem to deny consistently .

Also Turks have no emperial ambition at all ; on the contrary , Turks are helping several nations to get rid of emperialists who are sucking the oil/blood out of number of countries in Arabia & Africa .

Anyone who has objective eyes can see that the Turks are one of the most important players in ME and any future plans for the area ought to involve Turks too .
Ignore the Turks in the ME at your peril .

According to you the Turks are " brainwashed " and " missing hundreds of years of history " or something like that .

See , your narrative is far too unrealistic to be taken seriously ; "Turks who number 200+ million all over the world including Anatolia , Mesopotamia , Caucasia , China , Central Asia and Europe are just " Brainwashed & Too stupid "to realize the meaning of events surrounding them ."

Turks don't " Slay " Kurds ,period . Most of those slayed are pseudo Kurds who are actually " Alleged Armenian Genocide " descendants who hid themselves under the cloak of Turk or A Kurd .

Everyone knows that the PKK fighters who gets killed in a fight with Turks will have their genitalia shot at by their own comrades .

This is done to hide the true identity of the " so called Kurd " who is now dead . We also listen to PKK terorrists radio chatter where often we hear Greek , Armenian and Hebrew spoken between the so called Kurdish terrorists .

If I understood correctly , you are hoping for an outcome where Barzani [A Hebrew Kurd who is also a Sunni ] will team with Israel and attack Turks or Iranians .

This is a pipe dream which is straight out of a neocon+zionist perspective . It is also an incorrect reading of the future where Turks role in the area diminished and Kurds are the first ones to attack Turks .

I found it difficult to believe that the Kurdish Turks will actually attack their Turkish neighbours en masse , like that of Serb vs Bosnians vs Croats situation .

Your vision requires a civil war in Turkey between sunni Turk vs Sunni Kurd or some type of Sunni vs Shia civil war scenario.

Sunnis in Turkey wouldn't fight each other ; they have no reason to .
What you are not taking into account is that the Kurds of Turkey actually denounce pseudo Kurds . In fact the PKK has killed or slayed Kurds in greater numbers then Turks ever did .

I could put up youtube video of Kurds protesting against PKK and demonstrating solidarity with Turks but I suspect you are not ready to deny ignorance in these delicate matters.

I talk to Kurds everday , I have Kurdish relatives too ; your expectations exceeds their wildest dreams .

If Israel pushes this scenarion then Turks would push Palestinian issue even more then they already do .

Turks are the only nation to have received an Apology from Israel ; if Turks were weak and didn't really mattered all that much then Israel would have strong armed Turks and got rid of Erdogan long ago .

Why do you think Erdogan said " One Minute " in Davos ?

The fact of the matter is that Erdogan is as shrewd as a politician can get and plays his cards to hurt Israel's interests while keeping an open back door for normalisation between Israel & Turkey.

Sane Hebrews know the deal about co-existing with Turks and they also believe that current insane israeli policy is going to bring disaster on everyone .

Now before you start shooting me of being an anti-semite ; I should point out that if I wanted to , I can simply migrate to Israel and can get a citizenship .

My nephews serve in IDF so I got good references .

When Iraq & Syria breaks up there will be somewhere between 3 to 5 new countries in Mesopotamia .

Some new countries will be aligned with Turks and there is nothing surprising about that at all ; simply put it's nature taking it's course .



posted on Dec, 18 2015 @ 02:50 PM
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originally posted by: 23432
You did say that in your opinion the Turks are loser because of their backing if Nato , didn't you ?


You are generalizing some of the comments of at least 4-5 posts. Turks are loser in what? I'll rephrase hoping you will drop this strawman:
Turks didn't open hostility on Russia in their own interests, they did this in the interests of the US, the question is only if it's Erdogan's own will or if he's been used, but recent dealings in Moscow and Ryihad suggests it might have been for him since after NATO scapegoat failed nwo we have Saudi's option.
Turks lost already, they lost a partner that they didn't need to lose, since every other contract they signed in compensation could have been closed anyway.
The reality is that it was probably retaliation against ISIS oil smuggling.



I never claimed that the Turks are a superpower , however I do claim that they are a regional power which you seem to deny consistently .


And you seem to ignore that this is not a regional war.


Also Turks have no emperial ambition at all ; on the contrary , Turks are helping several nations to get rid of emperialists who are sucking the oil/blood out of number of countries in Arabia & Africa .

Anyone who has objective eyes can see that the Turks are one of the most important players in ME and any future plans for the area ought to involve Turks too .
Ignore the Turks in the ME at your peril .


Turkey DO have imperialistic ambitions because traditionally arabs were under them, but I agree with your second statement, your country have a big role, it's just screwing up every move and will end up having no say when the war is over. In fact is at risk of being the '44 Germany of these days.


According to you the Turks are " brainwashed " and " missing hundreds of years of history " or something like that .

See , your narrative is far too unrealistic to be taken seriously ; "Turks who number 200+ million all over the world including Anatolia , Mesopotamia , Caucasia , China , Central Asia and Europe are just " Brainwashed & Too stupid "to realize the meaning of events surrounding them ."


You are totally twisting my words for your agenda. You ARE NOT the "Turks", you are just one, linking NO SOURCES IN NO LANGUAGE, probably brainwashed by a propaganda (or working for it, but in that case meh, buuy some stars plz) claiming that WE LACK the knowledge of the secret friendship of all turks in the world, turks and kurds, incredible deals resulting from getting hostile to Russia and its great interest in fighting terrorism. PLEASE EDUCATE US IN ANY LANGUAGE AT LEAST ONCE.


Turks don't " Slay " Kurds ,period . Most of those slayed are pseudo Kurds who are actually " Alleged Armenian Genocide " descendants who hid themselves under the cloak of Turk or A Kurd .

Everyone knows that the PKK fighters who gets killed in a fight with Turks will have their genitalia shot at by their own comrades .

This is done to hide the true identity of the " so called Kurd " who is now dead . We also listen to PKK terorrists radio chatter where often we hear Greek , Armenian and Hebrew spoken between the so called Kurdish terrorists .


Again you talk about misteries like they were common knowledge.


If I understood correctly , you are hoping for an outcome where Barzani [A Hebrew Kurd who is also a Sunni ] will team with Israel and attack Turks or Iranians .
....


Diplomacy doesn't work like that. If kurds get into any position of power you can bet your ass they will unite and claim whatever they can, they just need to not be locked out economically (ie they need other trading partners for their resources).


I could put up youtube video of Kurds protesting against PKK and demonstrating solidarity with Turks but I suspect you are not ready to deny ignorance in these delicate matters.

I talk to Kurds everday , I have Kurdish relatives too ; your expectations exceeds their wildest dreams .


Youtube sources? Can't you link a few articles about these incredible relations? How can a few youtube videos can be in any way, shape or form representative of millions of people?



If Israel pushes this scenarion then Turks would push Palestinian issue even more then they already do .

Turks are the only nation to have received an Apology from Israel ; if Turks were weak and didn't really mattered all that much then Israel would have strong armed Turks and got rid of Erdogan long ago .


No, Israel didn't apologize because you are strong, sorry. Erdogan is playing by their game and provides also plausible deniability, so he will stay until it's useful.


Sane Hebrews know the deal about co-existing with Turks and they also believe that current insane israeli policy is going to bring disaster on everyone .

Now before you start shooting me of being an anti-semite ; I should point out that if I wanted to , I can simply migrate to Israel and can get a citizenship .


Coexist where? You don't share a border and they don't want your land. You are good trade partners and they want access to Europe, the Balkans and Caucasus. I couldn't care less of your "potential antisemitism", you are just making up facts.


When Iraq & Syria breaks up there will be somewhere between 3 to 5 new countries in Mesopotamia .

Some new countries will be aligned with Turks and there is nothing surprising about that at all ; simply put it's nature taking it's course .


This is a possibility and Turkey has all interests in having some on their side. The problem is that I don't see very likely that the Saudi coalition, which you are now part of, is on the same side as the US/West/NATO after Moscow talks, and if you think that you can be independent, that's laughable. Go ask Lybia, or Syria, or Yemen, and I can go on ad libitum.



posted on Dec, 18 2015 @ 04:18 PM
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reply to Mastronaut


2 things I disagree ; 1 - Turks lost less then Russians did . 2 - DAESH oil smuggling angle makes no sense because prior to jet incident Putin was full of praise for Erdogan ,calling him a man of honour , a men's man on more then one occasion .
You are choosing to believe Putin now .
Ask the next question ; didn't Putin know about oil smuggling when he was calling Erdogan all the complimentary names ?
Truth is there is no Oil being smuggled by Erdogan but few independent operators regionally .

This is still a region of Turkey , so what if it's also a world war situation ; what is a Turk to do , roll over and play " good boy " ?
You are not being realistic and you are not taking into account the new paradigm Erdogan has introduced to the game .

[ Arabs choose Turks ; Qatar and Saudi money comes to Turks without a single Turkish Soldier being deployed on the soils of these Arab Countries .
I don't think that counts as an Emperialist move on the part of Turks .
You are not realistic with the dangers Turks face ; Turks have a Military who would have told Erdogan NO if they believed that they can't handle Russia .
Russia is not going to nuke Turkey nor attack Turks directly . There maybe some proxy war conducted in the Syrian - Iraqi theater but that is all .

I don't understand what you want really . I offer my opinion with some information I possess from various Turkish sources .
I am not forcing anyone to believe what I say . You keep asking for sources which you can easy verify yourself via google translator .
I am not brainwashed or working for a propaganda for Turks . On different subjects I could be fiercely critical of Turkish government . It's just that I am not holding Turks for all the ills in the world like some people believe.

And you do seem to lack knowledge of Turks in general otherwise you would know about Turan Army and what Turks are after really .
Surely you can go to facebook and type Turkmen ; you;'ll get the story from the Turkmens mouth , updated daily .
Or you can type in youtube Turkmen or what ever you think I am misleading you on and find it out .
If you don't want to do any of that it's fine by me , believe whatever you want .

It is only secret to you that there is friendship amongs the Turks but it isn't a secret to Turks . I mean doesn't all English speakers have a friend ship of language ?
Turks are the same and they are all working for a future where Turks unite ; this is not a secret either .
Just watch some Aliyev , Nazarev , Erdogan speeches about Turkic unity.

As for what is a mystery to you IS being the common knowledge to anyone who knows the Turkish -Kurdish conflict of last 30 years , well what can I say other then trying to impart info to you .
I admire scepticism and sinisism but you are on an entirely different level .
You being not aware of terrorists genitalia is not my fault really ; we are talking about the issue , every party have responsibility to learn as much as they can.
You are just busy accusing me of making things up so to speak . Why would I make things up ? I am not a child but a grown man .

Look , write friendship between kurds & turks in google and you get all the results you are looking for . And you are right that videos don't do justice to overall millions of Kurds political views .
For that you need to look at the election results ; write " kurds in turkish elections " and google it .
Most Kurds voted for Erdogan , doesn't that mean something to you ?

Libya , Syria & Yemen are all ex-Ottoman provinces . We are talking about sunni unification of the ummah here not independent Turks ; on the contrary interdependency amongst the muslims is the name of the game for Turks .

Here is some Turkmen fighters pictures that you won't see elsewhere ;







They are fighting against Russians , Iranians , Syrians AND DAESH too .



edit on 18-12-2015 by 23432 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 18 2015 @ 07:18 PM
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a reply to: 23432

I don't really know what to think, you are basically saying "hey Turkey wants to show its prowess who cares about wwiii?". If that's what you think get down of that high horse, there's just sand to eat in the near future if many turks are like you. For all of us.
The oil smuggling thing is as old as 2014, it's just that once Putin had to retaliate he used that one. He probably told Kerry he also has proofs for Incirlik being a hub for heroine in Eu and the CIA is involved there so oil and drugs are the biggest revenue for IS, one is partly exposed and actively destroyed (smuggled oil), the other is only merely exposed with captagon and hashish for USAGE, not profit (remember the saudi prince with 2 tonnes of captagon?).
So there is ample evidence that the western coalition + saudi/gcc and turkey actively do their dirty business, but Putin doesn't need proofs, he has a network of alternative media, he can drop any truth bomb that is barely verosimilar.

The problem is not that Russia lost more than Turkey, is that Turkey just lost those things for free, for a terrible move at a terrible time for no profit at all. It is too dumb to be simply a matter of militaristic flexing, there are not people like you in power, those people do care only about their money and control. In fact is EXACTLY for this that the downing was a "NATO interest".

You seem to totally ignore that the leading power in the middle East is Saudi Arabia, and in fact as long as you don't challenge them you are ok. Problem is there is a physical barrier between Turkey and the arab countries, namely Syria/Iraq/Iran, your imperialism isn't in trying to invade the saudi, it's Cyprus, Syria, Iraq, your claims on Crimea and other things like that. Turkey has no real place to expand into, except Syria and Iraq, that's why they want to support the zio-neocon plans.
How the hell can't you see that you are not independent at all? 3 billion € gently given by the EU after the blackmailing, anti-terrorism funds, saudi money... How long can they last? How sustainable is that? Is it worth cutting trades with Russia and putting yourself in the crosshair of the alternative media? You know media these days win wars without throwing a bomb?

You move the narrative to something like friendship with turks etc. None of it counts in politics nor in economical wars. It's not that I want to undervalue your claims, but when you talk about mass numbers you need to provide some polls, not just personal anecdotal evidence. Things like


You being not aware of terrorists genitalia is not my fault really ; we are talking about the issue , every party have responsibility to learn as much as they can.
You are just busy accusing me of making things up so to speak . Why would I make things up ? I am not a child but a grown man .


How the rituals have any weight on the bigger picture (which is Turkey's political position)? You take some examples and generalize the concept like they were the rules or the majority. And you never presented these things like your opinion, but like the norm that everybody knows. Well I know exactly what I am talking about, and that's about opportunities, not friendship. The conflict between people are just an excuse to create division, whatever they say is part of an agenda, and in the best case it's the media reporting them having an agenda.


Libya , Syria & Yemen are all ex-Ottoman provinces . We are talking about sunni unification of the ummah here not independent Turks ; on the contrary interdependency amongst the muslims is the name of the game for Turks .


Those were example of how a country can become by just being friendly to the west. And how can this interdependency be established? I see no T in BRICS, I see developing countries getting costly borrowing in US dollars in the next years, I see Turkey as being on the military side rather than the economical one, and that's what your country will pay. Your country is smuggling arms, drugs, stolen oil and enforcing medieval censorship. Why would other african countries make deals with who funds their biggest internal issues? Friend to the imperialists who enslaved their country. Do you really know how was Turkey perceived last year and now? I'll tell you, in the west you now are a rogue state for most people. That's not good, you risk to be the scapegoat in multiple scenarios like saudi bailing out, kurdistan too strong, russia and the us reaching a deal or any other scenario where ISIS is dead and we need a new boogieman.



posted on Dec, 19 2015 @ 05:16 PM
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Turkey just did it



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