The Phoenix Incident Movie 2015 part spoiler?

a reply to: JimOberg

Precisely. How many people would you expect to call the police excitedly to report seeing a squadron of planes fly over their home?

None really, but one person did call to report planes apparently. But then unless there was a log kept, that's not very useful information.

ok i think im still as confused as before. So the calls to the police were legit calls because who would call if they just seen planes? Did the first incident happen? Was there a ship, quite large going over the city? Can 1000s of witnesses be wrong? We know what a plane looks like, so they people had to be able to see this object they have never seen before...I wouldn't even doubt that its 'wasn't an experiment by the Govt with new aircraft..That would make the most sense, but something tells me it really was a ship and didn't belong to us. Of course the 2nd theory makes it most interesting. Is there a site where we can see the original ufo reports from 1997??

Bud316

a reply to: bud316

We know what a plane looks like, so they people had to be able to see this object they have never seen before

We know what the Moon looks like but .....
Moon mistaken for UFO

There was someone on this forum who also mistook the Moon for a UFO a couple of years ago , it was a genuine mistake but it shows when some see something in the sky they think is odd their brain fills in the blanks.

originally posted by: bud316

Joel.. Good info...So.... Was there a ship seen earlier in the day? If there was, then the rest doesn't matter... We already know they tried to diverge the situation, but i read it was too late, there is even one story that this thing came close to 4 people in Phoenix.. I wish we knew the truth.. cause this is probably the best case of UFOs i have heard of..
Bud316

thank you guys for participating.. all info in good info..

You can find many reports for the entire day at NUFORC, there were earlier sightings all the way back to Vegas.
Just go to Nevada and search the day 3/13/97 or whatever it was?
For further detail look at other states during that day and around that day. There were reports in Texas of a big triangle as well.

Also look up an Art Bell episode of coast to coast on youtube where Peter Davenport is a guest. He is the director of NUFORC and he has a few sets of witnesses speak about what they saw.

originally posted by: gortex

If by that you mean the propagators of the myth then yeah I'd have to agree.

A10 pics


These A10 planes are not likely the source of giant slow amber lights. Look at the underside.

originally posted by: ZetaRediculian

If you go by reports of unidentified lights only, then THAT would be the biased sampling. Most likely if someone saw these lights and identified them as planes, that wouldn't get reported. The most unbiased sampling would have to be random interviews of the general population soon after the event.

No, AFTER the initial reports there was a media frenzy and public outcry to find out what the lights were. During THAT time over 1000 calls came in to help identify what was in the sky.
Of those ONE was reporting a plane.
See how the facts get wiped out with time?
If people took it serious right away it would have been better sorted. But the rest of the city council refused to investigate in any way.
The council woman brought it up at a meeting after the event and no one spoke to her question.
Usually a council person is given a staff and such to complete tasks related to public need. Her request was met with silence. Later she asked another member why and learned that everyone had been told not to mention the event.

She later went to Senator Mckain after being embarrased and pissed off but he wasn't of help either. He was met with silence as well.

originally posted by: JimOberg


Precisely. How many people would you expect to call the police excitedly to report seeing a squadron of planes fly over their home?

Like I pointed out above, the initial 700 calls were of strange lights, fine.

But during later weeks there were over 1000 calls in response to media coverage and requests to solve the mystery.
The council woman, all the other council members and the Mayors office were all flooded with calls. The news was asking "What was it?". The answers from residents was only one phone report of planes and one report of planes in NUFORC. Which, if the flares were distractions then so was that report.
The flares could have been a coincidence?

The people who really know are the fighter pilots who went up to investigate.

There is a civilian air traffic controller who admits to seeing lights from the tower (not the flares) but seeing nothing on radar, which helps rule out planes.

There was a military Lieutenant who called NUFORC to say a jet pilot was so shaken he had to be helped from his plane. Peter Davenport knows the pilots name and ID but he respected his request to remain anonymous. To this day the pilot refuses to speak to Peter. So there is no confirmation, but reason to believe there is some truth to the story.
Davenport does try to debunk stories pretty hard. The more fantastic the more he scrutinizes and demands interviews, names etc..

originally posted by: bud316
ok i think im still as confused as before. So the calls to the police were legit calls because who would call if they just seen planes? Did the first incident happen? Was there a ship, quite large going over the city? Can 1000s of witnesses be wrong? We know what a plane looks like, so they people had to be able to see this object they have never seen before...I wouldn't even doubt that its 'wasn't an experiment by the Govt with new aircraft..That would make the most sense, but something tells me it really was a ship and didn't belong to us. Of course the 2nd theory makes it most interesting. Is there a site where we can see the original ufo reports from 1997??

Bud316

www.nuforc.org...

Scroll to 3/13/97


There is a documentary by Lynn Ketai called The Phoenix Lights, Out of the Blue by James Fox, UFO Hunters did an episode, all on youtube. Plus other stuff, you have to keep looking around, at skeptic websites as well.
Try to find all the info you can, try to debunk it as well.
Look for triangle sightings in Arizona prior to 3/97.
Investigate A10-Warthog flight movements and patterns out of Arizona.

Again, Art Bell, Coast to Coast, Peter Davenport, PLights episode was really insightful.

7 At night and a city of over a million . Lasted for 2 hours and only 1000 people reported it??? Pretty much sums it up for me. It was nothing.

originally posted by: mikell
7 At night and a city of over a million . Lasted for 2 hours and only 1000 people reported it??? Pretty much sums it up for me. It was nothing.

Your algebraic skills could probably use some refreshment.

So, a city of over a million must all come outside when a UFO flies overhead, and if they don't, then nothing overhead exists?
after dusk in Phoenix, most people are inside taking it easy after getting home from work, and a percentage of those are usually outside grilling steaks or chicken or swimming in their pools, etc.
A pretty average situation..

a reply to: joelr

No, AFTER the initial reports there was a media frenzy and public outcry to find out what the lights were. During THAT time over 1000 calls came in to help identify what was in the sky.
Of those ONE was reporting a plane.
See how the facts get wiped out with time?

I would still argue that we don't have the full, most accurate picture in this situation....and I don't think this was a formation of planes either. A "media frenzy" doesn't really invoke feelings of an unbiased data source either. I would probably argue "biased sampling" in most situations anyway mostly because I am a pain in the butt. So where are all these reports of planes I am hearing about coming from?

originally posted by: gortex
a reply to: bud316

We know what a plane looks like, so they people had to be able to see this object they have never seen before

We know what the Moon looks like but .....
Moon mistaken for UFO

There was someone on this forum who also mistook the Moon for a UFO a couple of years ago , it was a genuine mistake but it shows when some see something in the sky they think is odd their brain fills in the blanks.

no one can be that dumb, have to assume someone was just prank calling the police.

originally posted by: mikell
7 At night and a city of over a million . Lasted for 2 hours and only 1000 people reported it??? Pretty much sums it up for me. It was nothing.

good point why was it so few . . . I never stopped to think, I thought at first it was so many that it couldn't be a hoax. But I also noticed all the witnesses look like burnt out hippies, I shouldn't judge but why that coincidence too? I wonder if they all got together to make the hoax and call the police saying they saw a v shaped thing. Motive? It made em money since . . .

originally posted by: ZetaRediculian
a reply to: joelr

I would still argue that we don't have the full, most accurate picture in this situation....and I don't think this was a formation of planes either. A "media frenzy" doesn't really invoke feelings of an unbiased data source either. I would probably argue "biased sampling" in most situations anyway mostly because I am a pain in the butt. So where are all these reports of planes I am hearing about coming from?

I don't think someone is being a pain in the butt because they have formed their own opinions. That's what people should do anyways.

There is no way to get a fully accurate picture at this point. But there is a lot of interesting information in the NUFORC reports. Lot's of pre-March 97 Arizona sightings of Triangles also.

There really aren't many reports of planes. There are 2 in the reports and one of those people was the same who called the council woman directly.
So 2, that's it.

The rest of the airplane stuff is people speculating that everyone was fooled by a bunch of A-10 Warthogs.
The thread that was debunking the Phoenix Lights recently had that video of lights that someone caught on the evening of 3/13/97 near Phoenix.
It was the only video of the earlier lights that was supposedly a triangle ship.
In the thread it was being debunked because one of the lights was not lined up with the others showing it really couldn't be a solid craft. Therefore it must be planes.


The man making the video stated that it definitely wasn't planes, but that's not fully convincing.
But if anyone actually reads the reports you can see that there were different phenomena in the sky that night.
One of the first reports for 3/13 is a man (also a pilot) who was seeing white orb lights fly around in different formations (including triangle). An important thing here is it was still light out, it was 5pm and he could also see actual planes in the area. The lights were moving faster than all air traffic, were not connected to any airplane and were highly unusual.

So those lights could easily be the lights in that video mentioned above. Fast moving orbs in an almost-triangle position and the man taping was positive it wasn't airplanes. He also heard no sound.
Plus A10's do not have white lights on the bottom, or clearance to fly around with no blinking lights over suburban areas.

So I don't think the case is debunked at all. It seems like it's a question of military secret tech or other-world tech.

There is a really good daylight triangle sighting in Feb 97 Arizona, right before the PH reports start.


The Illinois triangle stuff is pretty solid, they are flying around. But what the hell are they?

I would say military except MANY of the reports say extreme acceleration, and other even weirder things. But they are common if not impossibly weird, like un-cloaking, disappearing, shutting autos completely off.

I would believe in ET before I believe the military has unlocked the secrets to gravity and space-time.
That would leak. Ufo secrets don't leak because the military can't get any closer than we can to get secrets.



The other thing about only 1000 people seeing the PH. There were more than 1000 calls, altogether more like 2K.
Many people saw it in family groups so only one family member will call.
The other thing is, who is anyone kidding??
In cities and suburbs do you know what we do with all our free time???? Yes some are more constructive and are working on a craft or sport or reading and the rest are watching tv, or playing video games or online or if out are watching a movie or eating or having quality time with our mate. Whatever..... we all look up at the sky for that 4 second walk to our car when going to Wendy's to eat junk food.
We would miss a frikn alien invasion if someone didn't tell us what was happening. Or if the TV didn't tell us.
And when we drive we look at the road just enough to not die. The rest is focused on changing the radio or watching girls.

I'm not judging, I'm saying the way society is, we easily could miss, and probably DO miss triangle ships flying over our houses all the time.

Yea

About the flares. Does any one know how long these burn? I heard 2 hrs that these lights were in the air.. How the hell can a flare last that long, in same location without blowing left or right...Since the lights were supposly behind the mountains as the lights disappeared tells me what ever it was, was coming in from the distance..late at night, i was for sure i seen a UFO one night.. i watched it almost 20 minutes. What i was seeing was the headlights of a plane on a clear night flying into Sarasota airport...I watched it go up and down side to side and i was freaking out a bit.. still it got right up over me, i could see it was a plane he was just riding the turbulence over the ocean..Last approx 20 mins.. i was calling everyone outside, i said look! What a deception.

a reply to: joelr

You absolutely right though, this could have been easily missed..not all of us are scanning the skys...