Why are Palestinians teaching children violence and hate?

a reply to: MaxMech

originally posted by: MaxMech
Is this a joke?!
To call an Arab a "Palestinian" would mean to insult him because until the late 60s the word "Palestinian " was commonly and unanimously associated in all the world with Jews, and all the world knew: Palestine is just another name for Israel.

Unanimously, ey? Common knowledge, really?
Reality called, and it would like to point out to you all the pre-WW1 Palestinian sports teams (just a random example to give for point of identity) that explicitly identified themselves as Palestinian, and were explicitly anti-zionist (seeing as they later had to form sports leagues separately because Zionists were using leagues as some sort of Zionist political tool, and thus prohibited or marginalised the local players and teams). Heck, speaking of sports, it would also like to point out pre-WWI sports related newspapers such as The Falastin (guess what that translates to in English) which again, explicitly referred to its readership as Palestinians, and again, were explicitly anti-zionist.

a reply to: babloyi

Unanimously, ey? Common knowledge, really?
Reality called, and it would like to point out to you all the pre-WW1 Palestinian sports teams (just a random example to give for point of identity) that explicitly identified themselves as Palestinian, and were explicitly anti-zionist (seeing as they later had to form sports leagues separately because Zionists were using leagues as some sort of Zionist political tool, and thus prohibited or marginalised the local players and teams). Heck, speaking of sports, it would also like to point out pre-WWI sports related newspapers such as The Falastin (guess what that translates to in English) which again, explicitly referred to its readership as Palestinians, and again, were explicitly anti-zionist.

I see so there were Arabs who used the term "Falastin" back then...
Strangely, exclusively in sports...
Not sure what does this prove but ok.

So how about all of these statements by Arab leaders?

"There is no such country as Palestine. 'Palestine' is a term the Zionists invented. There is no Palestine in the Bible. Our country was for centuries part of Syria. 'Palestine' is alien to us. It is the Zionists who introduced it".

- Auni Bey Abdul-Hadi, Syrian Arab leader to British Peel Commission, 1937 -

"There is no such thing as Palestine in history, absolutely not".

- Professor Philip Hitti, Arab historian, 1946 -

"It is common knowledge that Palestine is nothing but Southern Syria".

- Representant of Saudi Arabia at the United Nations, 1956 -

"There are no differences between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. We are all part of one nation. It is only for political reasons that we carefully underline our Palestinian identity... yes, the existence of a separate Palestinian identity serves only tactical purposes. The founding of a Palestinian state is a new tool in the continuing battle against Israel".

- Zuhair Muhsin, military commander of the PLO and member of the PLO Executive Council -

"You do not represent Palestine as much as we do. Never forget this one point: There is no such thing as a Palestinian people, there is no Palestinian entity, there is only Syria. You are an integral part of the Syrian people, Palestine is an integral part of Syria. Therefore it is we, the Syrian authorities, who are the true representatives of the Palestinian people".

- Syrian dictator Hafez Assad to the PLO leader Yassir Arafat -

"As I lived in Palestine, everyone I knew could trace their heritage back to the original country their great grandparents came from. Everyone knew their origin was not from the Canaanites, but ironically, this is the kind of stuff our education in the Middle East included. The fact is that today's Palestinians are immigrants from the surrounding nations! I grew up well knowing the history and origins of today's Palestinians as being from Yemen, Saudi Arabia, Morocco, Christians from Greece, muslim Sherkas from Russia, muslims from Bosnia, and the Jordanians next door. My grandfather, who was a dignitary in Bethlehem, almost lost his life by Abdul Qader Al-Husseni (the leader of the Palestinian revolution) after being accused of selling land to Jews. He used to tell us that his village Beit Sahur (The Shepherds Fields) in Bethlehem County was empty before his father settled in the area with six other families. The town has now grown to 30,000 inhabitants".

- Walid Shoebat, a Palestinian American -

Jordan is Palestine and Palestine is Jordan, and Jordan hails every Palestinian who seeks to do his duty to his cause and his country
- The Jordanian Foreign Minister said -

a reply to: MaxMech

History Shmistory!
Occupation!, Zionist! and whatnot!
Jews, with the help of the JNF and Rothchild family bought the land in the 1800s from the landowners and ottomans.
The rest was gained when Jordan Egypt Lebanon and others repeatedly failed in attacking israel in successive wars.
The "falestines" are mostly illegal immigrants who started showing up when the getting was good, much like in europe today.

a reply to: MaxMech

originally posted by: MaxMech
I see so there were Arabs who used the term "Falastin" back then...
Strangely, exclusively in sports...
Not sure what does this prove but ok.

What does it prove? If you were following the thread of the conversation, you'd understand that It proves that 'until the late 60s the word "Palestinian " was commonly and unanimously associated in all the world with Jews' is absolutely false.
Also, it certainly wasn't exclusively in sports. Sports is just a simple example. The wonderful thing about technology today is that we have so much information at our fingertips, that in many cases, absurd falsehoods can be immediately pointed out to be absurd falsehoods. Al Falastin was just one newspaper. Another from the time (i.e. late Ottoman onwards, rather than the post-60s you suggest), which was much more explicitly political is Al-Carmel (and again explicitly anti-zionist) which again referred to its readership as falastini (Palestinian).

And then you ask me about statements from "Arab Leaders".
Hmmm...I wonder, what could be the reason that a bunch of Syrian leaders (who considered Palestine to be part of Syria) would want to negate the concept of a Palestinian identity? Surely it is an absolutely impartial observation, and nothing at all to do with them wanting to incorporate that land into their own!

a reply to: babloyi

And then you ask me about statements from "Arab Leaders".
Hmmm...I wonder, what could be the reason that a bunch of Syrian leaders (who considered Palestine to be part of Syria) would want to negate the concept of a Palestinian identity? Surely it is an absolutely impartial observation, and nothing at all to do with them wanting to incorporate that land into their own!

Only 2 of the 7 quotes were made by Syrians. Have nothing much to say about Zuhair Muhsin? Of course...

originally posted by: TheInhumanCentipede

originally posted by: MaxMech
Why are Palestinians teaching children violence and hate?

Violence begats violence, so it's probably because their Jew enemies do the same.

Not Jew Zionist are doing the same thing. Jews who actually follow their faith instead of using their faith generally stand with the Palestinians and like the Palestinians get beaten by the IDF.

a reply to: MaxMech

The bombs are going to be used on terrorists. The fact that children died in these attack is the terrorists doing (as they are the only ones who gained from it).

Yes always blame the victim. Israel dropped the bombs so they are responsible for their deaths.

The prison is maintained by Israel and Egypt. It was created by Hamas.

Once again blame the victims. Did Hamas build that wall? Nope Israel and Egypt did so they are responsible.

Probably. But I would not sacrifice my children's future (or present) because of this. I would be trying to find a way to end the conflict instead.

Israel has murdered many times more children than Hamas has done and it's Hamas that is sacrificing their children's future.
Palestinians don't have to teach their children to hate Israel because Israel does a fine job of doing that themselves. These kids are not blind they see their family friends and neighbors get beaten imprisoned and murdered by Israeli troops and settlers and this has been going on since before their parents were born. That is the reason why children in Palestine hate Israel.

a reply to: MaxMech

originally posted by: MaxMech
Only 2 of the 7 quotes were made by Syrians. Have nothing much to say about Zuhair Muhsin? Of course...

Actually, only 3 of your quotes were by Arab leaders. And yes, I am including Zuhair Muhsin in that. Your link reduces him to the "military commander of the PLO", which is absolute bollocks. He was the leader of As-Saiq, which was one faction among the several that were grouped together as the PLO- certainly not the only armed one. The thing about As-Saiq however, was that it was created, backed, and controlled by the Syrian Ba'ath Party- the same one currently headed by Assad (whose father was the one who appointed Muhsin to his position).
Heck, considering it hasn't been part of the PLO for several decades now, probably more accurate to call it the military wing of the Syrian Ba'athist Party. So I'm not sure why you thought it was relevant to specifically mention Zuhair Muhsin in your last post.

But is that enough to say about Zuhair Muhsin for you? Of course...

a reply to: babloyi

I think that by As-saiq you mean al-Saiqa faction. But you are indeed correct about him. How about the others? I'm really interested to know what do you have to say about Philip Hitti and some of these -

“The first Congress of Muslim-Christian Associations in the area met in February 1919 to consider the future of the territory formerly ruled by the Ottoman Empire, which dissolved after World War I. The Congress declared: ‘We consider Palestine as part of Arab Syria as it has never been separated from it at any time. We are connected with it by national, religious, linguistic, moral, economic, and geographical bonds.’”

“Palestinian spokesperson Ahmad Shuqeiri told the UN Security Council in 1956 that Palestine was nothing more than southern Syria.

Former Arab Israeli Knesset member Azmi Bishara, who deserted Israel wanted for charges of passing classified information to Hezbollah during the 2006 Lebanon war, said in 1994, “I think there is an Arab nation. I do not think there is a Palestinian nation. I think it’s a colonialist invention… When were there any Palestinians? …until the 19th century Palestine was the south of greater Syria.

Article 24 in the 1964 version of the PLO Charter excluded any claim by the Palestinians to the West Bank and Gaza, the very areas where they now want the world to recognize their “historic rights” to a state of their own.

“The PLO, in its own Charter or amended Basic Law (article 1), states that Palestine is part of the Arab nation. That ‘Arab nation’ never included a state known as ‘Palestine.’

At the Arab League meeting in Amman in November 1987, Jordan’s king Hussein said: “The appearance of the Palestinian national personality comes as an answer to Israel’s claim that Palestine is Jewish.”

“Throughout his authorized biography (Alan Hart, Arafat: terrorist or peace maker) Arafat asserts at least a dozen times: ‘The Palestinian people have no national identity. I, Yasser Arafat, man of destiny, will give them that identity through conflict with Israel.’

“The first official naming of “Palestine” as a distinct, defined territorial area came with the decision of the League of Nations, dealing with areas of the former Ottoman Empire, to create a Mandate for Palestine.”[

Several Arab and westerner scholars, different Arab leaders and other figures all saying the same thing. While the only mention of the Arabs in pre-Israel Palestine addressing to themselves as Palestinians can be found in a sports magazine and an anti Zionist propaganda newspaper... yeah I think you have a valid point there pal...

a reply to: MaxMech
I have to ask, MaxMech, what are you playing at? I admit, I don't frequent the Middle East forum very often, but from your initial question, I only got a sense of curiousity or at the most naive ignorance. Slowly, page by page, however, a very clear and explicit agenda showed up. You might as well have stated it outright from the start if you don't think the Palestinian people have a right to exist. Would've made things much simpler!

Your initial statement was that before the 60s, there was a "unanimous" use of the word "Palestinian" for Jewish, and I showed you some examples (several sports teams and a newspaper) that proved that was utterly false.
So your next statement was "Okay, aside from a sports magazine, there is a unanimous use of the word Palestinian for Jewish", so I showed you yet another example.
Your 3rd statement now seems to be "Okay, aside from a sports magazine and an anti-zionist propaganda newspaper, there is a unanimous use of the word Palestinian for Jewish"?
Every example I provide will be just one more exception for you? You do realise that these newspapers weren't greated and released in a vacuum. They had readership and people who followed them and acknowledged them and accepted them. So I haven't just shown you 3 uses of the word Palestinian to refer to non-jews, I've shown you a pattern accepted throughout the readership of those articles.
And please, do your research before making blanket general statements. It will save everyone a lot of time. There are loads of similar examples. Some even that you can obtain from the events you quoted (not the out of context ones you posted, obviously). The First Palestinian Arab Congress/Peace Conference stated they represented ALL Muslim and Christian residents of Palestine. Similarly, the Muslim-Christian Committee in Jaffa's letter to the British was written in the name of the "Arab Palestinian". Heck, you could go even further back to Ottoman times when an Ottoman official wrote of the need to expand to and develop the lands north of the Palestinian district (approximately encompassing what would later become the map of the Mandate of Palestine by the British) because of the increased food needs of the Palestinian people.

So yeah, I DO think I have a valid point there, pal.

originally posted by: gps777
originally posted by: rossacus

If I were to wake up everyday as a child, hear shelling and fires shot, see my city destroyed, the park in which I used to play burnt to the ground , and when I ask who caused it the response would be "westerners" who have no right to do so, the first thing I will say is sign me up.

You make it sound as if Palestine is a bombed ravaged dust bowl.

Club Med tourist resort compared to many places.

The land of Israel was mostly Jewish, then after Christ it had many Christians, until 6-7 hundred years when most were slaughtered by Muslims and taken over, Knights Templar took it back 1096 and 1291 and then taken back by Islam, then Israel became an nation again in 1948. Still parts of Israel are held as you can see with the Mosque on the Jewish Holy site.

Hahah just checking in on an old thread and seen that you used Tel-Aviv as an example of how luxurious Palestine is, ah man that was epic.



LOL

a reply to: real_one
Hahah! And the first image is from Haifa in Israel!
I wish I was distrustful enough to verify everything everyone posted. So often it is BS!

a reply to: buster2010

Oh come on! Even you don't believe that first one. Unless you are saying that any time a cop shoots someone, the cop is to blame because they shot the bullet. You're not that oblivious.

a reply to: MaxMech

Every time the Palasinian equivalents of those groups get together; Israel bombs and bulldozes the school they gathered at.

originally posted by: babloyi
a reply to: MaxMech

originally posted by: MaxMech
I see so there were Arabs who used the term "Falastin" back then...
Strangely, exclusively in sports...
Not sure what does this prove but ok.

What does it prove? If you were following the thread of the conversation, you'd understand that It proves that 'until the late 60s the word "Palestinian " was commonly and unanimously associated in all the world with Jews' is absolutely false.
Also, it certainly wasn't exclusively in sports. Sports is just a simple example. The wonderful thing about technology today is that we have so much information at our fingertips, that in many cases, absurd falsehoods can be immediately pointed out to be absurd falsehoods. Al Falastin was just one newspaper. Another from the time (i.e. late Ottoman onwards, rather than the post-60s you suggest), which was much more explicitly political is Al-Carmel (and again explicitly anti-zionist) which again referred to its readership as falastini (Palestinian).

And then you ask me about statements from "Arab Leaders".
Hmmm...I wonder, what could be the reason that a bunch of Syrian leaders (who considered Palestine to be part of Syria) would want to negate the concept of a Palestinian identity? Surely it is an absolutely impartial observation, and nothing at all to do with them wanting to incorporate that land into their own!

There is no mention of palistinians until Yasser arafat. In fact throughout the history of the area steering back thousands of years no palistinians.Assyrians, Babylonians, Greeks, Romans, Persians and Arabs did not happen to notice any “Palestinian people”. Turks, in those 600 years they ruled in Palestine, did not find them either. Even later in the 40 Arab politicians did not find any “Palestinian people”. So where did they come from? Answer is simple they were jordanians. Jordan citizens became palistinians on June 4th 1967 this is when they removed the stars from Jordan's flag and palistinians were created amazing huh.

Now how did these jordanians get there? They immagrated their when Israel was founded looking for jobs and a better life and for a while had it. This was a resort area with lavish coasts and became a true vacation spot. What happened the 1967 war known as the 6 day war. Jordanians and even other stabs from syria Egypt and Saudi Arabia were fleeing the Arab attack. But something strange happened the Arab league didn't want to allow these people back into their countries. Jordan did accept some but no where near what they should have. So these people became trapped in what was supposed to be temporary housing set up by countries to help them. As we can see it wasn't temporary.

a reply to: dragonridr
I'm not sure I understand what you're saying. In the very post you quoted (and before and after) I gave examples of the use of the word "Palestinian" to describe the native, non-jewish residents of Palestine. "Jordan" didn't exist as a country name either until 1921, and even then, it was "Transjordania".

originally posted by: babloyi
a reply to: dragonridr
I'm not sure I understand what you're saying. In the very post you quoted (and before and after) I gave examples of the use of the word "Palestinian" to describe the native, non-jewish residents of Palestine.

I think most people consider them palestinians. But that's just semantics. It's much easier to say and type "Palestinians" than "Those native non-jewish residents of Palestine" When you and I both know that wherever you live is who you are. People in Michigan are Michigans. People in Pittsburgh are Steelers Fans. If you live in Mexico your an American and so on.

The non Jewish people that actually own land are israelis. People forget their are a lot of Israelis that are not Jewish but in fact Arab and will tell you the people claiming to be palistinians are not. They were refugees trying to return to the Arab states and worse was stripped of their citizenship.

That's the reason Egypt put up a fence and closed the border.