Armed black man gets pulled over for broken headlight: Good Ending

In my travels through the web, I keep finding stories about people's good interactions with police officers. But, I find very few of these stories here on ATS. While I understand the citizenry of this online community are not inclined to trust the establishment, we also have the motto: "Deny Ignorance."

So, in order to do my part to help others deny ignorance, I'd like to make people aware of this gentleman's good experience with the Tucson police department:

So, I’m driving to my office to turn in my weekly paperwork. A headlight is out. I see a Tucson Police Department squad vehicle turn around and follow me. I’m already preparing for the stop.

The lights go on, and I pull over. The officer asks me how I’m doing, and then asks if I have any weapons.

“Yes, sir. I’m a concealed carry permit holder, and my weapon is located on my right hip. My wallet is in my back-right pocket.”

The officer explains for his safety and mine, he needs to disarm me for the stop. I understand, and I unlock the vehicle. I explain that I’m running a 7TS ALS holster but from the angle, the second officer can’t unholster it. Lead officer asks me to step out, and I do so slowly. Officer relieves me of my Glock and compliments the X300U I’m running on it. He also sees my military ID and I tell him I’m with the National Guard.

You can read the rest of his post at his Facebook link.

I don't want to be seen as some kind of apologist for LEO. However, I believe that much of this negative news that we concentrate on concerning bad police officers is doing little more than exacerbating the "us versus them" mentality that benefits no one other than TPTB.

So, ATS, what say you?

-dex

I have known a lot of law enforcement folks, military and civilian.

This is my theory... about 1% of them are scumbags. Unfortunately, in this day and age, all we seem to see are the 1% behaving badly.

I have been stopped by LEOs twice while carrying a loaded weapon. In both cases the weapon was not an issue because of the actions I took when stopped. I identified myself as military and informed the officers where the weapon was located. On one instance i was asked out of the vehicle, and was frisked. (I was pulled over on suspicion of DUI at 1 AM in Arizona... I dropped a lit cigarette down inside of my work boots and was driving erratically... can you imagine?) The officer that night had reason to be suspicious, but when I passed a few tests and explained what happened... no big deal.

99% of the LEOs out there are in it for the right reasons, and tend to do the right thing. They are professionals.

(When I was active duty, random people would occasionally pay for my morning coffee as a "thank you"... now, when I see a LEO buying coffee; it's on me)

a reply to: DexterRiley

Most of these shootings are the direct result of not following a police officers demands. It seems like they escalate a situation with an attitude of non-compliance. However, shooting and killing an individual because they're simply not following an order is not putting the officer in danger. Even fleeing an officer is still not a direct threat to a police officer, but time and time again these some dirt bag officers feel they have a right to fire on a fleeing suspect. Unless the suspect brandishes a knife or a gun, is when there's really a threat to the officers life.

With all the police shooting which are making headlines today, you would think citizens would no better and comply with the officers demands. Police officers on the other hand should be more weary of pulling a revolver on an unarmed civilian. Joey Jackson who is the attorney who gives advice on CNN said it right. He says he tells his kids, you comply with a police officers orders no matter how much you feel your rights are being violated. He says there is another avenue to get your justice and that's the courts. It's better to walk away with your life and fight a day for your rights in a court of law.

originally posted by: chuck258
POST REMOVED BY STAFF

Did they make you feel silly in a thread or something? You seem bitter to name names like that. First of all they aren't required to reply to any threads they don't want to. Secondly, this thread wasn't even an hour old when you posted that.

On topic:

It's actually refreshing to see these sorts of thread pop up, it's a shame it's only four or five times a year. I'll agree with some of what he said pertaining to respect too, but the man in this video clearly knows how to communicate and what to communicate when dealing with police in this situation.

A lot of young black people don't seem to grasp these formalities when dealing with cops however. I know if I was in America being stopped by an armed policeman I wouldn't be concealing my hands down my pants and disputing the cop's orders at the side of the road anyways. I'm not sure if it's pride, defiance or ignorance but considering we can't easily do anything about the first two options we should really focus on educating young people about police encounters, what to expect, what to do, and what their rights are.

Edit:

Just realized I only talked about one side of the coin. Too easy to do these days since we have so many discussions on the problems with police already. I should mention that whilst I think educating young people is the best solution we have, I believe police training needs to be sorted out too. I also believe there should be more safeguards for police officers to report crimes commited by their fellow officers. I think that tamper-proof body cameras on officers should be mandatory during every stop.

a reply to: DexterRiley

Awesome!

No assumptions and cautious respect go a long way for everybody.

It would be helpful if more people got used to the idea of carrying concealed, it is such an important aspect of free society.

I'm a black male. My father was a cop for almost 30 years before he retired. My father gave me the talk growing up on how to interact with police. He always drilled into my head that regardless if I think I am right and the cop is wrong, the side of the road is not the place to play Johnny Cochran. He told me just follow the policeman's orders and we can deal with it later.

He was the first to admit that there are some racist cops. However, he knew like most straight thinking people, that you are not going to win an argument with a cop on the side of the road. It isn't worth escalating the situation. Just shut the ** up and move on.

Most cops just want to get home to their families safe. When you start talking back, not following directions, etc all you are doing is putting the cop even more on edge. Police never know who they are pulling over. You could be totally innocent or you could have a body in the trunk.

A lot of my friends growing up loved to talk sh*t to cops, always had an excuse, and always arguing with them even when they know damn well they are in the wrong. Guess what? These knuckleheads are the first to scream BlackLivesMatter and spout all kinds of nonsense about cops targeting black folks.

but the question is, or my question is- was this an isolated incidence, does this sort of thing happen often enough to even out being killed when you dont comply. excessive force is mostly the result of irrational behavior of a LEO when the purp or would be purp does not comply; or appear to, simply has an indication of not complying.

the guy in this story was legit, all it took was to show proper documentations. its not like a cop will go mental if he feels safe from the initial stop.

what if that guy said no my gun wasnt legal, its not likely it would have ended well. i dont think that cop would pursue all methods to diffuse th situation, the first chance he got , or construed anything as a threat, he would pull his gun out.

a reply to: odzeandennz

but the question is, or my question is- was this an isolated incidence, does this sort of thing happen often enough to even out being killed when you dont comply.

Think how many millions of police interactions there are with the public daily. Nothing makes unjustly killing someone or beating them OK, but it really helps put into perspective that cops aren't all out there trying to murder people.

So I have a concealed pistol license and have a tendency to get pulled over. I know it shows up when they run me, but I have not once had a cop disarm me. I've only offered the information once since the thing was visible and the cop didn't care at all. I wonder if I was black or scruffier if I would have more problems.

a reply to: DexterRiley

While I understand the citizenry of this online community are not inclined to trust the establishment, we also have the motto: "Deny Ignorance."

So, in order to do my part to help others deny ignorance, I'd like to make people aware of this gentleman's good experience with the Tucson police department:

Well to be fair violence sells....the reason you do not see many good cop stories is they are for the most part boring to people,its the same reason you see pretty much only bad news in the news other than the odd story about something good but that is rare....

The corrupt part of the force may only be 1% ....can anyone tell me how many active officers there are approximately in the U.S ?...i tried a search and came up with nada....

Our current culture has become obscene. For every video posted about a police officer doing something wrong, there are a hundred of them doing good than never get seen. We only get to see the worst of humanity on the news, because that is what carries ratings...

a reply to: WeRpeons
you hit it in the first sentence.

Many today do not know how to take orders. Not even from their parents and so they grow up not wanting to take orders and not knowing how to take orders (not talking about food orders and the like).

Military teaches many how to take orders. But many homes do not teach kids how to take orders. In my home if I give an order it is followed or there are consequences that follow for not.

no one gives orders just to give order (except in boot camp) the point is orders are in reality INSTRUCTIONS. Follow instruction and you wont get in trouble.

You follow instructions in setting up your boom Box system that blares 110db but you wont follow instruction from an authority. If that is you your priorities in life are messed up. Get with the program follow orders or pay the price.

originally posted by: madmac5150
I have known a lot of law enforcement folks, military and civilian.

This is my theory... about 1% of them are scumbags. Unfortunately, in this day and age, all we seem to see are the 1% behaving badly.

I have been stopped by LEOs twice while carrying a loaded weapon. In both cases the weapon was not an issue because of the actions I took when stopped. I identified myself as military and informed the officers where the weapon was located. On one instance i was asked out of the vehicle, and was frisked. (I was pulled over on suspicion of DUI at 1 AM in Arizona... I dropped a lit cigarette down inside of my work boots and was driving erratically... can you imagine?) The officer that night had reason to be suspicious, but when I passed a few tests and explained what happened... no big deal.

99% of the LEOs out there are in it for the right reasons, and tend to do the right thing. They are professionals.

(When I was active duty, random people would occasionally pay for my morning coffee as a "thank you"... now, when I see a LEO buying coffee; it's on me)

I think the real issue is that when we do see the BS that that 1% is doing, its the aftermath where they go more or less free of charge that pisses people off.

Nothing worse than showing the public that rich people, politicians and law enforcement are subject to less harsh laws than the general public

A man went to the doctor the other day and had his blood pressure checked. Amazing, the doctor did not kill him.

That doctor should be given credit for DOING his job... I think that's the moral of the story here, no?

Why should we hear all the tales of a cop doing his job properly? When it is clearly important to bring it up when they completely fail to do their job.

Unreal, really...

a reply to: laminatedsoul

Why should we hear all the tales of a cop doing his job properly? When it is clearly important to bring it up when they completely fail to do their job.

Because the only time we talk about cops is when they do something terrible. This greatly influences people who aren't smart enough to realize it isn't the norm for a cop to shoot someone.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

no one gives orders just to give order (except in boot camp) the point is orders are in reality INSTRUCTIONS. Follow instruction and you wont get in trouble.

I can see in some circumstances how that logic could lead to some serious human rights violations... Captain conformity away!!!!!

a reply to: WeRpeons

Most of these shootings are the direct result of not following a police officers demands. It seems like they escalate a situation with an attitude of non-compliance.
With all the police shooting which are making headlines today, you would think citizens would no better and comply with the officers demands.

Exactly. I've reviewed many of these police-related shootings of civilians; both videos and witness accounts. In most cases, it appears to me that the whole situation could have been avoided if the victim had just followed the police officer's directions.

However, shooting and killing an individual because they're simply not following an order is not putting the officer in danger.

And that's what's happening too often. As another poster indicated, the real problem here is when the cop walks free when they really should stand trial. That doesn't help the citizenry feel any more comfortable with the authorities.

Joey Jackson who is the attorney who gives advice on CNN said it right. He says he tells his kids, you comply with a police officers orders no matter how much you feel your rights are being violated. He says there is another avenue to get your justice and that's the courts. It's better to walk away with your life and fight a day for your rights in a court of law.

That is certainly sage advice. We need to train our children to have the proper respect for not only law enforcement officers, but also anyone else that they have to deal with. That's how I was raised.

-dex

Yes there are good cops in bad precincts and bad cops in good precincts but to me the problem is more than just cops for while they are the focus of our wrath when they unnecessarily took someone's life or just simply abused them out of boredom, we often overlook the role city/county government played in their actions, in some places they play the role of tax collectors which was behind much of the discontent in Ferguson, Michael Brown was just the straw, the city council pushed this taxation through fines and ticketing, which meant that the folks most likely to be harassed are the poor and the powerless often clothed in dark skin, in another thread I bought up the NYC subway wide sitting stance in which cops passed out tickets at 2:00 A.M in order to fill ticket quotas, in some quarters they may need arrests to fill quotas, this kind of action leads to one person being stopped multiple times in a wk or even a day ,so naturally someone is gonna say look leave me alone I wasn't doing anything !this leads to further confrontations ending badly.
I say look at the city council all the way up to the state government and their policies that helped turned many a would be good cop into a bad cop, cops may just be the face of the problem the local or even state government may actually be the cause.

a reply to: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

The corrupt part of the force may only be 1% ....can anyone tell me how many active officers there are approximately in the U.S ?...i tried a search and came up with nada....

Wikipedia indicates about 1.1 million state and local LEO. And about 120,000 federal. That data is a bit old, so I'd guess about 1.3 million law enforcement officers total.

1% of 1.3 million = 13000 dirt bags. That's an average of 260 per each of the 50 states.
There are 3,144 counties in the US. So that means an average of 4 per county.
Population of the US is 318.9 million. So average of about one bad cop per 25,000 people.

-dex

a reply to: DexterRiley

Thx for your reply.....

According to this site there were roughly 12000 police stations in 2013 so by these numbers we are looking at about 1 bad apple in every police station in the U.S......

I would assume then with these numbers the bad apples should stick out like sore thumbs......