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Turkey shot down Russian Jet: reportedly by two F16's

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posted on Nov, 24 2015 @ 02:53 PM
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a reply to: bjarneorn

Yes there actions are regardless of how much you wish they werent.




posted on Nov, 24 2015 @ 02:54 PM
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originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: ISawItFirst

Not at 6000 meters is not.


Perhaps not a manpad, but the point i was making is perhaps they have been supplied wirh more advanced AA equipment, which is what they are covering for.

Im not up on all AA capabilities, is there nothing capable of taking that plane from the ground?



posted on Nov, 24 2015 @ 02:54 PM
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originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: SBargisen

Turkey can shoot down aircraft violating its airspace. If turkey is attacked by russia and invokes article V nATO is involved. Article V cannot be invoked if a NATO member starts a war.

Turkeys actions are within the nato charter as well as the un charter.

A document from 1953 does not apply.


Exactly. Turkey did shoot an aircaft, that may have violated its airspace. BUT! The aircraft was within the syrian borders, so Turkey did technically start a war with Russia.



posted on Nov, 24 2015 @ 02:55 PM
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originally posted by: rigel4

originally posted by: victor7
Turkey better bring things down to a cool otherwise it will

a) Lose NATO membership

b) See an abrupt formation of Kurdistan

c) a huge wave of Turkmen refugees arriving to settle in Turkey


It;s not very often that I agree with you.. but on this occasion
i concur exactly with you.



HOW DARE THIS DEGENERATE NATION BRING US ALL TO A BRINK OF WW3..........to fulfill its DEGENERATE AGENDA.

World has to do something about the DEGENERATE mindset of certain nations.



posted on Nov, 24 2015 @ 02:56 PM
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originally posted by: victor7

HOW DARE THIS DEGENERATE NATION BRING US ALL TO A BRINK OF WW3..........to fulfill its DEGENERATE AGENDA.

World has to do something about the DEGENERATE mindset of certain nations.


I agree. Kick Turkey out, let them swim in their own lake.



posted on Nov, 24 2015 @ 02:57 PM
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originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: SBargisen

Turkey can shoot down aircraft violating its airspace. If turkey is attacked by russia and invokes article V nATO is involved. Article V cannot be invoked if a NATO member starts a war.

Turkeys actions are within the nato charter as well as the un charter.

A document from 1953 does not apply.


I'm not getting into Rules of engagement with you , suffice to say
that, by far the most appropriate response Turkey should have taken. was to escort
The Russian war planes out of its airspace.

It could still be proven that the Russian planes were on an Exit track heading out of Turkey.
This should never have happened.

The UK get buzzed every other day by Russian bombers/ they are intercepted
and peacefully escorted past or away from UK airspace.

Turkey #ed up ..



posted on Nov, 24 2015 @ 02:57 PM
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originally posted by: stuthealien
a reply to: Xcathdra

we will riot if you think we are going to back cameron in a war against russia for turkey.
there will be real english fighting him we will not support him .
he can not just do as he likes you know,or it will bring severe unrest something cameron
will not control ,if you do not have the support of the people you will have no force to fight for you.


We are completely incapable of fighting Russia or anyone else.

Our armed forces have been depleted to such a level that we couldn't fight a ground war, couldn't fight a naval war, and couldn't fight an air war either.

We have had to go begging parts for the tornados we still have in service from other countries that have them, we don't even have spares for the few aircraft we do have.

If we entered into a major offensive against anyone our pitiful stock of cruise missiles would be gone in one day, lose 30 to 40 aircraft and the RAF would be on it's knees, and a half a dozen ships sunk and the navy is done for.

So Cameron would need to invoke consciption, and fortunately for us the feckless politicians we have had for the last 20 - 30 years have done such a great job of rebranding patriotism into xenophobia and racism that no one would enlist.

We are a toothless tiger - a mere pussycat - Putin (Russia) could finish of Dave (the UK) with his little finger.
edit on -06:0020152America/ChicagoTue, 24 Nov 2015 14:59:09 -0600_thAmerica/Chicago1159 by Power_Semi because: typo



posted on Nov, 24 2015 @ 02:57 PM
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edit on 24-11-2015 by stuthealien because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 24 2015 @ 02:57 PM
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originally posted by: SBargisen

originally posted by: 23432
Turkmen ain't going anywhere ; they will fight for their land .


Wow... Muslims that actually fight for their own country, well done turks! You just earned a slight bit more respect from me.

Anyway, I am not dissing Nato, I am dissing Turkey. I am not a fan of Turkey, and I don't think they should be a part of EU, atleast not with Erdogan in command. And I strongly feel, that we aren't told everything, yet somehow I feel that Turkey did something they shouldn't have done. The first thing they did was to call the US "Hey, uuuh.... We shot down a Russian jet fighter."
- What they should have done was to (As another member wrote.) Document the Russian fighter jet violating Turkeys air space. I also found a Russian source stating that Turkey DID NOT warn the Russian jet. Yet somehow all we hear in the western media is "Russian jet shot down, was warned 10 times!" Alright? Who knows, maybe we are being lied to, maybe the Russians are lying. Either way, Russia is as we speak moving heavy war ships down to the areas, don't remember the names of those areas. And ordered them to SHOOT ANYTHING THAT THREATENS RUSSIAN SOLDIERS.

So.... Turkey should NOT have shot that plane down. That was the dumbest # they have done in a loooooong while.
I really really REALLY hope Nato kicks out Turkey.

Btw, why does Turkey fight the Kurds?




NATO doesn't exist without Turks .

If Nato Dissolves then Turks USA & UK would ally with one another in the area .

Current Turkish Parliament has over 170 Kurdish MP's out of 550 MP's in total.

Most Kurds would side with Turks against the Crusaders , no matter what .

Kurds are the children of Selahaddin , not idiot IE centric morons .

You are just another Anti Turkism sufferer ; in your own words , you already are the judge , jury and the executioner .



When sh1t hits the fan , some people stand their ground , Turks are one such people.



posted on Nov, 24 2015 @ 02:59 PM
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originally posted by: rigel4

Turkey #ed up ..

16 second escort... heck, this in normal circumstances this is a none event.
Why Turkey acted the way it does makes no sense.
Now if the plane was flying towards Ankara now that's another story.



posted on Nov, 24 2015 @ 03:00 PM
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originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: bjarneorn

Yes there actions are regardless of how much you wish they werent.



You're logic is flawed ... just a bunch of emotional babble.

Talk about the buffer zone, but forget it applies both ways ... but it doesn't to you. In you're own feeble mind, your'e always right ...

Lucky for you, Putin is a decent guy ... if it was me, I'd have turned this rock into glass already. As I know, Putin's "decency" is his flaw ... he'll lose, I know that.



edit on 24/11/2015 by bjarneorn because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 24 2015 @ 03:00 PM
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a reply to: Power_Semi

i would sign up for putins side ,maybe i would get to say hi to snowden as well



posted on Nov, 24 2015 @ 03:00 PM
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a reply to: rigel4

Let me ask -

How many violations is required in order to draw a line and say no more? If this were the first time russia violated turkish airspace I would agree their response was over the top. Since its not the first time Russia OR Syria violated turkeys airspace, with turkey making it known what the response will be, turkey acted appropriately.

as for ROE that was because he tried using roe's from 1953 - hardly applicable.



posted on Nov, 24 2015 @ 03:00 PM
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originally posted by: SBargisen

originally posted by: victor7

HOW DARE THIS DEGENERATE NATION BRING US ALL TO A BRINK OF WW3..........to fulfill its DEGENERATE AGENDA.

World has to do something about the DEGENERATE mindset of certain nations.


I agree. Kick Turkey out, let them swim in their own lake.



NATO supports Turks .

Do you two follow anything other then your own imaginations ?



posted on Nov, 24 2015 @ 03:01 PM
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originally posted by: 23432
NATO doesn't exist without Turks .


Without Turkey in Nato, we would merely be; Canada, USA + all of Europe minus Sweden. I can see how Nato wouldn't exist without turks.



posted on Nov, 24 2015 @ 03:01 PM
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originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: crazyewok

lol ok.. you keep on that wishful thinking.. And again he doesnt need approval, as you claim, to decare war.

He is not bypassing parliament since they are not in the fold in the first place.

Cant you read or are you choosing to be ignorant to fit your little war fantasy?

I already said I know he "officially" does not need parliament’s permission
What I am saying is Realistically he does.
If he unilaterally declares war without passing it through parliament (which all our resent wars have) he will piss off a good chunk or parliament and the public.
There is a debate already here about moving the power to parliament officially as the idea of the power resting in the PM in the royal prerogative is outdated.



posted on Nov, 24 2015 @ 03:02 PM
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a reply to: bjarneorn

I didnt see you guys bitching when syria shot down a turkish aircraft for barely violating its airspace. Turkeys response is just as valid.



posted on Nov, 24 2015 @ 03:02 PM
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originally posted by: stuthealien
a reply to: Power_Semi

i would sign up for putins side ,maybe i would get to say hi to snowden as well


Me too actually, I'm sick to the back teeth of our lying, hypocritical, self serving, politically correct moron MPs and politicians.

Putin is like a breath of fresh air, and i think a lot of us would be on the side of the Russians in this.



posted on Nov, 24 2015 @ 03:03 PM
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originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: voyger2

You mean is it sufficient for russia to start a war by violating turkish airspace?

As i stated before, if it was a coalition aircraft downed in syria by the syrians your response would be they violated syrian airspace.

There is lot of violations of airspace world wide, even, there are lot's of maritme violations also world wide (territorial or borders). That doesn't give anyone the right to shoot at sight, it would be caotic. Hell, I can hold my breath for more than 17 seconds. Turkish airforce applied excessive force for a minimal threat in time and space.



posted on Nov, 24 2015 @ 03:03 PM
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a reply to: rigel4

Actually, Putin messed up as he had already been warned by Turkey about it last month, and he disregarded their warnings, and lost a plane.

Guess he should have listened.




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