Convict sues after being denied sex change - wants Nebraska tax money to pay for it

Better part of valor.

Silence.

Night all. Thanks for an excellent topic and great conversation (at times.)

a reply to: Shamrock6

If the quote in your OP is the actual reasoning he gives, then screw him.

I don't think he needs to have that kind of medical paid for with a blasé attitude like that one.

originally posted by: murphy22
He was born a male. It's sad his parents failed him to become a man, accountable for his own actions. But why again, do the tax payers have to pay for his, doctor assisted mutilation? We used to have standards in this country.

Yeah, totally! The good ole days of locking up lesbians in mental institutions and Jim Crow laws. Wooooo! Our standards freakin' ROCKED back then, praise GAWD!

a reply to: ketsuko

The quote in the OP is direct from the article. The other quotes were me paraphrasing that one.

I would agree, though. Especially in light of what Gryphon provided in regards to the whole process of evaluation.

I understand the lack of empathy for this particular person, he's a horrible person. I don't think he should get anything other then counseling.

Now when it comes to non-violent offenders, such as someone with a drug problem, possibly someone who's addicted to drugs because of depression over gender issues , I would be much more likely to support some sort of help with their transitions as part of their rehabilitation.

I would hope all good people, regardless of their gender would find molesting a 3 yr old repugnant.

redacted

dont even know why the reply did not appear.. but pointless to have this post.

Redacted.

redated

a reply to: laminatedsoul

Calm down. Don't be so angry for no good reason. I have not seen anyone condoning his actions.

Now let's stick to the topic.

originally posted by: Deaf Alien
a reply to: laminatedsoul

Calm down. Don't be so angry for no good reason. I have not seen anyone condoning his actions.

Now let's stick to the topic.

I get attacked, and then told to calm down.

Nice work.

the topic was not left by myself. But I was warned for a post, in response to the attacks.

Back on topic.

The pedo should NOT be given his preferential optional surgery because it fits with some external lgbt agenda.

HE - not she - is a pervert criminal. raped a 3 year old child. should be kept away from society at all costs. Not given liberty because "she likes to feel pretty"...

1. The point was made here, repeatedly, that the individual we are discussing in Shamrock's OP has not and probably would not meet the medical requirements for sex reassignment treatments, specifically contrasted with the other case, posted by Benevolent Heretic, in which a trans* person who had been incarcerated had qualified for treatment and had been arbitrarily denied unfairly had won the right for treatment on appeal.

2. The point has also been made that no matter how repugnant, disgusting or repellent the crime is that someone is incarcerated for, as a culture, we do not arbitrarily deny medical treatment to prisoners because we don't accept the validity of their condition.

3. Several posters here tried to imply, ridiculously, that those of us who were making two these points are in favor of child molestation or are defending the crime of child molestation. As well, several posters made snide and content-empty comments about the reality of trans* concerns and medical treatment for that situation. Also, some who make the later comments also imply that accepting the scientific- and medically-established facts about trans* individuals is merely part of an LGBT political agenda which has no other merit.

No one has to "accept" the facts about trans* individuals, but that doesn't change the facts that they exist and have the same rights as any other American.

No one has to accept that providing appropriate medical treatment to prisoners is part of the unpleasant cultural duty of keeping them incarcerated, but that doesn't change the fact that it is both generally and specifically true as a matter of treating prisoners humanely EVEN when they have not treated other people so ... after all, I believe we can agree that we as a collective society choose to behave better and more ethically than those who commit crimes for which we incarcerate them.

Finally, no one here is saying that providing medical treatment to prisoners is in some way advocating for or attempting to excuse the heinous crimes they committed to get to jail in the first place, and such arguments are utterly ludicrous on their face.

a reply to: laminatedsoul

Perhaps if you could post without accusing those who disagree with you of supporting pedophiles or condoning child rape, your comments would've been left as is.

Unfortunately, you chose to not just get personal, but get wildly ugly about it as well.

And now you play the victim. Pretty amazing.

Its not the governments job to give you a sex change. Hes in jail. Its not a health spa. Enjoy your turkey bacon and used library books.

It is the government's job to provide needed medical treatment to incarcerated criminals.

We can debate whether sex reassignment surgery is needed medical treatment perhaps.

However, both the courts and medical community recognizes that sex reassignment surgery is a valid treatment for the gender dysphoria that many trans* individuals experience.

Arguing from a position that gender identity is simplistic or that there are only two options based on biological sex (which in itself is not a mere binary trait) achieves nothing.

a reply to: Gryphon66

I think you have done a very good job summarizing the "heart" of what this discussion is all about. I read back through this thread this morning and would like to qualify my statement that "basically all this is, is plastic surgery"....that was insensitive to say. I'm sorry I used those words. I was fortunate to meet a very lovely woman here on ATS that took the time to explain her journey to me, she had the "big surgery" 30 years ago...and Oh Boy, this is not a journey for the "faint of heart".....and as others have said this is not something any "sane" person would consider lightly. I think we all can agree the dude in the original OP is not "sane".

I agree with much of what you say, where I disagree is that we have an obligation to provide "unconditionally" very expensive and for obvious reasons, difficult surgery's to recover from, to people who are in jail? I guess the best answer I can come up with is these cases need to be decided based on the individual. From what my new friend told me, it took years, many surgery's and lot's of money...that leads to a whole other discussion about the cost of healthcare. Another concern might be that if this became part of the required treatments in jail, if deemed necessary prior to going to jail, would it encourage people to break the law , get put in jail,in order to have the surgery and time to recover in jail? IDK?????? Tough subject...

a reply to: MountainLaurel

Thanks. Glad you had an opportunity to put a human face on what may have been a mostly theoretical subject! That usually makes a difference.

As far as your disagreement, that's okay, you know ... LOL. Actually, I'm not sure if I used the term "unconditionally" and earlier I did note that a) I don't think the person in the OP will qualify for the surgery and b) jail is not the place to begin the process in any way, shape, form or fashion.

Any system can be abused admittedly. I'd like to see us work out reasonable accommodations and treatments while still minimizing abuse. I guess I would focus on that hope.

originally posted by: Shamrock6
a reply to: Abysha

Exactly correct, and thank you.

And that's where I come down on it. Does the offender want the wang gone so they can't use it anymore? Or because it's all a genuine issue for them?

I'm not the therapist involved so I don't know, obviously. But that was exactly my first question.

A Penis is not what lead him to be a pedophile. As such, penis or no he would have molested a child. Removing his penis, does NOT ensure he won't dittle someone else. The penis, and his sexual identity are not the motive, of his crime.

Reading that bit, about how he says a sex change would have prevented it, is BS to the utmost. It, to me, sounds like the base for his parole hearing and or appeals. Gee, I don't have a penis anymore, I'm no longer into kids, it's totally cool to release me early !

BS

a reply to: Gryphon66

I wish we had a "hug" emoticon on ATS.......well said...I gotta go to work.....I guess by "unconditionally" I meant that there are some people in the system that deserve more consideration then others in terms of what may be considered "unnecessary medical treatment".....however I understand that this is a complicated issue, and is life or death to some and may even be the very cause they are in the "system" to begin with.....sorry need to go for now...HAGD all...

Its in Prison.

It shouldn't have the freedom to choose anything.