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Question for Europeans: Why Did You Willing Cede Your Sovereignty to Brussels and the EU?

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posted on Dec, 14 2015 @ 12:28 AM
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Now I will admit I don't understand how a country can voluntarily agree to give up their national identity and sovereignty, but maybe there are some Europeans here that can explain it to me. Also, maybe the people didn't want it, but the NWO types just decided this was going to happen and be the first step towards their consolidation of power.

I have in the past been called ignorant for thinking that Europeans don't value their individual liberty as much as Americans, but frankly, I see a conglomeration of Socialist states that used to be free now all under the yoke of a centralized, Authoritarian beauracracy. It also seems like free speech isn't as important as not offending in Europe. Nazi's are outlawed and you can't even speak against global warming in Germany anymore (if Merkel gets her way).

What is going on over there? It seems like you put society before individual rights and I don't understand how you folks can accept that unless we are just that different in our world view (a possibility).

So if you can politely explain it to me why you agree with the EU or why you don't and maybe you didn't have a choice I would appreciate it greatly. I really do want to understand why this happened.

I know the NWO also wants to centralize power in the Americas and Asia as well so, maybe there really wasn't a choice. Obviously it looks like TPTB would like to destroy the American economy and blur our borders in an effort to break us here and do the same thing to us they did to you folks.


edit on 2015/12/14 by Metallicus because: sp




posted on Dec, 14 2015 @ 12:38 AM
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a reply to: Metallicus

I'm not European but I read somewhere that part of the reason why the European Union was formed was to prevent another Western European War. In fact part of the reason why the forerunner of the European Union (the European Coal and Steel Community) was formed so to prevent Western European nations from fighting each other by having each other economically dependent on one another. I may be wrong but I heard this a while back.
edit on 14-12-2015 by starwarsisreal because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 14 2015 @ 12:46 AM
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the thing that makes me laugh is, 15 years ago when we all really first started to get blogs happening and websites functional the topic of a "one" country euro under a one government was raised a few times and you were often heartily laughed at before being asked to leave the floor this had a sister theory i think it was the north and south america being joined into one country and something about a highway from canada to the bottom of south america, also the other part was south pacific made into one conglomerate of asia.
i think thats how the theory went, i cant remember.



posted on Dec, 14 2015 @ 12:59 AM
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It's not that hard to understand really.
The big steps they take are all logical and benefit most people (trade agreements, unimpeded travel between countries). So nobody feels a need to stop them.

The taking of sovereignty is usually done in very small steps and are hardly ever reported as such in the media. Even the unification of our currency was not reported as a loss of our sovereignty. The control over the larger papers, television and radio is in the hands of the state and quite a small group of individuals. They both have the same agenda I guess.

But we seem to have reached a tipping point. For some reason things are suddenly changing. Recently the media have started to 'slip up'. Obvious mistakes in their propaganda that show the weakness of our countries politicians and the corruptness and expansion politics of EU politicians. The obviously biased reporting on the migrants streaming into europe (healthy young males and almost no women and children). They are all quite obvious and have made even the most ignorant people question what is happening.

If I were the suspicious type I would start to thing we were being groomed to accept a strong leader to unify us against the corrupt politicians and an invasion by economic refugees. Reports on the US are even funnier. People here are made to believe that you guyss have pretty much allready elected Donald Trump. And you seem to have the most ineffective army in the world. Where the Russians are hurting ISIS, the US seems to be assisting the Turks in defending and supplying ISIS.

The only guy I hear my collegues and family speak highly of is Putin. They will tell you he is a dictator and had people killed, but they would prefer him over the EU politicians any day. Franky I believe the have gone completely mad.

I fear we live in interesting times.



posted on Dec, 14 2015 @ 01:03 AM
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a reply to: starwarsisreal

You are right. That was the original intent.

But now it is a money and power thing for people that have gone into politics as a job and do not see it as a calling.



posted on Dec, 14 2015 @ 02:03 AM
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a reply to: Metallicus

I think it was Ireland that voted no. Then TPTB said hang on we will have to have a vote again because the people voted the wrong way. It was always going to happen no matter what.



posted on Dec, 14 2015 @ 02:12 AM
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originally posted by: Metallicus
Now I will admit I don't understand how a country can voluntarily agree to give up their national identity and sovereignty, but maybe there are some Europeans here that can explain it to me. Also, maybe the people didn't want it, but the NWO types just decided this was going to happen and be the first step towards their consolidation of power.

I have in the past been called ignorant for thinking that Europeans don't value their individual liberty as much as Americans, but frankly, I see a conglomeration of Socialist states that used to be free now all under the yoke of a centralized, Authoritarian beauracracy. It also seems like free speech isn't as important as not offending in Europe. Nazi's are outlawed and you can't even speak against global warming in Germany anymore (if Merkel gets her way).

What is going on over there? It seems like you put society before individual rights and I don't understand how you folks can accept that unless we are just that different in our world view (a possibility).

So if you can politely explain it to me why you agree with the EU or why you don't and maybe you didn't have a choice I would appreciate it greatly. I really do want to understand why this happened.

I know the NWO also wants to centralize power in the Americas and Asia as well so, maybe there really wasn't a choice. Obviously it looks like TPTB would like to destroy the American economy and blur our borders in an effort to break us here and do the same thing to us they did to you folks.



LOL, is that some kind of troll post?

Question for You: Why Did You Willing Cede Your Personal Sovereignty to Your Local Authorities?



posted on Dec, 14 2015 @ 02:19 AM
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originally posted by: moebius

originally posted by: Metallicus
Now I will admit I don't understand how a country can voluntarily agree to give up their national identity and sovereignty, but maybe there are some Europeans here that can explain it to me. Also, maybe the people didn't want it, but the NWO types just decided this was going to happen and be the first step towards their consolidation of power.

I have in the past been called ignorant for thinking that Europeans don't value their individual liberty as much as Americans, but frankly, I see a conglomeration of Socialist states that used to be free now all under the yoke of a centralized, Authoritarian beauracracy. It also seems like free speech isn't as important as not offending in Europe. Nazi's are outlawed and you can't even speak against global warming in Germany anymore (if Merkel gets her way).

What is going on over there? It seems like you put society before individual rights and I don't understand how you folks can accept that unless we are just that different in our world view (a possibility).

So if you can politely explain it to me why you agree with the EU or why you don't and maybe you didn't have a choice I would appreciate it greatly. I really do want to understand why this happened.

I know the NWO also wants to centralize power in the Americas and Asia as well so, maybe there really wasn't a choice. Obviously it looks like TPTB would like to destroy the American economy and blur our borders in an effort to break us here and do the same thing to us they did to you folks.



LOL, is that some kind of troll post?

Question for You: Why Did You Willing Cede Your Personal Sovereignty to Your Local Authorities?


This was a legitimate post.

I don't understand why anyone would want to be part of the EU or why a country would let some foreign body supersede its founding documents. Fortunately I have received some good responses so far and I would like to hear why you believe this happened to the European people. I am assuming it was a NWO thing and the people really didn't have a choice.



posted on Dec, 14 2015 @ 02:35 AM
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It is all so horrifically simple.

Nationalism means nothing
Religion means nothing
High minded Ideals of righteousness mean nothing.
in the face of content, distracted citizenry.
We even have external bogey men in the form of Russia and the Middle East

But honestly, even though corruption and bureaucracy and general no goodness are pervasive in this great en devour of globalization, with its natural end game being The Global Unified State of Humanity. The GUSH. a rapid and plentiful stream or burst of something. LOL. Of course we are rushing towards a Unified State, the question is will it be stirred by Tyrants or Altruists. As has been said globalization and or economic interdependence is a way to prevent another world war. A way of pooling resources and power to prevent the annihilation of the human race by its greatest enemy. Itself.

The Security a unified state offers outweighs the corruption and marginalization of minority interests.... is the cold calculating truth. Most will agree. As they will not jeopardize their security.

Go in peace. Kind Regards



posted on Dec, 14 2015 @ 02:37 AM
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The first vote whether to join the European was in 1975 before I was born. Why did You cede your sovereignty by signing up to nafta and tpp.



posted on Dec, 14 2015 @ 03:31 AM
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I am not european in origin, and I cannot claim to be really knowledgeable on the details and facts of what happened.
I was still more focused on trying to speak the language and get through day to day interactions appropriately at that time. But I had also become super tuned into body language, and general expressions of emotion and deeper drives , because that is what I read before I could understand the words spoken.

At that time, my impression was that most of the people around me were dubious and many were hostile against the decisions. But because it is part of their culture to have difficulty embracing change or progression of any sort anyway, that attitude was sort of easily pushed aside as just the usual irrational fear of change.
It wasn't taken that seriously.

Also, some of the moans and groans were easily ignored as racism- because they were based on the fear that we'd be infected by the peoples coming across the borders from less affluent european countries.

You used the term "states" in your OP, and that can be okay to use, but for some americans, I find it needs to be pointed out often- these are not states, they are nations.. countries... which are VERY different from one another!
In two hours I can be in a country that has a totally different language, culture, architecture, clothing, and government.
Some countries right next to each other have long standing dislike of each other .

You are right, the europeans do not highly value individual liberty, relatively speaking, as the Americans do.
The french consider it a sin to be egotistical and put your needs or desires above that of the collective you belong to.
They value collective freedom much more.

My impression at the time was that it was seen by the peoples (besides their fear of change) as a way of opening up more freedom to them as a collective. More freedom to do trade and commerce further and wider.
The fear of being taken advantage of by the influx of central european natives that would come in and take the jobs, being willing to work for no security and little pay was countered by an equally strong enticement of the possibilities of going into their countries and taking advantage of them!

I witnessed other commerce and business owners like myself rubbing their hands together dreaming of installing their factory in Hungary or Romania, where they'd pay much less for their employees and taxes.
(but those were very careful about who they would admit this to, for they were those evil egotistical-individualism ones, and this was not a publicly acknowledged motivation).

The more politically correct were in hopes that all the nations involved would benefit somehow from the association, and that it might assuage the various grudges between some of them.

Also, it cannot be ignored that without allies, these tiny countries feel powerless in face of the monster the USA is.
With their repeated invasions all over the world, and the huge campaigns they did to pressure the smaller countries to support them against their peoples wishes (freedom fries, and the smears against the french echo still amongst our good ole american crowd ...) influenced a general mood here of countries wanting to ally together collectively to support each other in face of that bullying.

I can totally see why the US would dislike them doing that, keeping others smaller and less powerful than you turned against each other and separated is the preferable situation! That is our american system- we try to keep our people all separated and turned against each other as individuals so that they have no collective power against their government, and that works.

I can't bear witness to other european countries, but France, at least, has already had their revolution and learned that the only thing that can counter the slide into corruption of the powerful is a strong collective force.
edit on 14-12-2015 by Bluesma because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 14 2015 @ 03:36 AM
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a reply to: Metallicus

When people voted "no" they would basically let people vote again and again...until they get it right.


edit on 14-12-2015 by Necrose because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 14 2015 @ 03:56 AM
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a reply to: Metallicus

I think it was a strategy to building the world into huge social blocks of countries and then supply them with arms to kill each other off whilst the elite money lenders and arms manufacturers sat back and made huge profits.

As a Brit our disgusting government has never had the decency to even allow a referendum before it became obvious to the politicians that they were slowly being made redundant and loosing their powers not only in Britain but also in the rest of the world.

Now that lesson has sunk through their skulls suddenly we are allowed to have a referendum. (I suspect queenie is still sh--ting herself about the Scots one and grabbing all her financial assets she can from Scotland before the next one comes and Scotland goes its own sweet way - again the English not even considered in any of this.

The delightfully tragic, yet funny thing is that we think we live in a democracy but its actually a very controlled dictatorship in the UK and we are still serfs. We have a vote, but we don't seem to get what we voted for and two party politics with each party joined at the hip gives only the elite's agenda as choice.

I suspect most Americans wouldn't agree with many of its foreign policies, but can they do more?



posted on Dec, 14 2015 @ 04:03 AM
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Where is the difference between my government sitting in Berlin, and my government sitting in Brussels?

The problem you might not see is that with growing "globalization" the smaller countries in Europe were losing faster than even now their chances for influence in trade agreements and such.

This was a large factor for smaller countries to join a large union, which outweighted obviously the disadvantages by having to discuss even local politics with politicians from other countries.


In the end, the net-results are positive.

And to the OP: no, we are not socialistic countries. Learn about socialism. It is not the demon the US-based education tries to make it. We had real-live socialism up to 25 years ago. That was DIFFERENT.

And the denial about Global Warming: we have this thing called free speach - with the German exception of the Holocaust, but that should be acceptable, given our history. Anything else goes. You might get laughed at, but that is always the option with free speach and such.



posted on Dec, 14 2015 @ 04:14 AM
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The EU is a bit like the US (union/united) in that it allows people generally to have a single set of rules and theres no need to present papers when driving in or out of a member state generally, the basic rules are the same but more local details are left to the EU member states which does sound a bit like the US system to be honest

There is advantages and disadvantages of course but that's like living in Chicago and not being able to buy a gun like in Texas etc

And at least here in the UK we have the veto of if they do get serious bat sh-t crazy we can just ignore it



posted on Dec, 14 2015 @ 04:53 AM
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a reply to: Metallicus

I did not hear many positive minds when the time was before/at the time and after the decisions to join up EU, matter of fact many people felt that how EU is going to drive their country to ruins and things that were promised to get votes i guess, were soon forget by the "leaders". Then there was the EU president that nobody knows, probably not even today, i think he was chosen by rich elite people who actually runs the whole EU now and not chosen by EU people.

Then there is all the time other countries whom need to save their banks for collapsing and if they did collapse they would take whole country with em, i guess... So we need to send them tons of money so their banks leaders can be smiley again...

I am going to say that EU in idea could be cool but indeed at very least to me whole EU seems to be just another scale of "pyramid scams" and it is working, things like this EU is the reason for world full of wars and chaos, this is what is it going, thats my POV i cannot say how others feels, perhaps today they would agree some what?



posted on Dec, 14 2015 @ 06:37 AM
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originally posted by: ZeussusZ
a reply to: Metallicus

I think it was Ireland that voted no. Then TPTB said hang on we will have to have a vote again because the people voted the wrong way. It was always going to happen no matter what.



No, they didn't vote no to joining the EU, it was for the Lisburn treaty. The UK didn't vote either way if I remember rightly, didn't need to as we aren't in the Eurozone.



posted on Dec, 14 2015 @ 06:38 AM
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Gotta day some strange responses and perspectives.

Simple fact is its mutually beneficial, on so many different levels, travel,trade, rights, etc etc. Yes there are downfalls like all systems.

It's really not that hard to understand.
The UK are unfortunately treated differently for our reluctance to join the euro currency. As a result we now have to give a larger percentage to Brussels as the years go on.
But then it becomes about euro zone and European union.

Yes it's annoying being told how many immigrants we have to take but isn't it the same in america. The country has a quota that conflicts with state quotas.

edit on 14-12-2015 by rossacus because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 14 2015 @ 07:08 AM
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we agreed to trade with europe nothing more,but the uk politicians have allowed them to take over our laws,
this is something the english people hate that europe can now decide our laws.
we hate our politicians for this and spitting on our dead of word war 2 who fought to keep british law and many gave their lifes.

the government have deliberatly delayed the vote waiting for most who served then to have died.
but we will never forget ,we want out also nothing will change on a finance level as we will still trade and we already have separate currencies .

out now give us the vote you corrupt politicians



posted on Dec, 14 2015 @ 07:25 AM
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originally posted by: Shiloh7




The delightfully tragic, yet funny thing is that we think we live in a democracy but its actually a very controlled dictatorship in the UK and we are still serfs. We have a vote, but we don't seem to get what we voted for and two party politics with each party joined at the hip gives only the elite's agenda as choice.

I suspect most Americans wouldn't agree with many of its foreign policies, but can they do more?


I think you have nailed it, most country's are dictatorships
Politicians don't serve the people they serve each other

Look at the US, it's about money not politics, the clintons and Bushes.
Why did the US hand their soverinty to Washington

Australia is a two party system, we get duds every election, it's not about the people anymore




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