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How to fight the "War on Christmas" (regardless of real or perceived)

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posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 07:05 AM
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It's that time of year. The holiday season. Although the Thanksgiving turkeys haven't been purchased yet, some people (and retailers, of course) have already started the Christmas season. That means it is also the time for the annual debate about whether or not there is a "War on Christmas."

For the traditionalists, of which I am one, there was one small victory over the weekend.

Quick background: One of the locations where thousands of people take their children for the "Santa Pictures" is Roosevelt Field on Long Island. That is where my wife and I have taken our son every year since he was born. This year, the mall owners (Simon Malls) decided that the elaborate Christmas Tree setup may "offend" people, so they opted to replace the traditional set-up with a semi-enclosed "glacier." (Please note that I personally spoke with several people that work for Simon Malls - specifically those that manage Roosevelt Field - and that was the reason given, although I'd like to think that the corporate response would have been more nuanced).

I can not take credit for starting the movement, only for taking part in the campaign that was conducted on social media and via phone calls, letters and e-mails. For my part, when I was finally able to get "management" on the phone (or what I suspect was more along the lines of middle-management), I explained that what was at steak for the mall was not limited to the $50 +/- that people spend on photos but all the additional monies that myself and thousands of others would NOT be spending at this mall.

Like many others in my area, the Santa Picture day is much more than the photos. For the past few years my family has met up with others and basically spent the day at Roosevelt Field mall. Collectively we spend a few thousand dollars. Multiply that by the hundreds (maybe thousands) of other groups that would be taking our business elsewhere, and suddenly you have a sizable amount revenue at stake.

To put an exclamation point on it, many of us not only spoke with Simon Malls, but called many of the individual retailers within the mall, because they would most likely be affected more directly. To put in in perspective, a retail jewelry store that may lose a thousand customers that may spend about a thousand dollars per purchase may certainly affect the bottom line. It was our intent (or hope) that they would put some additional pressure on the mall's management.

In the end.... Success. The "glaciers" are gone and the mall is in the process of restoring the Santa area to what many of us have come to expect.

Two quick stories about it (one about the Roosevelt Field mall and one about another Simon Mall in another location):
Note: I would post more links but this all happened relatively quickly.

Article 1

Article 2




posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 07:23 AM
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i never got why people can be offended by something they do not believe in or that has no real impact on them.
No matter what religion you follow or if you don't follow any at all, if you are in any way offended or feel uncomfortable from seeing a tree with some lights and balls hanging from it, you are pretty pathetic.
It's not like you have any obligation to interact with the tree or acknowledge it's presence.
Just move along. And if the tree starts following you around the mall then yeah, you have a right to be concerned.



posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 07:29 AM
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originally posted by: eluryh22
This year, the mall owners (Simon Malls) decided that the elaborate Christmas Tree setup may "offend" people, so they opted to replace the traditional set-up with a semi-enclosed "glacier." [/url]


I've never met a single human being who was offended by Christmas decorations. I'm not saying they don't exist, just that I've never heard anyone express dissatisfaction at the sight of trees with lights on them.

Furthermore, if you're reading this and you happen to be offended by something as petty as Christmas, do us all a favor and go jump off of a very tall building.
edit on 9-11-2015 by GD21D because: Spelling



posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 07:47 AM
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I say we get rid of Christmas and make it year round! Wouldn't it be great if people gave to others all year instead of just once a year? I don't mean giving just materialistic things (which is what Christmas has turned into) but help or kindness as well.

I say Christmas is at war with the rest of the year!



posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 07:48 AM
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I've never met anyone offended by Christmas either.
Other than the fact that retailers are forcing it on us a bit earlier each year.
There is a bit of fatigue that sets in, and I think it dilutes the holiday.



posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 07:57 AM
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a reply to: spacedoubt

I hear ya. Doesn't "offend" me but I find it a bit annoying that as recent as yesterday, while on hold with one of my banks, they already had the Christmas music going. Too soon for my personal taste.



posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 08:01 AM
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If there are no groups offended by Christmas then why the push to remove iconic Christmas symbols?

Honestly, I looked on line and can't find any group concerned with the Christmas issue.



posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 08:01 AM
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originally posted by: IShotMyLastMuse
And if the tree starts following you around the mall then yeah, you have a right to be concerned.


Your comment reminded me of....
I wish I could remember which comedian had a skit about this.... but he basically said whenever he is at Home Depot and someone walks past carrying a bush that they purchased.... looks like someone in disguise from a Looney Tunes episode.



posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 08:06 AM
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a reply to: eluryh22

I thought the "War on CHRISTmas" was about those heathen atheists wanting to remove Nativity Scenes and religious emblems from the holiday season. But Christmas trees have nothing to do with Christ's birth or the Christian religion, and these kinds of trees are forbidden in the Bible.

It seems to me that the shopping center was making an environmental statement by saving a tree and featuring a glacier to remind us of our need to be better stewards to the planet, and not rape it in the name of commercialism and profit.

But, you're fighting FOR commercialism, not for CHRISTmas.



edit on 9-11-2015 by windword because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 08:08 AM
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originally posted by: windword
a reply to: eluryh22
It seems to me that the shopping center was making an environmental statement by saving a tree and featuring a glacier to remind us of our need to be better stewards to the planet, and not rape it in the name of commercialism and profit.



Actually, the people representing the mall did not indicate that. They specifically said it was done as to not "offend" anyone. That is what was they told me personally, as well as quite a few other people that I know that spoke with them.



posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 08:12 AM
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a reply to: eluryh22

Who are the people offended by a Christmas tree? Could it be Global Warning enthusiasts and environmentalist? Seems to me that's the logical group being appeased here, not offended anti-theists or atheists.


edit on 9-11-2015 by windword because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 08:13 AM
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a reply to: windword

I would suggest you contact Simon Malls and ask them.... as I couldn't tell you because I have no idea.



posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 08:20 AM
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originally posted by: IShotMyLastMuse
i never got why people can be offended by something they do not believe in or that has no real impact on them.


A Christmas Tree? People don't believe in Christmas Trees?

From the OP:


This year, the mall owners (Simon Malls) decided that the elaborate Christmas Tree setup may "offend" people, so they opted to replace the traditional set-up with a semi-enclosed "glacier."


I thought the whole imaginary "War on Christmas" was supposed to have something to do with religious celebration of Christmas... not trees...

I have never understood this idea of a "War on Christmas"...



posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 08:24 AM
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originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: IShotMyLastMuse
i never got why people can be offended by something they do not believe in or that has no real impact on them.




I have never understood this idea of a "War on Christmas"...
That's why I worded my subject line the way I did.



posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 08:27 AM
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a reply to: Benevolent Heretic


Christmas trees are a religious symbol. At least most people think of them as such.



posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 08:30 AM
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I am offended every year by Christmas decorations. Every year my wife makes me scroffle in the loft to liberate our tree and decorations, dress up the living room like Santas grotto and my kids are 41, 38, 32 years old. Oh, I forgot about my grandkids, they love it, especialy if I put white gossamer stuff over the ceiling decorations to look like snow and icicles.
Please do not remind me when it is time to take them down.
Great time Christmas.
If the tree huggers are offended then tell the mall to use an artificial tree, there are some good realistic tree on the market.
Dress the halls with boughs of holly tra la la la la la la.



posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 08:40 AM
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originally posted by: Bluntone22
a reply to: Benevolent Heretic


Christmas trees are a religious symbol. At least most people think of them as such.


Oh boy. You done did it now.... get ready for a dissertation on the history of the tree, yule log, more accurate date of Jesus' birth..... the whole shebang.



posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 08:45 AM
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Your thread title should read how to fight for Christmas.

Personally, i don't fight over symbols, I leave that to the symbol minded.



posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 08:47 AM
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originally posted by: eluryh22
That's why I worded my subject line the way I did.


Yeah, I got that.
I have no issue with the thread. Only with saying ...


originally posted by: Bluntone22
Christmas trees are a religious symbol. At least most people think of them as such.


Sorry, I don't believe this. It's a symbol of secular Christmas, just like Santa, the reindeer, sleigh bells, holly, candy canes and stockings. Unless people think Santa is religious, then they don't think the tree is religious.



posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 08:47 AM
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originally posted by: GD21D

originally posted by: eluryh22
This year, the mall owners (Simon Malls) decided that the elaborate Christmas Tree setup may "offend" people, so they opted to replace the traditional set-up with a semi-enclosed "glacier." [/url]


I've never met a single human being who was offended by Christmas decorations. I'm not saying they don't exist, just that I've never heard anyone express dissatisfaction at the sight of trees with lights on them.

Furthermore, if you're reading this and you happen to be offended by something as petty as Christmas, do us all a favor and go jump off of a very tall building.


The Wal-Mart my husband works for had to take down the tree in their break room because a n employee from the midle east complained. His wife worked there, too. She had to get him a cup of coffee if they were on break together.



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