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To the Socialists.

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posted on Nov, 7 2015 @ 11:17 AM
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originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: TerryMcGuire
I only speak based on how I've observed socialism destroy peoples lives, specifically in the medical system and I stand by every word I posted.

America doesn't have a socialist medical system for everyone. Veterans and medicare are socialist but for the general population we have a capitalist medical system that's why people have been going bankrupt trying to pay their medical bills. Even the ACA is a capitalist system because it forces people to buy insurance from private companies.




posted on Nov, 7 2015 @ 12:09 PM
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a reply to: GD21D

I personally believe military should be localized at the state level and maintained by state tax. That way, it would be the individual state's decision whether or not to go to war. And the Federal Government would essentially have no threatening power.



posted on Nov, 7 2015 @ 12:12 PM
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a reply to: BritofTexas

You do realize that the Articles of Confederation were illegally replaced by the Constitution, right? The only thing I like about the Constitution is the Bill of Rights, and that wasn't even a part of the first drafts. It was added when the Anti-Federalists refused to sign our rights away.


edit on 7-11-2015 by BELIEVERpriest because: added point

edit on 7-11-2015 by BELIEVERpriest because: added reply header



posted on Nov, 7 2015 @ 01:36 PM
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originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: MystikMushroom

Ah, but America is a secular nation now, sit down and stop prostyletizing where matters of government are concerned! (I know how much it stings to be the catcher for that fastball, because I heard it from plenty during the end of the Bush admin.)


Sure it is, but that doesn't mean that Christians shouldn't be "Christ-like" anymore.

If Christians were truly "Christ-like", they'd be voting for more liberal social policies. No matter how you slice it, and even if you keep your religion out of the government...your faith influences the type of people you elect, regardless if those people never pass legislation that has religious roots.

Good attempt though, I see where you were going with that -- it's a valid point to be made.



posted on Nov, 7 2015 @ 01:49 PM
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a reply to: MystikMushroom

Conversely, you're not a Christian and as such you're in no position to be playing "Christians should" cards. Again, taken straight from the standard playbook that claims those taxed shouldn't have a say over how the takers use those funds because they're not experiencing that life themselves.

You know, as a total aside, if Heaven is socialist I'd probably find he'll more comfortable anyway.



posted on Nov, 7 2015 @ 03:33 PM
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originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: MystikMushroom

Conversely, you're not a Christian and as such you're in no position to be playing "Christians should" cards. Again, taken straight from the standard playbook that claims those taxed shouldn't have a say over how the takers use those funds because they're not experiencing that life themselves.

You know, as a total aside, if Heaven is socialist I'd probably find he'll more comfortable anyway.


Just to be clear, your position is that only people in a specific group have the right to tell members of that group how to live?



posted on Nov, 7 2015 @ 04:25 PM
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a reply to: Serdgiam

Something incredibly simple just hit me, that I cannot believe I never made the connection before.....

Black and white thinking (extremes) seems a strong marker of my american culture in particular,
(we love or we hate, there are "good guys" and "bad guys", etc.

It only stood out to me by the contrast of the french who see everything in moderation.
But... as part of that "social" mentality, that is what is valued. Not standing out, conformity, everyone trying to be at the same level, having not too little, but not too much either...
It is perhaps a product of the evil socialist world view to be moderate.

edit on 7-11-2015 by Bluesma because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 7 2015 @ 05:35 PM
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a reply to: Bluesma

Yes, the world is very polarized. It's "safe thinking". Its easier to classify things around us in the world in absolutes, we know where we stand when things are either black/white, 1/0, hot/cold, ect.

The fact of the matter is -- the world isn't black and white. There are shades of color between the blinds.

Holding steadfast to a specific dogma is one sure fire way to stagnate and begin to deteriorate.



posted on Nov, 7 2015 @ 05:44 PM
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a reply to: burdman30ott6

I'd argue that I'm in an even more uniquely qualified position. I'm not playing any "cards". As someone who was once "on the inside" and now finds themselves on the outside; I have a perspective that those who still live under layers of dogmatic orthodoxy don't have.

Those making decisions for the military aren't in the military. Some may have been, just as I may have regularly attended church.



Most of the shadows of life are caused by standing in our own sunshine. - Ralph Waldo Emerson



posted on Nov, 8 2015 @ 03:50 AM
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originally posted by: MystikMushroom
a reply to: Bluesma

Yes, the world is very polarized. It's "safe thinking". Its easier to classify things around us in the world in absolutes, we know where we stand when things are either black/white, 1/0, hot/cold, ect.



It's funny that I keep getting people respond that "yes, the whole world sees in black and white". When what I have witnessed is that other peoples in other cultures, DON'T see the world in black and white!
It is very specific to certain cultures. I experienced it as part of the US mentality, but maybe there are others, but there are lots of other peoples who do not have that mentality. -And that see our propensity for it a sign of our brutish and primitive immaturity as a society. (not making that accusation myself, I just found it interesting to learn how others see us).



posted on Nov, 8 2015 @ 06:17 AM
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a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

No one is a bigger free market advocate than I am, with only enough regulation to keep everyone on a level playing field. And I appreciate your appreciation for the Bill of Rights. I hope you appreciate the organic law -- natural law -- that Bill of Rights is founded upon as well. Because while I saw much contempt and blame for the little guy in your rant, I saw no contempt for those who have so corrupted our founding principles, and therefore our laws, our economy, and pretty much every aspect of society.

In a true free market, there would be no corporations, a legal entity created out of whole cloth, given special privileges, including limited criminal and civil liability, special tax credits/deductions, and otherwise benefitting the entitled few at the expense of the many. There would be no patents, which give exclusive control of part the earth's resources -- which belong to us all EQUALLY -- to an entitled few at the expense of the many. There would be no certification or licensing requirements, no degrees or other formal education/training requirements. There would be no Federal Reserve... there would be no crony capitalism and corporate welfare... there would be no derivatives and mortgage backed securities and other weapons of mass financial destruction...

The healthcare industry is (arguably) THE number one beneficiary of government intervention and control, and the rest of us suffer for it in numerous ways. And, no, I do not think anything has been achieved in medical technology that could not and would not have been achieved with less government intervention and control and crony capitalism; i.e., in a free and fair market. In fact, I believe the exact opposite. The increasing research into cannabis and its many health and healing benefits is an example of how government laws and regulations -- in direct oppostion to free market principles AND our natural rights -- has actually impeded and retarded medical technology. Indeed, the cannabinoids found in cannabis are the key to activate our immune systems to fight off ALL disease. But we are still prohibited by federal law for even possessing this life-saving God-given plant, or growing it, or making our own medicinal oils and tinctures... which, of course, also points out the very real dangers of giving anyone the power to control our healthcare, not to mention our economy.

Our enemy isn't the little guy, just struggling to get by in an economy -- in a world -- that has been so corrupted and compromised by a relatively few at the top. The more people are negatively impacted by the bureaucracy of the government, the more likely they are to expect government to fix it. And there's always going to be someone ready to offer yet more government control and regulation as the solution. Get government and crony capitalism out of the way, give people a fair chance to make a fair day's wage for their labor, give them a level playing field, give them the tools and resources that they need to make a life... and this economy will once again thrive and prosper for the great majority who can and will work hard to make a life for themselves and their families. When people can take care of themselves, they don't want or need the government to do it for them. But keep using the government to benefit the few at the expense of the many, and the many will likewise keep demanding more from government.



posted on Nov, 8 2015 @ 09:36 AM
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a reply to: Bluesma

I have my doubts about such an assertion..

It is definitely done differently in different cultures, for obvious reasons (and not so obvious ones). I am only able to base it on the places I have spent time, and people I have spent time with though.

It isn't so much "black and white" specifically, it also manifests as dualistic and divided thinking.

It is important to note that in the black and white world, there is an entire spectrum of grayscale.



posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 06:09 AM
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originally posted by: Serdgiam

It isn't so much "black and white" specifically, it also manifests as dualistic and divided thinking.



That is what I was refering to. A general inability (or refusal of) perception and consideration of subtilities between extremes.



posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 01:38 PM
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originally posted by: Bluesma

That is what I was refering to. A general inability (or refusal of) perception and consideration of subtilities between extremes.


From my perspective, that is not the only way for division and dualistic tendencies to manifest. That is why I made specific note of the grayscale, as there is generally black and white thinking about black and white thinking. In US culture, it does tend to manifest as you suggest (not always). However, that does not mean different manifestations are less black and white if they operate in a different area of the spectrum. "Color" is not somehow introduced.

Many use those very subtleties between the extremes to justify and perpetuate the division. Even the English language refers to vague situations as a gray area, which is deeply ironic in my perspective.

Either way, going much further with this line of thinking is quite off topic!



posted on Nov, 9 2015 @ 03:24 PM
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a reply to: Boadicea

I think you're misjudging my thoughts. My contempt is not for the little guy, but for the Republican and Democrat politicians who have deviated from the Bill of Rights to give corporations the level of control they have today. The Federal Government has done this by getting involved in trade, by obstructing justice where the Bill of Rights should speak loudest, and by unevenly yoking US citizens with income taxes.

-Corporations are not people and should not be given special rights.

-Tariffs should not be waved.

-Taxes should be a fixed flat rate charge on consumption, never on income production.

-The Bill of Rights should override all laws that seek to challenge it.

These practices would take socialism out of the private sector and drive taxes and cost of living to an all time low.


The current system has progressively trampled the honest poor and needy under the feet of those stampeding for the public handout. I see it happen on a daily basis, and I promise you that once the middle class has completely disintegrate, the poor will be crushed by the elite.

I promise you that if we continue this trend towards socialized commerce, the millennial generation will be the last generation to taste any form of prosperity, and soon, it will be a distant memory.

edit on 9-11-2015 by BELIEVERpriest because: typo



posted on Nov, 10 2015 @ 06:28 AM
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a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

Ooops! I sure did misjudge your words -- and my apologies. Although I guess I'm kinda glad to the extent that you expanded on your thoughts -- and I thank you for that! And, of course, I agree -- for better and worse.



posted on Nov, 10 2015 @ 08:31 AM
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I like Sweden. Everyone gets a patch of green and has to grow a garden, neighbors barter and trade when and what to grow. If that is socialism, it is a good one.
edit on 10-11-2015 by MOMof3 because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 10 2015 @ 03:22 PM
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a reply to: Boadicea

No need to apologize. I was pretty frustrated when I wrote my op, but the conversations I've exchanged in this thread have really helped me to refine my opinions.



posted on Nov, 10 2015 @ 03:57 PM
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a reply to: BELIEVERpriest


I was pretty frustrated when I wrote my op, but the conversations I've exchanged in this thread have really helped me to refine my opinions.


That's fantastic!! Can you share with us what parts/dialogue led you to the refining, and how your opinions stand now??

That's awesome. High Five.




posted on Nov, 10 2015 @ 06:37 PM
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Misunderstood the question.
edit on 10-11-2015 by BELIEVERpriest because: oops




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