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WAR: FBI Charges Laser Suspect Under Patriot Act: Despite Acknowledging Not A Terrorist Act

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posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 10:47 AM
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Dumbya


It is truly sad that we here in the USA have leaders who through their actions and words continually invite references like "Dumbya". How sad and apt.




posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 11:37 AM
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patriot act abuses....
on farenheit 9-11, they warned of this....
even had the name and phone number of the person in charge of patriot operations, who was GUARANTEING that it would never be abused... the phone number was shortly thereafter cut off.

anyone remember the commercials that said "if you do drugs, you are helping terrorists"

am i the only one who sees that the this wind is not blowing but rolling across every law in our country?



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 12:16 PM
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This is complete BS. This guy should have been charged under local laws for something like criminal mischief. The patriot act didn't have to be brought into it at all...the FBI shouldn't have been investigating it.

Do any of you HONESTLY believe this guy intended to bring down the plane?
Seriously. How many people do you know who might just go to a store, purchase a laser pointer, mess around with it in their backyards, and then just harmlessly try to see if they could shine it on the airplane passing overhead? It's not being stupid, as this guy most likely had absolutely no idea he was doing anything wrong...he just got really lucky and shined the laser right in the cockpit I guess, but he had no intent whatsoever to "bring down the plane". At least, that's what it sounds like.

I wonder where the ass(croft) kissers are now to keep saying the patriot act is no threat to civil liberties, as only terrorists are being affected. Yeah right. This guy is a real threat to national security. Give me a break.

[edit on 5-1-2005 by Shoktek]



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 12:28 PM
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In Singapore, we have what is called the Internal Security Act. It is similar to the Patriot Act. The Internal security Act has been around for ages. I have to stop writing about it now as I am afraid.



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 12:40 PM
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I don't believe this has anything to do with the Patriot Act. I don't believe this has anything to do with "Terrorism" either.

I think what we have here is an example of a waste of brain matter proving his worthlessness to the world. This person is clearly a moron. Personally, I'd ban him from interacting with the rest of society, particularly his children (who he tried to blame for all this) because someone like him will only make other people dumber.

Those of you who are making light of the situation clearly aren't very bright. Firstly, did you find it funny when those kids threw a turkey at the lady's car? Was that harmless fun? Would it be harmless fun to put debris on train tracks? Oh hahaha he shined a blinding light at the pilots! Wouldn't it be a silly little prank if they crashed!

If you think a laser pointer is a toy, the only conclusion I can arrive at is that you've either never seen one, or you are unable to read the english language. The damn things are LOADED with warnings. There's warnings on the packaging, on the box, on the device itself. The product can cause blindness. There's nothing "toy" like or "funny" about that.

To the person who wondered about glass floors... Perhaps you didn't think of the fact that the aircraft was coming in for a landing, and the person wasn't shining the light from directly underneath it. Light is fully capable of travelling at angles other than straight up is it not?

In any event, I agree with all of you that this is not a terrorist patriot act case at all, but making light of a potentially VERY dangerous situation shows a pitiful form of ignorance. Don't let your activism get in the way of your common sense. This guy did a VERY dangerous thing, and whether or not you agree with other issues doesn't change that.



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 12:41 PM
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such diversity in opinion here. But honestly, The guy did interfere with a mass transportation vehicle and that is in the patriot act so the use of the patriot act is justified. however the word terrorist is a bit misplaced on the guy obviously. I had an earlier view on this and i am correcting it now as i do believe that he is being properly dealt with. What he gets he deserves. The only thing that really sucks is iff his story of pointing at stars with his daughter is true than it is his own ignorance that screwed him by inadvertantly hitting the cockpit of a plane. hey who knows maybe its just bush acting on denial of ignorance.



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 12:52 PM
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Originally posted by Djarums
This guy did a VERY dangerous thing, and whether or not you agree with other issues doesn't change that.


Yes, but, if he is a moron as you say, he was probably too stupid to realize what he was doing...I doubt the intent was there to actually cause harm to anyone. I've used laser pointers before, but if some idiot who knows nothing about them tries one for a first time, he might just do something dumb like this.



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 01:26 PM
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Originally posted by specialasianX
So being in a gang is terrorism and now pointing lasers at people is terrorism... all i can say is watch out american pretty soon anything you do will be dubbed terrorism...

This is ridiculous... i hope Australia doesnt ever impose a stupid law like this.


They already have, helping to crack down on this New Zealand guy:

www.aardvark.co.nz...

I would expect a nation with some of the most oppressive and restrictive immigration laws in the civilized world can afford to be a little less cranky towards their people and neighbors (lets not forget the universal ban on private gun ownership, too)


JAK

posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 02:50 PM
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I think this initial misuse of the act is huge news and does not bode at all well for the future. For those who predicted, who shouted about such things, the fruition of their concerns will be bittersweet.

To me it brings to mind the Poison Girls 'Persons Unknown' regarding the The 1979 'Persons Unknown' Trial


Source - Guardian Newspaper Article
After release I came to England, only to be arrested by Special Branch and charged, with 'persons unknown', of conspiring to cause explosions. The case was variously dubbed the Persons Unknown trial or the Anarchists trial - we were all voluble if unsophisticated young enemies of the state, all states. We also had absolutely nothing to do with any explosions. After several months in custody, this charge was dropped and a different conspiracy charge preferred. Opening the Crown's case at the Old Bailey a year later, the prosecutor said we had conspired 'to overthrow society'. The jury acquitted us on all counts.

If I remember correctly it was: "conspiring with persons unknown " to commit a crime "on dates unknown against persons unknown". Such actions plant great faith in the legal system.

For those who might say in this case that the offender was an idiot and deserved such a thing I think you are missing the point.


    Pastor Martin Niemller

      First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out--
      because I was not a communist;
      Then they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out--
      because I was not a socialist;
      Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out--
      because I was not a trade unionist;
      Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out--
      because I was not a Jew;
      Then they came for me--
      and there was no one left to speak out for me.

I really do think that unfortunately this is only the first of many.

Jack



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 02:52 PM
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Originally posted by Djarums
If you think a laser pointer is a toy, the only conclusion I can arrive at is that you've either never seen one, or you are unable to read the english language. The damn things are LOADED with warnings. There's warnings on the packaging, on the box, on the device itself. The product can cause blindness. There's nothing "toy" like or "funny" about that.

To the person who wondered about glass floors... Perhaps you didn't think of the fact that the aircraft was coming in for a landing, and the person wasn't shining the light from directly underneath it. Light is fully capable of travelling at angles other than straight up is it not?

Do you take the warnings on a box of Q-Tips seriously? I imagine your ears are pretty nasty.
Even your keyboard has a pretty serious warning, but you still use it, eh? Most of the warnings on things are for complete morons who can't read the warning anyway, and even if they could, they wouldn't understand it.

Admittedly, I don't know how high the plane was, but unless the guy lives right next door to the airport, there's not much chance he could've shined the light directly into the pilot's eyes. He was in his back yard! Even if the plane was landing, it would be very difficult.
Do you own a laser pointer? Try this. At night, try to shine it on a moving car's license plate and tell me how easy it is. Keep in mind, that car is going a lot slower than a jet.
To think it's even possible to shine someone in a jet in the eyes for more than a millisecond is nothing short of ridiculous. The beam is small, and has to be aimed very precisely. You sound like someone who's never played with a laser pointer before. They are toys, or that's all they're mostly used for. Sure, you can go blind, if you stare directly into one for a few hours, maybe.
Yes, I own one, and I've done all kinds of experiments with it. But mostly, I just have fun watching the dog chase the red dot.


[edit on 5-1-2005 by Damned]



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 03:53 PM
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every warning has a resulting idiot who is responsible for the creation of the warning. This is not bull either there are plenty of warnings that i see everyday and wonder why they are there, it must take some stupid people to be the cause of some of them.

If the plane was banking then it is also more than possible to shine the laser in the eyes of the pilot and the pilots also reported the laser being very brief so its completly possible. We should ask the guys on mythbusters to test this one.


XL5

posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 05:31 PM
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I can not believe all of you look past the facts just so you can argue or disscuss this! I almost think theres no point to post facts anymore, since no one finds facts to be too helpfull!

A 5mW laser pointer of any colour can not be held in some ones eyes long enough to do any damage at that distance, they never said how long the beam was in the pilots eyes for. It could have been some twitchy flashes.

If the man was hitler him self or even osama, if he got a class IIIa or IIIb laser from anywhere, he could not take the jet down and he should be charged with criminal mischief. If he had a pulsed solid state laser or any class IV laser, then I'd say there is intent to cause the jet to crash.

Red laser pointers have been pointed in drivers eye of all craft, you never heard about those cases because no one crashed or got blinded from them since 5mW can not blind. There would have been MANY jet and car crashes due to laser pointers if it were posible. The only reason you have heard about this is because "terrorist" and "PA" was mentioned and it causes fear for people who don't know the facts.

Maybe he thought it was a UFO and was signaling it. If he used a 20mW laser, then take his laser away and give him a year, if it was anything over 500mW then give him 3-5 years. But if its below 8-10mW then just take the batteries and tell him not to shine it at any one.

Look at the links.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu...

repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu...



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 05:41 PM
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If it is not a big deal, why were the local cops and the FBI trying to track this person down. Evedently, after reading these posts, a few of you have done what this man is accused of.

Do I truly think you should be charged under the patriot act, no, but it is in place and why should it not be used. This is a federal offense, and the FBI was involved. If the local sherrif caught twokids lighting up the local crop dusters plane, they go before a local magistrate.

This idiot did it while they were out looking for who did it. What a Freeakin arsewipe!!! It is such a stupid act, it makes me wonder if this is all a staged act to take away our fear that this is truly occuring for malicious means in many other states, for the last 6 months.

I would love to truly know wtf is going on....



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 05:53 PM
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Well people, for those that still believe that the NWO is never to become a reality there you have it, the Bush regime is here to stay, no wonder is a proposed build of 200 bed new prison expansion in Guantanamo.

I wonder how many will be build around, we have to make room for our very own American casualties of the patriot act.

And for those out there that still think that the patriot act is not for the American people better think again.



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 05:54 PM
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Well, of course this is going to happen. Read the passages in the patriot act again, it makes it crystal clear that it can be applied to "domestic terrorism" which is a vague and all-encompassing term for any disruptive activity against the state. You have been warned of these applications the moment the patriot act was proposed.

As Alternate Heaven said; you reap what you sow.


XL5

posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 06:58 PM
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It is a big deal just because 911 happend and it involved a jet OR some one did have a class IV yag laser and did damage the pilots eyes.

If the second was the case, the DoD or homeland security should inform the public that they are not to shine lasers at jets because it could be THOUGHT of as a terrorist attack. Not every one reads the news
!

This man, in this situation, with a 5mW laser had no intent or motive or ability to cause harm.
It be like playing chicken in a narrow hallway, theres not enough mass or speed to hurt any one, but it may frighten some people in some way and make em dance.



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 08:15 PM
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Since people are too lazy to actually read about the incident due to a lack of time (maybe too much time spent on Bush/NWO connections to this laser incident), I'll do the honors.

www.nydailynews.com...

You can check that article out because it answers a lot of questions some of you brought up, primarily the above poster "damned".

As stated in the article the plane was at approx 3,000 feet. As stated in the article the laser was Commercial Grade (not like your lil toy red dot shooter) used to test Fiber Optic Lines. Not shocking that it hit 3,000 feet considering that Green Lasers are offered to consumers as "novelties" which have a range of 9,000 feet in darkness. As can be seen here: www.thinkgeek.com...

While you're at it, since we're already doing some reading why not check out the Laser Institute's own safety page at: www.laserinstitute.org...
They state

"The energy a pointer can direct into the eye is many times brighter than staring directly at the sun."

and they relay one incident stating

She reported the incidents to her parents, adding that after the first exposure, everything looked green; after the second, she could temporarily not see out of her right eye.


I'm not saying these things are deadly weapons. But you must understand (if logic is an option here) that while piloting (and during landing of all times) a plane it's not funny to temporarily lose sight in an eye.

Last time I checked, Q-Tips don't cause retinal burns. Could misusing a Q-Tip cause damage? I'm sure. But this is a device that can actually cause damage during it's normal use and should be used responsibly. Not by a man with the intellect to blame an innocent 7 year old for his idiotic conduct.



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 08:20 PM
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Actually for him to be able to aim "directly" to the eyes of the pilot he most be a heck of a sharp shooter, and to me all these pilots are complaining is that they probably saw the laser in inside the cabin and said that was aiming to the eyes.

My son has one of those lasers hanging in his neck with his keys and for the look on the news about what kind it was it seems to me that somebody is exaggerating here.



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 08:24 PM
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Have you ever heard of glass reflecting light? Just wondering. I suppose you have decided that this entire incident was an invention of George Bush to arrest a 38 year old man in Jersey and it never happened.

Come on already. Read the article I posted. Two days later police were with that same pilot in a chopper trying to figure out where the light came from and the asshole pointed the light on them making it a joke to find him. Stupidest criminal award is waiting for him whenever he gets out of jail.

Oh and the news article said COMMERCIAL CLASS, not wearable keychains. Thanks.

[edit on 1-5-2005 by Djarums]



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 08:33 PM
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Originally posted by Djarums
Have you ever heard of glass reflecting light? Just wondering. I suppose you have decided that this entire incident was an invention of George Bush to arrest a 38 year old man in Jersey and it never happened.



I didn't said that you did and I guess I most have skipped the science class in high school sorry.

And I still think that this whole incident is a just over rated.

And by the way my husband goes on business trips all the time so I very much know what to pack or not for him with all the BS on the airports, thanks to 9/11 and "war on terror"



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