Kids Busted for Pot, Forced to be Snitches by Cops – Sent to their Deaths in the War on Drugs

a reply to: dreamingawake

Now I'm for deregulating drugs and see the whole war against drugs as a horrible failure, but to say FORCE is being deceptive at best.

Cops at the Tallahassee Police Department told Rachel she faces four years in prison, or she could help them carry out their biggest drug bust in recent history.

They gave her an option and she took it.

Senseless and Stupid that she is sentenced to 4 years yes, but she made the choice just like when she made a choice to buy illegal drugs.

a reply to: paradoxious

True that, mate.
If you don't want to be in a bad situation, don't put yourself in bad situations

p.s. lol oh the poor people of the Darwin Awards xD

Using someone clueless and naive like that sucks.

It's what undercover cops are for.


How did 20 cops lose one car ?

That's what helicopters are for .

a reply to: luthier

True. I get that wholeheartedly.

Fitting people up is a well known police tactic.
That's why where I'm from we don't deal with them.


Some people are not enlightened to the notion that just because they're an informant they're still expendable to the police.

Sad world.

originally posted by: luthier

originally posted by: paradoxious
Growing up, I was taught that if I don't want to be put in a bad situation, do not do anything that might lead to being in that situation.

Something to think about, eh?

Well lucky you..some peoples parents smoke crack or could care less about their kids. I have been a wrestling coach for high risk kids and let me tell you not everybody has guidance .

Even if they do they make mistakes.

Even if you break the law the punishment is supposed to fit the crime. This girl wasn t running a college drug cartel.

Like I said, don't put yourself into the position. So, bad decision.

Too bad accountability and responsibility seems to have fallen by the wayside. Guess those teachers she had the previous portion of her life didn't do much about teaching those skills.

originally posted by: paradoxious

originally posted by: luthier

originally posted by: paradoxious
Growing up, I was taught that if I don't want to be put in a bad situation, do not do anything that might lead to being in that situation.

Something to think about, eh?

Well lucky you..some peoples parents smoke crack or could care less about their kids. I have been a wrestling coach for high risk kids and let me tell you not everybody has guidance .

Even if they do they make mistakes.

Even if you break the law the punishment is supposed to fit the crime. This girl wasn t running a college drug cartel.

Like I said, don't put yourself into the position. So, bad decision.

Too bad accountability and responsibility seems to have fallen by the wayside. Guess those teachers she had the previous portion of her life didn't do much about teaching those skills.

Guess you haven't been to school in a while. Or have much contact with kids. It ain't like it used to be.

Like I said I teach several classes in judo and wrestling from middle school to adults. I have kids who eat aty house every night and then I drop them off at their grandparents or aunts house where there are several other kids getting dumped off.

The working poor are also working constantly making the whole latch key situation pretty extreme. You can't judge people based on your own upbringing.

Try a little empathy.

originally posted by: rukia
a reply to: luthier

You can always have a public defender. That's your right, legally. She must have agreed to a really bad deal. It's tragic.

a reply to: GBP/JPY

That's nuts dude. It's called get a lawyer and don't say a word. And anyone who rats on a dealer is totally classless scum. But they don't deserve to die or anything. And that's why you don't mess with dealers of any kind. Because they always have guns. It's just insane that she'd agree. I cannot wrap my mind around it. Why didn't she just jump out of the car? Like...why...?

When asked if he tells young informants that they have the right to talk to a lawyer, Sallee happily said, “No. I do not. I tell you you have a right to talk to a lawyer if I’m going to ask you incriminating questions. If we’re talking about your becoming an informant, I don’t have to tell you that you have a right to a lawyer.

-Main Source

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: luthier

True. I get that wholeheartedly.

Fitting people up is a well known police tactic.
That's why where I'm from we don't deal with them.


Some people are not enlightened to the notion that just because they're an informant they're still expendable to the police.

Sad world.

Sorry if I get snippy about this stuff. I work with kids all the time who have issues. I have been assaulted myself from a drug dealer trying to get his corner boy back (strangely enough also defended by a drug dealer who knows what I am doing with the program ).

I have some good cop friends as students who try and help but this crap happens all the time. Usually to scared or naive people. They are very convincing if you aren't educated that you are doomed.

originally posted by: interupt42
a reply to: dreamingawake

Now I'm for deregulating drugs and see the whole war against drugs as a horrible failure, but to say FORCE is being deceptive at best.

Cops at the Tallahassee Police Department told Rachel she faces four years in prison, or she could help them carry out their biggest drug bust in recent history.

They gave her an option and she took it.

Senseless and Stupid that she is sentenced to 4 years yes, but she made the choice just like when she made a choice to buy illegal drugs.

How is it deceptive when what they did to her is beyond deceptive? She was ignorant to the fact of what she was she was about to get into. Source illustrates that she would have been safe and was restricted to options such as see above about the lawyer. In which Rachel's Law hopes to change but as what I shared in the Op. Any changes are still pending at this time about how these young informants are dealt with.

originally posted by: luthier

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: luthier

True. I get that wholeheartedly.

Fitting people up is a well known police tactic.
That's why where I'm from we don't deal with them.


Some people are not enlightened to the notion that just because they're an informant they're still expendable to the police.

Sad world.

Sorry if I get snippy about this stuff. I work with kids all the time who have issues. I have been assaulted myself from a drug dealer trying to get his corner boy back (strangely enough also defended by a drug dealer who knows what I am doing with the program ).

I have some good cop friends as students who try and help but this crap happens all the time. Usually to scared or naive people. They are very convincing if you aren't educated that you are doomed.

Well said. Authorities are taking advantage of these young people because they can.

originally posted by: dreamingawake

originally posted by: interupt42
a reply to: dreamingawake

Now I'm for deregulating drugs and see the whole war against drugs as a horrible failure, but to say FORCE is being deceptive at best.

Cops at the Tallahassee Police Department told Rachel she faces four years in prison, or she could help them carry out their biggest drug bust in recent history.

They gave her an option and she took it.

Senseless and Stupid that she is sentenced to 4 years yes, but she made the choice just like when she made a choice to buy illegal drugs.

How is it deceptive when what they did to her is beyond deceptive? She was ignorant to the fact of what she was she was about to get into. Source illustrates that she would have been safe and was restricted to options such as see above about the lawyer. In which Rachel's Law hopes to change but as what I shared in the Op. Any changes are still pending at this time about how these young informants are dealt with.

It's also very possible she was high at the time. Thats a common thing for cops to do. I have even heard of them letting addicts come down a bit and then start their routine full well knowing the addict will do what ever to get out and get high again.

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
Police have been doing this for decades...

But let's be real here...
No one is forced into snitchin.

It's a conscious decision solely by the snitch.

Sure. Bit like religion is not forced on you. But love god or spend eternity in hell burning on fire.

Except prison is real unlike that rubbish religion espouses.

originally posted by: luthier
Try a little empathy.

I have empathy, and sympathy for the kids being short-changed by both the parents and the education system in the US.

Sadly, economic situations have changed over the past (more than) few decades. That doesn't absolve the parents of their responsibilities, though. Nor does that justify what the educational systems are doing.

It used to be the "Three R's": Reading, wRiting and aRithmetic.

Now, there are more like 6 R's:
Reading
wRiting
aRithmetic (in some convoluted massacre of logical thought processes)
Remember
Regurgitate
Relent

And they forget other R's, like:
Responsibility
Restitution
Remorse
Regret
Respect


I find it oddly humorous that my 10yo nephew asks why things now aren't like they were depicted on Little House on the Prairie. All I can really tell him is that times change, things change, and now people like Nellie are in charge.

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: dreamingawake

I read it.

4 years for possession or snitch.

Some people would choose the sentence.


Choose being the operative word.

"Forced" as in he was coerced into the deal that they promised here would go well as opposed the other offer.

a reply to: laminatedsoul

To go with your analogy...

Yes some believe because of eternal damnation.

I'm not one of them though.


I believe for other reasons.

originally posted by: paradoxious

originally posted by: [post=20128816]Try a little empathy.

I have empathy, and sympathy for the kids being short-changed by both the parents and the education system in the US.

Sadly, economic situations have changed over the past (more than) few decades. That doesn't absolve the parents of their responsibilities, though. Nor does that justify what the educational systems are doing.

It used to be the "Three R's": Reading, wRiting and aRithmetic.

Now, there are more like 6 R's:
Reading
wRiting
aRithmetic (in some convoluted massacre of logical thought processes)
Remember
Regurgitate
Relent

And they forget other R's, like:
Responsibility
Restitution
Remorse
Regret
Respect


I find it oddly humorous that my 10yo nephew asks why things now aren't like they were depicted on Little House on the Prairie. All I can really tell him is that times change, things change, and now people like Nellie are in charge.

No I never said the parents aren't responsible.

I have decided to use my monetarily useless skills as a luthier, sound engineer/musician, and Judoka to teach kids the stuff that used to be present in society. It's exhausting and I have almost no privacy anymore because I am constantly doing stuff these kids parents should be doing. I also have three kids and that's hard enough and we live in a nice area. I am still constantly monitoring and making sure my son isn't out doing things he isn't supposed to. It's hard when the other parents aren't on board and he goes to a sleep over comes back and tells me they were up all night watching the walking dead and dad I had a redbull (11 at the time)

Even the middle class parents who have the means are failing kids.

originally posted by: paradoxious

originally posted by: luthier
Try a little empathy.

I have empathy, and sympathy for the kids being short-changed by both the parents and the education system in the US.


I find it oddly humorous that my 10yo nephew asks why things now aren't like they were depicted on Little House on the Prairie. All I can really tell him is that times change, things change, and now people like Nellie are in charge.

You're short changing your nephew by not explaining that America was Never as it was depicted in Little House on the Prairie, which was very loosely based on Laura Ingalls Wilders real life pioneer family who....skipped out on paying rent, incurred massive debt, were incredibly racist...etc etc etc.

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: ghostrager

Most do.

Some don't.


That's where parenting skills come into play.

You mean parenting skills like gun nutters actually living up to their chants of "I want a number of guns so I can protect myself and my family" should actually go out and say that drug dealers ARE in fact a threat to their family?
Perhaps even to the point where the concerned gun owning parents decide to run the drug dealers out of their neighborhood?

originally posted by: HolgerTheDane2

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: ghostrager

Most do.

Some don't.


That's where parenting skills come into play.

You mean parenting skills like gun nutters actually living up to their chants of "I want a number of guns so I can protect myself and my family" should actually go out and say that drug dealers ARE in fact a threat to their family?
Perhaps even to the point where the concerned gun owning parents decide to run the drug dealers out of their neighborhood?

Uh? Thats highly illegal. It's called vigilantism.
It's also an extremely naive point. Drug dealers are ruthless non law abiding citizens often willing to kill even children. Thats a great way to get a lot of people killed. It's not a Rambo movie.
Stopping someone from attacking you personally is much different than looking for trouble.

I donno man, if you don't have a twisted gang code of honor or conduct, snitching may look easier especially if told that your back is got, going to prison if you are a gang member may even earn you street creds and respect not to mention connections and skills made in prison, these average smokers and small time dealers, going to prison and ruining a potential degree and career not to mention embarrassment to family (not to be underestimated) maybe too much to risk especially if there is none you can talk to.

This insane war on drugs needs to end yesterday.