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Debt ceiling lifted, and the same day, debt jumps $339B Welcome to Obamanomics

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posted on Nov, 3 2015 @ 09:47 PM
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a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

Again, this type of argument makes no sense.

Are corrupt people behind Obama? Yes Does this make Obama any less corrupt? NO.

Obama isn't a scapegoat and yes he leads. You act like Obama has no agenda and he's being forced to blindly follow orders. This is just nonsense.

Obama is just as corrupt as the people behind the curtain.




posted on Nov, 3 2015 @ 09:52 PM
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Obama's agenda is to follow the agenda already in place and which has been in place before he ever got into office.

If Obama is the mastermind I would be extremely surprised. He's only the newest player in the game already taking place.

Hold him accountable for what he does but don't pretend he's the end all be all on the issue of government corruption. You need to look at the ones with the money, Obama doesn't work for free.



posted on Nov, 3 2015 @ 09:53 PM
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Obama has put America in the toilet by design of Globalists and mega corporations who fostered him in 2008.

Search ATS "The Obama Deception" by Alex Jones.

Watch the planned implosion of USA shortly.



posted on Nov, 3 2015 @ 10:00 PM
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Ben Carson got in trouble during an interview last month about the debt celling. He's not the only one who seems to not understand it though. Americans hear "debt" and instantly jump to the conclusion that we're all doomed.



The debt ceiling is a strange feature of the American budgetary process. Because the Constitution says that only Congress can incur debt on behalf of the American people, it has to both authorize spending and then authorize the debt to finance all its obligations. Raising the debt ceiling, is therefore, a dangerous political game that the U.S. government plays every few years or so, where the opposition party blasts the party in power’s fiscal irresponsibility, but eventually allows the debt ceiling to be raised because defaulting on your debt for no reason is stupid.

The modern Republican party doesn’t agree with this line of thinking. Many in the party believe that it would be better to default than to incur any more debt at all, and Ryssdal was trying to figure out whether Carson agrees. If Carson truly understood the debt ceiling, there’s a simple answer to this question. He should have just said, “Your question is moot, because when I become president, there will be Republican majorities in Congress, so we will raise the debt ceiling at the same time that we balance the budget.” Instead, he consistently conflated authorizing new spending with raising the debt ceiling.

Fortune Magazine

Here's a concise definition of the debt ceiling for everyone from the US Treasury:



The debt limit is the total amount of money that the United States government is authorized to borrow to meet its existing legal obligations, including Social Security and Medicare benefits, military salaries, interest on the national debt, tax refunds, and other payments. The debt limit does not authorize new spending commitments.

Treasury

Note the bold part in the definition above -- it does not authorize new spending commitments. It's not a spending limit, it's a credit limit to cover what has already been spent.

And in 2011 Republicans brought us almost to the brink of default and caused our AAA credit rating to be downgraded to AA+ -- which is bad for the economy and has far-reaching repercussions (people loosing money in their 401ks for example). The S&P which did the credit downgrade said:



"The political brinksmanship of recent months highlights what we see as America's governance and policymaking becoming less stable, less effective, and less predictable than what we previously believed. The statutory debt ceiling and the threat of default have become political bargaining chips in the debate over fiscal policy. Despite this year's wide-ranging debate, in our view, the differences between political parties have proven to be extraordinarily difficult to bridge, and, as we see it, the resulting agreement fell well short of the comprehensive fiscal consolidation program that some proponents had envisaged until quite recently."

Wikipedia

Just so everyone's clear -- one more time -- the debt ceiling has nothing to do with NEW spending, it has to do with debt previously owed.



posted on Nov, 3 2015 @ 10:01 PM
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For "Comparison"

Bush vs Obama ....



source from table 1.1




posted on Nov, 3 2015 @ 10:03 PM
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originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
Obama's agenda is to follow the agenda already in place and which has been in place before he ever got into office.

If Obama is the mastermind I would be extremely surprised. He's only the newest player in the game already taking place.

Hold him accountable for what he does but don't pretend he's the end all be all on the issue of government corruption. You need to look at the ones with the money, Obama doesn't work for free.


Again, you're making an argument that makes no sense.

Obama isn't just following an agenda. Obama agrees with the agenda and that's why they help to put him in Office. You're trying to say Obama is just blindly following an agenda that's laid out there for him.

To me, that's just asinine and the argument that President's have no power is just asinine.

Obama's agenda is the same as the people who put him in office and nobody is making the argument that Obama is responsible for all Government corruption.

The fact that you're trying to debate this issue shows the Obama kool aid is strong.

In order to deflect from the horrible policies pushed by Obama you want to act lie Obama is blind, death and dumb and you want to debate Obama being responsible for all Government corruption which is an asinine argument that nobody has made.



posted on Nov, 3 2015 @ 10:04 PM
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Still better than 2012 according to usdebtclock.org. I think it's best to realize we stabilized our debt:gdp ratio a while back.



posted on Nov, 3 2015 @ 10:05 PM
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a reply to: neoholographic

The House GOP wrote the budget, Obama only signed it. Sure, it belongs to Obama, but the GOP are just as guilty.



posted on Nov, 3 2015 @ 10:13 PM
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originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: neoholographic

The House GOP wrote the budget, Obama only signed it. Sure, it belongs to Obama, but the GOP are just as guilty.


This isn't how Govt. works. Obama controls the agenda and the Republicans don't have enough votes in the Senate to overturn a veto.

For instance, the GOP could say we want to include the Keystone pipeline in a Bill. They can have the majority of the House and Senate ready to vote for the Bill but Obama says he's going to Veto anything that comes to his desk. Now, you can't pass the Bill without a veto proof majority.

So it's nonsense to act like Obama isn't controlling the agenda and when he can't get something passed he looks for an Executive Order. Even to pass things he said over and over again were unconstitutional.



posted on Nov, 3 2015 @ 10:16 PM
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a reply to: neoholographic

You keep saying I'm drinking kool-aid, I don't drink kool-aid.

Obama knows what he's doing, he's following orders. He's not some bumbling idiot but he's not the top dog on the food chain either.

For some reason you think I'm defending Obama. I'm not.



posted on Nov, 3 2015 @ 10:19 PM
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a reply to: neoholographic

We all would benefit by a government shut down imho, but the GOP doesn't have the guts to do it.



posted on Nov, 4 2015 @ 12:24 AM
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If you really think the president has no power so say so, vote Trump in office. If you are right nothing will change, but if Trump is elected I bet you see about half or better of the Senators and congressmen retire or resign before he is sworn in office to avoid prosecution for all the BS they have helped Oduma push down the American Taxpayers throat!
a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1



posted on Nov, 4 2015 @ 03:38 AM
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The only reason I wouldn't blame Obama for making things far worse is that he's not the engineer of the problem and hasn't done it deliberately. He's just a witless fool that does whatever he's told by his masters. Maybe that makes him more contemptible, maybe less. He's spineless but not a criminal mastermind. The Bushes would get more blame because they played a bigger part in setting up this disaster and had more willing input. Now we're actually playing with allowing another Bush( thankfully his polls are low enough that they can't fake his nomination) or a Clinton again to continue the suicide of America by our own government. I'll add that the Clintons are also on board, they're just lower on the chain of command than the Bushes, but are still higher than Obama. The Clintons were servants and made to obey by force and through their own weaknesses but were troublesome and never liked. Obama's just owned completely but never was allowed any freedom to make any decisions on his own.



posted on Nov, 4 2015 @ 09:29 AM
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originally posted by: MystikMushroom
Ben Carson got in trouble during an interview last month about the debt celling. He's not the only one who seems to not understand it though. Americans hear "debt" and instantly jump to the conclusion that we're all doomed.



The debt ceiling is a strange feature of the American budgetary process. Because the Constitution says that only Congress can incur debt on behalf of the American people, it has to both authorize spending and then authorize the debt to finance all its obligations. Raising the debt ceiling, is therefore, a dangerous political game that the U.S. government plays every few years or so, where the opposition party blasts the party in power’s fiscal irresponsibility, but eventually allows the debt ceiling to be raised because defaulting on your debt for no reason is stupid.

The modern Republican party doesn’t agree with this line of thinking. Many in the party believe that it would be better to default than to incur any more debt at all, and Ryssdal was trying to figure out whether Carson agrees. If Carson truly understood the debt ceiling, there’s a simple answer to this question. He should have just said, “Your question is moot, because when I become president, there will be Republican majorities in Congress, so we will raise the debt ceiling at the same time that we balance the budget.” Instead, he consistently conflated authorizing new spending with raising the debt ceiling.

Fortune Magazine

Here's a concise definition of the debt ceiling for everyone from the US Treasury:



The debt limit is the total amount of money that the United States government is authorized to borrow to meet its existing legal obligations, including Social Security and Medicare benefits, military salaries, interest on the national debt, tax refunds, and other payments. The debt limit does not authorize new spending commitments.

Treasury

Note the bold part in the definition above -- it does not authorize new spending commitments. It's not a spending limit, it's a credit limit to cover what has already been spent.

And in 2011 Republicans brought us almost to the brink of default and caused our AAA credit rating to be downgraded to AA+ -- which is bad for the economy and has far-reaching repercussions (people loosing money in their 401ks for example). The S&P which did the credit downgrade said:



"The political brinksmanship of recent months highlights what we see as America's governance and policymaking becoming less stable, less effective, and less predictable than what we previously believed. The statutory debt ceiling and the threat of default have become political bargaining chips in the debate over fiscal policy. Despite this year's wide-ranging debate, in our view, the differences between political parties have proven to be extraordinarily difficult to bridge, and, as we see it, the resulting agreement fell well short of the comprehensive fiscal consolidation program that some proponents had envisaged until quite recently."

Wikipedia

Just so everyone's clear -- one more time -- the debt ceiling has nothing to do with NEW spending, it has to do with debt previously owed.



I think (hope), that most people do understand your point. That does therefore mean that Obama has spent more money than any prior presidents in order to need the credit limit raised. Making it even worse was that sequestration limited military and other spending during a portion of his time in office. What has the money been spent on then? It will be interesting to see if more health exchanges fail and what impact that will have on spending and the debt limit.

I believe that someone calculated that a 1% reduction across the board each year would balance the budget in a reasonable amount of time. I'll have to see if I can find that.



posted on Nov, 4 2015 @ 09:31 AM
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a reply to: neoholographic

Doesn't Congress write the budget?



posted on Nov, 4 2015 @ 11:23 AM
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a reply to: peter_kandra

Obama alone doesn't get a budget passed, but people sure like to point at a single man as if he's the crux of all the world's problems.

The houses of congress are split, so if anyone's to blame it would be both parties for passing whatever budgets they've passed.

As inflation goes up, and America's population grows -- its only natural that the budget is going to increase over time.



posted on Nov, 4 2015 @ 12:24 PM
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I'm weary now. The debt ceiling has nothing to do with future spending. Nothing at all. It does not allow for the appropriation of one single dollar of future spending. The debt ceiling has to do with our ability to pay what has already been spent under past budgets.

Therefore, under the OP, the 339 Billion in national debt was going to happen regardless, as the money was already spent. The debt ceiling is NOT a spending bill.



posted on Nov, 4 2015 @ 12:35 PM
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originally posted by: usernameconspiracy
I'm weary now. The debt ceiling has nothing to do with future spending. Nothing at all. It does not allow for the appropriation of one single dollar of future spending. The debt ceiling has to do with our ability to pay what has already been spent under past budgets.

Therefore, under the OP, the 339 Billion in national debt was going to happen regardless, as the money was already spent. The debt ceiling is NOT a spending bill.


This. This exactly. The senate and house of reps approve budgets, and if they pass them -- we have those folks to blame for how much the USA is spending.

The "debt ceiling" is being used as political tool to fool the American people. Its actually quite sad and frustrating that so many people don't understand the debt ceiling -- and see through the lies and propaganda.



posted on Nov, 4 2015 @ 02:47 PM
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increase spending on healthcare but decrease it on oil wars and drug war.



posted on Nov, 4 2015 @ 02:49 PM
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they were able to do this debt ceiling deal because john Boehner who runs the house got all dems and enough repubs to vote on it and only then can Obama sign it or not. Although it is fishy that John Boehner is doing that and now retiring real quick. Blackmailed perhaps?




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