Tax Credit Cuts Delayed As Govt Defeated

a reply to: Cobaltic1978

They are criminal weasals, they do not like it when thing's do not go there way and Cameron fully intends to step outside the legal powers of parliement in order to enact punitive measures on the house of Lord's.

But then how many people have they Killed, have you heard about his Cronies gestappo like idea of stationing so called Job Advisers at Food Banks.

Food Banks for the first time since the war our people are starving to death or being forced to heat or eat, these men are wanton criminal scum and those that voted for them are insane flaming idiot's we are the sixth wealthiest nation on the planet but all that money is in the hands of a tiny few whom these fraudsters are really representing, in fact that tiny few have doubled there wealth while everyone else has gotten poorer since the so called Austerity measures were enacted under the Condem's, now the Con's are running the show it is much worse.

originally posted by: LABTECH767


Food Banks for the first time since the war our people are starving to death or being forced to heat or eat, these men are wanton criminal scum and those that voted for them are insane flaming idiot's.

I am always amused when this comes up and gets quoted .... As I understand

it we are heading towards an obesity crisis?

I am amazed when in a supermarket to see the over flowing shopping trollies

going through the check outs ... makes me wonder how people would have

managed during and after the war? Indeed the last items that came off

rationing were meat and sweets, and that was in 1953!!


The following is the amount allowed per person per week... 1oz = 28.3grams

# 4oz cheese

# 4oz bacon or ham

# 2oz butter

# 2oz margarine

# 2oz cooking fat (lard)

# 8oz sugar

# 4oz jam

# 12oz mince or equivalent in meat or chicken

# 2oz tea (adults only)

# 1 fresh egg (3 for children)

# 3 dried powdered eggs

# (7 pints milk for children under 5yrs
(31/2 pints for school age + 1/3pint at school

# 1 pint worth of dried milk powder

# 3oz sweets (Lol ...how would the kids of today manage?)

There was also something called 'points' 24 per person per month , half

that for children which were used for tinned food, toping up jam etc. and

for luxuries? LOL!! wasn't many of those around.... oranges and bananas

came under that banner.

originally posted by: eletheia

originally posted by: LABTECH767


Food Banks for the first time since the war our people are starving to death or being forced to heat or eat, these men are wanton criminal scum and those that voted for them are insane flaming idiot's.

I am always amused when this comes up and gets quoted .... As I understand

it we are heading towards an obesity crisis?

I am amazed when in a supermarket to see the over flowing shopping trollies

going through the check outs ... makes me wonder how people would have

managed during and after the war? Indeed the last items that came off

rationing were meat and sweets, and that was in 1953!!


The following is the amount allowed per person per week... 1oz = 28.3grams

# 4oz cheese

# 4oz bacon or ham

# 2oz butter

# 2oz margarine

# 2oz cooking fat (lard)

# 8oz sugar

# 4oz jam

# 12oz mince or equivalent in meat or chicken

# 2oz tea (adults only)

# 1 fresh egg (3 for children)

# 3 dried powdered eggs

# (7 pints milk for children under 5yrs
(31/2 pints for school age + 1/3pint at school

# 1 pint worth of dried milk powder

# 3oz sweets (Lol ...how would the kids of today manage?)

There was also something called 'points' 24 per person per month , half

that for children which were used for tinned food, toping up jam etc. and

for luxuries? LOL!! wasn't many of those around.... oranges and bananas

came under that banner.

During the wartime rationing our people were the healthiest they have ever been, that is a fact but to quote my family you would see butchers with skinned cat's hanging in the display and labelled as rabit's.

It does not however amuse me, the poorest are Starving, did you agree with LDS when he said he could live on £53 a week but refused to prove it by doing so even for one week, then what about those whom are sanctioned with no money to live on at all, often unfairly sanctioned because they are too ill to work but they are litterally telling terminally ill patiants that they are fit enough to work or have you not heard about dying cancer patients being told to find a job and he want's to abolish the welfare state entirely even the state pension, remember Osbourn's boast that leaked months before the election that he was going to get our welfare budget back to 1930's level's which means total abolition of the welfare state is his goal.

You know what makes me even more angry, I am a northerner and we suffered disproportionatly under the Torys in the past, indeed you know all those state sell off's of our state OWNED industrys that we owned just as much as all the rest of the UK, well were did all that money go other than making money for Tory investors whom ended up selling our infrastructor on to foreign investor's, well it mostly went to the south with a far higher proportion of those *Short term and non renewable" funds raised from the sell off of our national assets being plowed into Conservative Constituancy's as short term economic boosts and investment's and this is one reason some of us absolutely HATE the unforgivable Tory's (and I do personally draw a distinction between a conservative and a Tory - by the way I am Aristocracy by ancestry myself so go figure, my mother is LADY HALLWORTH robbed of her inheritance) and we hate them with an absolute bloody vengeance that has continued to simmer for the past 35 years, the kid's can be hoodwinked but most of us can NOT be hoodwinked by them.

Sell off of the state houseing, "Oh I like them they let me own my own home" when I hear that it make's me feel physically ill at the vulgarity and idiocy of the statement, we had the likes of redrow home's, whimpy and barret building beautiful private affordable home's, supporting a massive private building trade and industry that slumped with the sell off's as no one wanted a new home and this caused jobs to be lost in the building trade up and down the country as well and there were many other builders small and large until she did that whom had been creating brand spanking new high quality homes for sale so the sell off of our national housing stock was a travesty that exchanged long term income stability for councils for short term spending frenzy's and by the way all she did was reduce the wait as you could already apply to buy your council home anyway as long as you had lived in it for over a decade.

The torys are every bit as bad, and perhaps this lot are worse, as there extreme opposite the Looney left militants such as the reprehensible Derek Hatton whom even the merseyside labour votors ended up hating but let me be clear here Corbyn is at least honest and I do not put him as Looney left as he is not about stuffing his own pocket's and changing stripes once in power (as the militant and looney left were when they became NEW LABOUR or Tory Light as we like to call them), he at least is a man of commitment and integrity so if you don't like his policys well fair is fair but he is a far better human being than Cameron and Co and actually cares about YOU unlike them, think about that.

My only reservation is his personal appeasement of Hezbollah but the middle east situation is divisive and his personal choice on that matter is unlikely to become foreign policy even if he wins as it has to have the consent of his party, especially for him as he truly does believe in democratic process and will stand by it though I like him all the more for speaking his mind on this point even though I am more pro Isreali.

originally posted by: LABTECH767
During the wartime rationing our people were the healthiest they have ever been, that is a fact but to quote my family you would see butchers with skinned cat's hanging in the display and labelled as rabit's.

I agree with you on that score ... I personally think the majority of people

eat too much anyway. I've never eaten rabbit... that I know of, and don't

know if I would be able to tell the difference between a skinned rabbit and

a skinned cat.

It does not however amuse me, the poorest are Starving, did you agree with LDS when he said he could live on £53 a week but refused to prove it by doing so even for one week,

It would be easy to do anything difficult in the short term, so it would not

really prove anything. Then what does it mean by 'living' does it include

rent, council tax, heating .... or simply food!! I could live on that if heating

and council tax was excluded.

then what about those whom are sanctioned with no money to live on at all, often unfairly sanctioned because they are too ill to work but they are litterally telling terminally ill patiants that they are fit enough to work or have you not heard about dying cancer patients being told to find a job and he want's to abolish the welfare state entirely even the state pension, remember Osbourn's boast that leaked months before the election that he was going to get our welfare budget back to 1930's level's which means total abolition of the welfare state is his goal.

The other side of the coin is that for every one of those ^^^^^ there is another

abusing the system. People like 'papers' use the best angle to tell a sympathy tale

... I do not know of anyone who fits the unfair sanctions critieria either

personally, or second or third hand ....BUT I do know several people who are

getting what they shouldn't be.

You know what makes me even more angry, I am a northerner and we suffered disproportionatly under the Torys in the past, indeed you know all those state sell off's of our state OWNED industrys that we owned just as much as all the rest of the UK, well were did all that money go other than making money for Tory investors whom ended up selling our infrastructor on to foreign investor's, well it mostly went to the south with a far higher proportion of those *Short term and non renewable" funds raised from the sell off of our national assets being plowed into Conservative Constituancy's as short term economic boosts and investment's and this is one reason some of us absolutely HATE the unforgivable Tory's (and I do personally draw a distinction between a conservative and a Tory - by the way I am Aristocracy by ancestry myself so go figure, my mother is LADY HALLWORTH robbed of her inheritance) and we hate them with an absolute bloody vengeance that has continued to simmer for the past 35 years, the kid's can be hoodwinked but most of us can NOT be hoodwinked by them.

I too am from the north and have lived through 18 different governments

8 labour, 9 conservatives, and 1 con/lib and I have always felt better off

under a conservative government. I have relatives who live in the mining

villages in the north, miners who lost their jobs and got compensation

and from their own mouths they have said "They have never been

so well off." Who an I to argue with that!

Sell off of the state houseing, "Oh I like them they let me own my own home" when I hear that it make's me feel physically ill at the vulgarity and idiocy of the statement, we had the likes of redrow home's, whimpy and barret building beautiful private affordable home's, supporting a massive private building trade and industry that slumped with the sell off's as no one wanted a new home and this caused jobs to be lost in the building trade up and down the country as well and there were many other builders small and large until she did that whom had been creating brand spanking new high quality homes for sale so the sell off of our national housing stock was a travesty that exchanged long term income stability for councils for short term spending frenzy's and by the way all she did was reduce the wait as you could already apply to buy your council home anyway as long as you had lived in it for over a decade.

I believe it was after 5years of tenancy that they were elegible to purchase.

Here again (even if it makes you feel sick) many people did do very well. You

could always tell which houses on an estate were privately owned, as the

new 'householder' took pride in their new home. After the stipulated time

that they were unable to sell for they let that ex. council house property and

bought a spanking new house from the Whimpys, Barret, or any of the builders

you mentioned above. So I would say to that 'Didn't they do well? I like a good

success story.

And no my heart doesn't bleed for those builders .... I've never met a poor

builder yet!

The torys are every bit as bad, and perhaps this lot are worse, as there extreme opposite the Looney left militants such as the reprehensible Derek Hatton whom even the merseyside labour votors ended up hating but let me be clear here Corbyn is at least honest and I do not put him as Looney left as he is not about stuffing his own pocket's and changing stripes once in power (as the militant and looney left were when they became NEW LABOUR or Tory Light as we like to call them), he at least is a man of commitment and integrity so if you don't like his policys well fair is fair but he is a far better human being than Cameron and Co and actually cares about YOU unlike them, think about that.

You could be being a little presumptuous?? What is it they say? POWER CORRUPTS?

a reply to: eletheia

A fair answer, My mother has always been Conservative until this government though she does not know the last thing about politic's and I have always been labour but original labour.

Now it is truth not simply my opinion that previous conservative government's were actually filling the shoes that "New Labour" stole from them and this meant that the conservatives really had no where to go but further right and I feel that is exactly what they have done.

I have to say that I liked John Major though even though he was a Conservative but I feel very much he was a Conservative Prime minister not a Tory Prime minister and I will always like Edwina curry for sacrificing her political career by warning the public about the Listeria in the chicken egg's, I never liked Tony Blair or Gordon Brown, indeed I hated new labour for what it was - a betrayal of the core labour values and votors as my ideals are and have always been traditional labour so maybe I am stuck in my ways.

Many members of my family too were miners and quite a few of them died down the mines though my mother has aristocratic blood on her fathers mothers side and was the grand niece and heir of Lady Elizabeth Tattershall her grandmothers sister whom childless left everything the Tattershalls owned and had built up in trust for my mother, indeed her God Parent's were actually Lord and Lady Tattershall, by rights she is the heir of Tattershall bloodstocks AKA The Ring's but a victim of organised hirarchy fraud.

Ken Hind whom was the MP for West Lancashire from the 1983 to 1992 told her that he could not help her any more just ten days before he left office and that if she ever tried to get anywhere there was someone in every department whom would put a stop to the investigation, he said it was simply that there was no gentleman were this much money was concerned but had already told her that she was a multi millionaress with a mansion and the title of lady, indeed when my mother first went to see him he at first was convinced that he had already met my mother at a function in London but to get into telling you all we know about corruption in political circles would take far too long, needless to say we also have a letter from the HRH Queen Elizabeth Late Queen mother whom wished my mother well but said that it was not something the palace could deal with but informed my mother in the letter that she was supposedly deceased in 1960 under the name of her first husband whom she had divorced in 1959 "Lady Alice Leslie" and that a plaque had been dedicated to her on the Tattershall stand at Aintree Racecourse.

When my mother went to see the late Myrabelle Topham the woman litterally broke down shaking and crying in fright when my mother said whom she was and simply said that she had exchanged (not sold) my Mothers documents for one million pound in cash in a gladstone bag in 1970 to a man by the name of Bill Davies a liverpool gangster whom is simply referred to a property developer, he paid off a number of police for corrupt action's to do with his scams in the 1960's including forcing my mother to sign documents under duress, she did not know about her inheritance at the time and was poor as a church mouse trying to raise children while scrubbing the floors of the birds eye factory in liverpool and she was also disabled and has been all her life but worked as best she could as no one was willing to help her, one day in 1962 her door at no 2 alvanly green in kirkby merseyside was kicked down and a police officer and police woman charged into the house, they did not knock and once inside they manhandled my mother whom had commited no crime and was in fear and shock at this attack.

She fought back not knowing why she was being attacked by police for no reason and the police woman fell on her arse and pissed (my mother weighed just four stone and was feeding her children what she should have been eating but was fearsom in defence of those children), they took her to the police station and then without remand she was transferred and held at Strangeways prison were the inmates took a liking to her with one woman, a lady of the night making my mother eat her own dinner so my mother will never speak bad of such people.

While she was in there she was taken to the office and a warderess placed a stack of documents on the table in front of her with a plain piece of paper over them exposing only a space for my mother to sign, she was told if she did not they would imprison her for four years and take her children away, so in terror and of course innocent she signed what she did not know but it was a whole stack of papers.

She was taken to london road in liverpool were she was taken into the court room, nothing was read out but the judge merely asked my mother name and then said "it is the order of this court that you are to east three square meals a day and to look after yourself" and she was told to wait outside, a whole group of police men came past and each stopped and shook my bewildered mothers hand, a story then appeared in which they claimed my mother had stolen 28 shillings form the gas meter, she had not but the police officer had put his boot into it when he had smashed the door dowm, about a month later a different police officer knocked at my mothers house and simply said that he was sorry for what they had done to my mother and that the police whom had done it no longer worked for them, Bill davies had given each a public house on the dock road of liverpool (Bootle).

This sounds far fetched but believe me it is absolutely true, my mother was what you call innocent natured and did not have any idea about her trust, she had been educated to play the piano and greet people but her inheritance had been concealed from her and she never recieved it, those documents signed in 1962 were probably trust documents and deed's and they were signed under clear duress.

Solicitor after Solicitor has said it is a criminal case, Police officer after Police officer has said it is a Civil case though those whom have robbed my mother are no relation, the Conservative MP whom was also a practicing barrister told her he could no longer help her and that it was so much money that no gentleman was above board and that there was someone in every department whom would put a stop to any investigation, Collin Pickthall his Labour successor would not even meet her or give her an appointment and so far she has had no luck with his successor Rosie Cooper.

My mother found the police woman years later, one Vivienne Webster-Jones in my mothers property in kensington London running it fraudulantly.

Now we have had our share of politicians of all partys and they are not to be trusted, they are not men of calibre or woman of calibre and they are not honest but I actually feel Corby is just that and if for no other reason I am going to vote for him come hell of high water, he has put the fear of god into the corrupt cushy seated members of his own party and is turning into a nightmare for the Tory's as well and I love it, maybe it is just that I hate a system that is so riddled with corruption and to see these crooks in the unholy trinity of Cameron, Osbourn and Smith turn and victimise the poorest is worse than hitting below the belt, they are patently evil and laugh heartlessly at the suffering they inflict on the most vulnerable in our society.

a reply to: LABTECH767


I can relate to everything you have said ...right down to scrubbing floors

been there done that got the t shirt!

I think your mothers problem was, that she was a 'woman' because as

long ago as 1970 you wouldn't believe how few 'rights' a woman had. That was

when I got divorced, and I couldn't believe how the odds were stacked against

me.

I can still hear my soliciter saying to me "the court won't like it" and me

replying "well ask the court because its what I will need." I discovered as a

*woman* I was #unable to access internal birth control without the permission

of my husband

my body ... his permission!! How does that work???

#unable to have a mortgage without a male guarantor. #unable to get credit....

Things have improved a lot in the last 20 years or so.


Unfortunately your mother was let down by the people she trusted, and

perhaps if she had gone to a lawyer rather than an MP she may have got a

better result.


There are shifty untrustworthy characters in all walks of life....one of the

slipperiest in my opinion is Tony Blair I'd put him in the same category as a

'used car salesman' but hey! I think that's being unfair to used car salesmen




I have a theory, it is said that it is older people ie. pensioners who vote

conservative? Could this be because, like me they have lived through both

flavours of government and found out which one tastes best? LOL!!


Seriously though people mock about politicians going to the best schools etc.

and in reality .... anyone in business who needs to employ an accountant or

a lawyer etc.would they chose the best educated? or somebody who has just

managed to scrape by, by the skin of their teeth!!

a reply to: eletheia

Agree absolutely on Blair, his wife a barrister as you know got away with a fraudulant property deal concerning some flat's and that was only what we got to hear but I get the impression it was far larger, maybe what our problem is in fact is now which side of the political equation we favour but are there any honest and trustworthy politicians that we can agree with.

My mother had a solicitor called Dickinson, Parker and Hill in ormskirk and was informed that a Mr Reece whom was her solicitor her left the company and set up his own company called Scot and Reece in Skelmersdale new town, we were told that a solicitor called Royston Smith there had some of my mothers documents as apparently Reece took them with him when he left Dickinson, Parker and Hill, we were also told by a respected rocal business man whom was a disgruntled and disgusted after hearing of it at a local private chambers meeting, a member of the local hirarchy that Mr Hill whom is now a circuit judge the senior partner at the Solicitors had been behind a lot of this dirty work.

They are the local Legal Society senior figures, My mother had gone to them to ask for help and they ended up helping themselves to what was her's, worse when Reece left they put my mother under a man by the name of Chohan, he was as we found later not even a qualified solicitor so they were litterally palming my mother off.

The police said verbally that they could not do anything as Mr Hill was too high up (they take many of there orders through the masonic lodge and there official dutys do not figure in such cases).

But it get's much more complicated, My mothers Aunt Gertrude Beverly we found in a terrible state in Haslingdon in an old folks home abused and badly neglected, they cleaned her up when my mother complained (this was back in the 80's) and Gertrude started to tell her about what had happened, Gertrudes mind was gone and had been for a long time as she was convinced her son William Beverley was alive (he was shot down and killed in the second world war, Ft Lt William Beverley) and a social worker called Tony Robinson was claiming to her that he was her son William, he was also using the name Dennis Hulme along with another guy whom was also using the same psuedonym and a click of other corrupt social workers including one Mrs Edie.

One day we got up there and found my mother's aunt in a terrible state, the home said she had fallen but the bruise which we photographed looked like a fist mark on the side of her face, she was 96 years of age.

Gertrudes death certificate was signed by one Doctor Harold Shipman.

The police would not do anything.

Who do you turn to when you are up against the system.

It is a sad thing to realise that our hirarchy in the UK is not only riddled with corruption right up to the politicians but is actually in a great part built on it, a hell of a lot of those supposed lords have no right to there titles which were effectively stolen by fraud and most politicians in all partys even if they are a nice chap are litterally rotten scoundrels of the worst kind.

There are still good people though and we have met police officers (ususally lower rank) whom were honest and disgusted one even told my mother when the Cheetah fraud in liverpool was being wrapped up that they were simply covering up, n one was ever going to get back to my mother as the higher ups had told them to butt out, and he was leaving the police out disgust, that young gentleman was a scottish police man whom had been working for merseyside police but left to join the ambulance service, he was a junior detective so something bad must have been on his mind to quit his profession and that will tell you how dissilusioned he had become with what he found he was working for.

originally posted by: LABTECH767


Maybe what our problem is in fact is now which side of the political equation we favour but are there any honest and trustworthy politicians that we can agree with.

Well we all saw Nick Clegg get in last time after his performance in the

pre election debate, Nice guy, fresh governmental blood .. till he got in!

There was conservative MP Geoffrey Dickinson, who campaigned

for more than 10years to expose a paedophile ring of MP's, people in the

church and others in high places. He feared he was on a hit list, and for

repercussions to his family. In 1983 he handed a dossier naming 8 public

figures to the then Home Secretary, none other than the late Leon Brittan,

who if you remember claimed not to know anything about it!!

The police said verbally that they could not do anything as Mr Hill was too high up (they take many of there orders through the masonic lodge and there official dutys do not figure in such cases).
The police would not do anything.

Who do you turn to when you are up against the system.

Shades of the impotence of the abuse victims of Jimmy Saville, Rolf Harris,

Max Clifford et al....

It is a sad thing to realise that our hirarchy in the UK is not only riddled with corruption right up to the politicians but is actually in a great part built on it, a hell of a lot of those supposed lords have no right to there titles which were effectively stolen by fraud and most politicians in all partys even if they are a nice chap are litterally rotten scoundrels of the worst kind.

Its a long out dated system of *jobs for the boys* if indeed you could actually

call it a job ? Most of them are a bit long in the tooth and should be retired.

It is an unnecessary, outdated and over subscribed institution that should be

done away with sooner rather than later. There is NO room for it in a

modern day society.

a reply to: eletheia

I agree thoroughly but it is a situation were that tradition is so entrenched that we will likely never see the end of it.

Maybe that is why I like Corbyn, ok he is not the anti establishment figure he seem's to be but he is upsetting the apple cart for them.

Personally all I really want to see is a country in which Rule of Law is exactly that, of course judges should be able to rule on the grey area but the sheer number of peodophiles in power, of course not just here in our nation, is a damning indictment of a system that has become uncaring and corrupt.

The Good men seldom make it and that is why in truth most of the decent politicians are stuck on the back benches.

I agree absolutley about Clegg and can no believe I once considered voting Liberal Democrat, now they have a spin boy in charge of there party and are trying to pick up the pieces of the devastation caused by Clegg's decision.

I just hope we can see a better future for the sake of the kid's, one in which the Special privileges and protections of the city of london bankers and financiel fraudsters are removed as well as proper legal accountability for public figures, hell this may sould elitist but I think all MPs should have to sit a battery of psychometric and IQ tests and to have there accounts' and assets made public for up to ten years during after there term of office to establish they are trust worthy and not sociopaths but that would never fly as nearly all the MP's would fail the tests and most MP's hide there assets in the name of members of there family or through dodgy property transfers that are made with so called gentlemen's agreement's.

originally posted by: anxiouswens
This is one of the big reasons why a lot of people in the UK want to renegotiate our relationship with the EU or leave. Its madness. The EU was fine when all the Countries were on an equal footing, but once poorer Countries like Poland started to join it became imbalanced. Obviously, we here in the UK would be able to go over to Poland and claim benefits but those benefits are nothing like what Polish people receive here. One of my closest friends is Polish, she came here 8 years ago, she said wages in Poland are terrible. Her mum works 60 hours a week and receives about £200 a month. My friend says sometimes she feels ashamed of her fellow man because some do come here to just claim all they can because of our generous benefits system.

The trouble is that the benefits system in the UK is structured quite unlike those in other EU countries. Receiving a tax credit (a negative tax) for working? Unheard of. In some countries you do actually receive a deduction on your taxable income if you work, but it is not a tax credit. Benefits are usually treated as earned income and is subject to income taxes, while they are tax free in the UK and equals to an annual income of around £30k. However, in most EU countries, if you are out of job, you get a quite decent unemployment benefit for up to 6 months or so (after which they decrease significantly, unlike in the UK).

The UK could quite easily rid itself of these issues by restructuring its benefits system to become more like those in other developed countries (not necessarily Poland).