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A way to easily rationalize a God of some sort existing...

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posted on Jan, 4 2005 @ 05:11 AM
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Okay, i want to see if someone here can give me a VALID arguement back...


The reason God does exist is plain and simple time. Everything in this Universe is bound by Time, and i mean everything. There is nothing that is infinite, so any theories that one comes up for to better understand the creation of the universe is ultimately tied down to one question, "Where did that get created from?" However, there is only ONE answer that the answer is easily solvable. God. If God created everything, than that would mean he created time, thus something like being created, or starting from somewhere wouldn't apply to God as that has to do with time, and God is above time. God is timeless. So the only true explanation for the creation of the Universe is a GOD of some sort.

Is there a good arguement against this? Don't say Gods could have created it, cuz, although it may be true, i used the word God in the singular form because it is the way modern society thinks for the most part.




posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 08:36 PM
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There are generally two plausible explanations for the universe's existence (taken from here):

1. Our universe is one of an infinite number of disjoint universes that were, and are still being, formed with all possible physical laws and constants. This is called the self-reproducing universe, or "eternal inflation."
2. It was created in an ordered manner by an external intelligence (a Creator) not bound by physical law.

So yes, it is definitely plausible that there is a God, but it is also plausible that there isn't. God is not the only explanation for the universe.



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 08:43 PM
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Originally posted by Ryanp5555
Okay, i want to see if someone here can give me a VALID arguement back...


The reason God does exist is plain and simple time. Everything in this Universe is bound by Time, and i mean everything. There is nothing that is infinite, so any theories that one comes up for to better understand the creation of the universe is ultimately tied down to one question, "Where did that get created from?" However, there is only ONE answer that the answer is easily solvable. God. If God created everything, than that would mean he created time, thus something like being created, or starting from somewhere wouldn't apply to God as that has to do with time, and God is above time. God is timeless. So the only true explanation for the creation of the Universe is a GOD of some sort.

Is there a good arguement against this? Don't say Gods could have created it, cuz, although it may be true, i used the word God in the singular form because it is the way modern society thinks for the most part.


Call me crazy, but time is constantly changing... If you think about it we have the power to control our own time; and it brings us to the fact that all things can be manipulated how ever we wish. I dont think time is anything more than human perception. But to the question "Is there a god."
The real question is "Why do you question his existance"
which will bring you to "But if there is, why are we here; and if were here to serve him why are we given free will"
And that will last about a week... Until you realize that this world is to complicated to understand.... I gone through plenty of headaches to figure that one out.



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 08:57 PM
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The question that is probably hardest to comprehend and will probably never be answered is "Why?" You know. "Why is there something (be it God, or the eternal inflation I previously mentioned) rather than nothing?" Doesn't make sense at all.



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 09:10 PM
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IMHO

Time is not the same everywhere at the same time (lol), but is bent by gravity as well as sped up and slowed down by where an individual stands in relation to another individual. For instance, a clock in orbit might be travelling faster than a clock on the ground and is therefore slower in relation. The closer we get to the speed of light, the more time seems to slow.

Therefore, time is irrelevant and not omnipresent.

I've heard it said that there is only the 'Eternal Now'...so if there was a God, that Deity would only exist in the 'now' and not in the past or the future.

masqua



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 09:21 PM
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Time in our only sense of it is an invention of mankind. If there were no sentient observers such as ourselves to the universe, there would be no time.

But on to the god(s) idea. We cannot know if there is/are god(s). We have zero evidence that there is/are god(s).

But then again we have no evidence there is not a god figure. So, if you get my point, speculation is futile. If there is a god, worshipping *it* is pointless.



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 09:27 PM
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Read some of Paul Richrads posts...very though provoking, as most of his posts are...

www.abovetopsecret.com...



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 10:10 PM
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Originally posted by LadyV
Read some of Paul Richrads posts...very though provoking, as most of his posts are...


Wow, that's quite possibly the most well written post I've ever seen on ATS. Thanks for referring it!



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 10:45 PM
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It's just a senseless word. It doesnt mean anything, because we cant even define it. It's like someone asking you how a tv works and then saying, "its magic!". Its hard to define something you cant even observe. The first cause may be some abstract concept that we may never understand, but why go behind that? Why bother naming it such a redundant, meaningless word? I think I just have a hard time with words. Meh, what do you think?



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 11:01 PM
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Originally posted by Ryanp5555
Okay, i want to see if someone here can give me a VALID arguement back...


The reason God does exist is plain and simple time. Everything in this Universe is bound by Time, and i mean everything. There is nothing that is infinite, so any theories that one comes up for to better understand the creation of the universe is ultimately tied down to one question, "Where did that get created from?" However, there is only ONE answer that the answer is easily solvable. God.

How is that a solution? YOu are just defining it as such. If time binds everything then time binds god. Also, we don't know what happened before Inflation, maybe it was nothing, maybe it was an infinite existence beforehand. Also, since time is so malleable, I am not so certain it can be used as some sort of universal to indicate that there is a god.


Is there a good arguement against this?

I think that your arguement simply doesn't hold at all. You are saying that because time exists that god must exist. Its a non sequitor, there is no reason to think that the existence of time requires the existence of any god or gods.

Is your faith so weak that it requires rationalization? That it can be altered thru argument and experiment?



posted on Jan, 5 2005 @ 11:23 PM
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A guy named Descartes put out a pretty good explaination of some sort of rationalization of God.

He wrote stuff around these lines. That God must exist because we have the idea of infinte, how could a finite being have thought of something without having any example of such a thing. Also stuff like since we have the comprehension of perfection a perfect being must exist, just because humans can come close to perfection does not give us the idea of it, and since perfection implies existence. God Must Exist. I know I totaly chopped it look him up, he wrote some interesting stuff on the subject.



posted on Jan, 6 2005 @ 12:03 AM
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no time could not bind god as he created time... Time binds everything in this universe in one way or another, i dont mean it is a constant, yes time is relative, but still affects everything, even at a rate of light speed. But i guess you could use the arguement if god existed before the universe and time how many seconds before the universe did he live for... well my answer to that is 0 and infinity. He never lived before that second the universe was created because there was no time. For instance picture a movei where someone has the ability to stop time and walk around but time doesnt move, well that is where god was, no time moved but he was there for infinity, thus he has no creation.



posted on Jan, 6 2005 @ 01:31 PM
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God designed time, not bound to time. since God created everything, thus only God is eternal, and nothing else including time, and if God makes time, God can control it.

"gods" are not God at all. and if "gods" to exist without God, then their not a God at all, rather just a higher up source.




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