Turkey closed the straits of Bosphorus - Russia gives a last chance/warning - Turkey reopens

originally posted by: DISRAELI
a reply to: Ploutonas
Have you found the clause which specifies the rent being paid to Britain?
I'm still curious about that one.
I'm not sure that our Chancellor of the Exchequer knows about it.

we did in my class, I can ask my teachers if you wish to give you more details, tomorrow. I also think that if a boat requests a pilot, it is usually a brit (in Bosporus straits). In canals, straits, rivers, etc... Boats most of the times are forced to use pilots, or some as a request.

a reply to: Ploutonas
Please do, because I'm not going to believe it otherwise.
Simply because the payment of rent to another country woud be such an abnormal situation.

originally posted by: DISRAELI
a reply to: Ploutonas
Please do, because I'm not going to believe it otherwise.
Simply because the payment of rent to another country woud be such an abnormal situation.

It shouldn't be abnormal at all, its like cyrpus today, brits have by force a perma base there and they also complaining if Cyprus wish to offer a perma base to Russians. Not only cyprus, also many other countries. Also Crete Island reunited with my country in 1908 under a british treaty, that said after 100 years, Creta would decide with a referendum, if they wish to unite with british(control) again. But it didnt happened. Thats why you may also find even in nowadays, some propaganda with a Cretan flag different from my country. But cretans are very angry...

originally posted by: intrptr
Turks shouldn't be in Syria…?

Russians shouldn't be in Ukraine...?

a reply to: Ploutonas
The English word "rent" means a money payment.
So what you need to establish is that Turkey is paying money to Britain for the right to use the straits.
That is what you have claimed.

originally posted by: DISRAELI
a reply to: Ploutonas
The English word "rent" means a money payment.
So what you need to establish is that Turkey is paying money to Britain for the right to use the straits.
That is what you have claimed.

That is what I have learned and I told you I will ask for more information tomorrow. By searching the history of it, the league of nations owned it and turn it into an international territory. They made 2 agreements after that, but there is no information what was the gains for the LN. Because in order to be an agreement, league of nations must gain something is it? I will ask my teachers for more of it. In our lesson we dont focus in the straits, just a small reference, that is not entirely turkish.

and by reading this paragraph, its very clear that turks dont own it... they may have the authority, as its inside their country, but they dont own it...

read : Following the war, the 1920 Treaty of Sèvres demilitarized the strait and made it an international territory under the control of the League of Nations. This was amended after the Greco-Turkish War (1919–1922) under the 1923 Treaty of Lausanne which restored the straits to Turkey but allowed all foreign warships to traverse the straits freely. Turkey rejected the terms of this treaty and subsequently remilitarized the area. The reversion to this old regime was formalized under the Montreux Convention of July 1936. The convention, which is still technically in force today, treats the straits as an international shipping lane, but Turkey retains the right to restrict the naval traffic of non–Black Sea nations (like Greece or Algeria).

and here is the pdf file of Montreux sam.baskent.edu.tr...

a reply to: intrptr

Or an escalation on the part of Turkey on behalf of the Umma.

a reply to: bjarneorn

i like the way you think friend.

originally posted by: intrptr

Nice try. The armed turkish militias ("Turkmen", what a gentle Euphemism) are also trying to overthrow syria, illegally.

How does one can legally overthrow a government ?

Turkmen has right to live on the same land they have been living for 1000 years or more .

Bosphorous is not closed and there is no need to close it either .

The agreement that Turks had with allied powers Britain was not they can't charge for the crossing as far as I know . I think this agreement comes to an end by 2023 .
Turks are opening up a second crossing west of Bosphorous .I live on Bosphorous and I can see the ship traffic day or night .
Today everyhing seemed normal .

a reply to: 23432

I think the mindset is they closed it to Russian military vessels.

a reply to: Ploutonas

Turkey has full sovereign control of the straights.
Turkey does not pay rent to any nation.
The Soviet Union tried to force Turkey into allowing joint Soviet control, which Turkey refused.
The League of nations was involved due to WWI.
The UN was involved due to the end of WWII.
Turkey is not a signatory to UNCLOS so it does not apply.
The Montreux agreement spells out the terms, deferring to Turkish law.
Any member that signed the Montreux has the ability, every 5 years, to propose changes to the agreement.
In order for a change request to be valid, it must be supported by 1 other member - Article 29.


Given members of the Russian government have talked about nuking Turkey -

ARTICLE 21

Should Turkey consider herself to be threatened with imminent danger of war she shall have the right to
apply the provisions of Article 20 of the present Convention.

[be]ARTICLE 20
In time of war, Turkey being belligerent, the provisions of Articles 10 to 18 shall not be applicable; the
passage of warships shall be left entire y to the discretion of the Turkish Government.

Maybe Russia shouldn't lip off and threaten as much as they do. Closing the straights to Russia effectively made their 11th hour misadventure in Ukraine even more damaging and worthless. Nothing like a Russian warm water port in a large lake.

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: 23432

I think the mindset is they closed it to Russian military vessels.

Some people want to see Russia fight the Turk so they need to believe anything . It makes no sense to close the straights at this point in the game .

a reply to: 23432

It does as a means to limit Russian military naval activity. Russia is still under sanctions for their invasion and illeagal occupation in Ukraine. Putins justification, one of many, was the naval base. That base just became worthless if Russian military vessels cant exit the black sea. It also means the Russians made no gains by going into Ukraine / Crimea.

Russia wasted a lot of time, money, political capital and manpower and only got sanctioned and a lake for their black sea fleet to play in in return.

originally posted by: Whereismypassword
Wtf are Turkey playing at if this is true? Utter madness

Cool it's not closed was weather related

I think it's them being ordered to do things by NATO or the West.

But even still, some of these countries like Turkey, while having the West on their side, will get flattened in a serious regional or global war by someone like Russia.

originally posted by: 23432

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: 23432

I think the mindset is they closed it to Russian military vessels.

Some people want to see Russia fight the Turk so they need to believe anything . It makes no sense to close the straights at this point in the game .

You watch. Todays rumor is tomorrows policy.

(Its all a game) played by dangerous fools.

originally posted by: Quetzalcoatl14
originally posted by: Whereismypassword

I think it's them being ordered to do things by NATO or the West.

Shhh, there is no NATO, (waves hands)… ooonnnly Turkeeeey.

But even still, some of these countries like Turkey, while having the West on their side, will get flattened in a serious regional or global war by someone like Russia.

The Turks made their own bed, now they can lie in it.

The US military aren't going to protect any but their own assets there. Turkeys got the Russians, the Kurds and the Syrians all pissed at them now, all because they bedded with the West.

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: 23432

It does as a means to limit Russian military naval activity. Russia is still under sanctions for their invasion and illeagal occupation in Ukraine. Putins justification, one of many, was the naval base. That base just became worthless if Russian military vessels cant exit the black sea. It also means the Russians made no gains by going into Ukraine / Crimea.

Russia wasted a lot of time, money, political capital and manpower and only got sanctioned and a lake for their black sea fleet to play in in return.

dont be so tough with russians, they wouldnt invade, if usa didnt cause a tragic elections totally faked and then smuggle all the uckranian gold into US and part of this gold found in scandinavian countries later on.. because the scandinavian countries gold in the american bank, become a smoke. USA took all the uckranian gold and IMF control and a puppet government... Russian took Crimea.. half/half.
Not to speak for the smuggled body parts in EU. So lets not speak about uckraine at all. This is not a Uckranian topic. I have to read for uckranian news for about a year, so lets not make it crimaia here. The only thing I ve read recently, is that the turkish minorities, trying to create a huge problem to russia, but not very specific things.

as for the straits thing, I will have more info tomorrow.

originally posted by: intrptr
originally posted by: Quetzalcoatl14
originally posted by: Whereismypassword

I think it's them being ordered to do things by NATO or the West.

Shhh, there is no NATO, (waves hands)… ooonnnly Turkeeeey.

But even still, some of these countries like Turkey, while having the West on their side, will get flattened in a serious regional or global war by someone like Russia.

The Turks made their own bed, now they can lie in it.

The US military aren't going to protect any but their own assets there. Turkeys got the Russians, the Kurds and the Syrians all pissed at them now, all because they bedded with the West.

Even if the West stays in alliance with them, such countries will got stomped on in the process of a more serious conflict. Maybe they only join such alliances because they think the deterrent is greater protection than them solo.

a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14
I think ultimately these puppet regimes beholden to the west don't really care what happens to their people. They have become so wealthy they can afford to flee if it gets too hot, seeking sanctuary in the West like so many before them.

They have placed their countries people in grave danger for material greed and lust for power, an illusion granted them by the power and influence of the current world order…

list of American puppet dictators