How exactly was Jesus' crucifixion a sacrifice?

a reply to: randyvs

How was Jesus' suffering during crucifixion greater than any of 6000 Jewish men that were crucified outside the city walls during the siege of Jerusalem?

When Jesus was born, wasn't his death a guarantee, just like any other human being?

a reply to: windword

I think the only aspect where Yeshua's suffering on the cross was "greater" than anyone else was in this regard, when He became sin He was separated from the Father and that was the only time He was ever not in perfect communion with Him.

a reply to: NOTurTypical

when He became sin He was separated from the Father

According Christian doctrine, don't we all take on the cloak of sin, through original sin, upon our birth? Aren't we all separated from the father the moment we enter this earthly realm?

Did "God" need to have a fleshy human experience in order to feel enough empathy for our condition to forgive us for being his creation?

a reply to: NOTurTypical
It varies depending on where and when during the empire apparently

In reference to the early Roman Kingdom (as opposed to the Roman Republic or Empire), "the legion" means the entire Roman army. The subsequent organization of legions varied greatly over time but they were typically composed of around five thousand soldiers, divided into three lines of ten maniples during the republic, and later into ten cohorts during the early empire. Legions also included a small cavalry unit. By the third century, the legion was a much smaller unit of about 1,000 to 1,500 men, and there were more of them. In the fourth century, East Roman border guard legions (limitanei) may have become even smaller.

Roman Legion Wiki

a reply to: Butterfinger

According to tradition 6 000 pigs plunged into the cliffs below. Providing enough swine-leather to equip, and enough meat to feed-- a Roman legion.

a reply to: Butterfinger

Thank you, I had the wrong idea then.

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

The pigs were also there for the sacrifices to Zeus at the temple there. Jews didn't keep pigs, Yeshua allowing them to enter the pigs also destroyed their pagan sacrifices.

a reply to: NOTurTypical

Were you there?

originally posted by: Utnapisjtim
a reply to: NOTurTypical

Were you there?

Of course not, but Jews don't raise swine, they aren't Kosher. The temples to Zeus sacrificed pigs, several every day on an altar.

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

Its pretty well known based on the lack of pig remains in archaological sites of ancient jews, and also supported by contemerary sources on Jews and then Jews themselves to this day.

Kosher.

Hallal.

Same thing, no pigs please... Leave the bacon to the unbelievers

a reply to: Butterfinger
So; what is deal with the pigs? This was a mammal given to the human because it reproduced so quickly with large litters (every three months, three weeks three days) and gives up a litter of 8 to 12 piglets. All parts of the animal are edible. This was a gift; the pig eats anything just as a goat does. Why are goats not forbidden?

originally posted by: vethumanbeing
a reply to: Butterfinger
So; what is deal with the pigs? This was a mammal given to the human because it reproduced so quickly with large litters (every three months, three weeks three days) and gives up a litter of 8 to 12 piglets. All parts of the animal are edible. This was a gift; the pig eats anything just as a goat does. Why are goats not forbidden?

Pigs are unclean, goats are not. Unlike other mammals pigs do not sweat to remove toxins.

originally posted by: NOTurTypical
originally posted by: vethumanbeing
a reply to: Butterfinger

vhb: So; what is deal with the pigs? This was a mammal given to the human because it reproduced so quickly with large litters (every three months, three weeks three days) and gives up a litter of 8 to 12 piglets. All parts of the animal are edible. This was a gift; the pig eats anything just as a goat does. Why are goats not forbidden?

NOTL: Pigs are unclean, goats are not. Unlike other mammals pigs do not sweat to remove toxins.

Pigs were a gift; it is not the provider of such a gift to be blamed by HUMAN superstitious religious overlords just because the human is ignorant in the caring for or husbandry of such a perfect animal. How could/would primitive peoples know about invisable sweat glands residing within the skin producing moisture (it was all about the hoof shape); the Torah and Koran has a fear of the cloven (camel toe).

a reply to: vethumanbeing


Check out Leviticus 11 and Deuteronomy 14. They're unclean animals, no big deal. If you aren't Jewish and trying to earn your righteousness based on keeping 613 + 10 commandments, then eat pork.

originally posted by: NOTurTypical
a reply to: vethumanbeing
Check out Leviticus 11 and Deuteronomy 14. They're unclean animals, no big deal. If you aren't Jewish and trying to earn your righteousness based on keeping 613 + 10 commandments, then eat pork.

THAT'S blatant Biblical rabble rousing rhetorical rhetoric. I am not Jewish or one that acknowledges a dogmatic belief system. Not at all righteous. I don't discriminate between the beasts. Poultry is called 'foul/fowl' for a reason (dirty birds) hang out on cow manure dung hills.

a reply to: vethumanbeing


Okay, go eat pork like I said, no biggie.

a reply to: NOTurTypical

Are you saying that Hebrews didn't keep pigs? lol. They didn't eat pigs usually, since they are slightly hazardous to handle food-wise. Just like dogs they can contain trichinella, a parasite that can cross over to humans and are potentially deadly. However, for their leather and fertiliser alone they kept pigs. They would eat just about anything you'd toss over to it, so it served as a sort of compost-machine. What war-bred nation wouldn't keep pigs? Or were their soldiers clad in soft and soothing calf-skin armour? You'd soon understand that you'd have great challenges building a bronze age empire without pigs. Horses and donkeys aren't kosher either, are you saying they didn't keep any of these either? And humans. Humans aren't kosher for heaven's sake. We have toes and eat even what the pig doesn't want. Humans are the most unclean life-form on the planet.

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

Yes, the Hebrews didn't keep pigs. Not only were they unclean to eat, they were told they couldn't even touch them in Leviticus 11:8. That's what made the Prodigal Son story so shocking to the Jews. Goats will also eat the trash as well, and they are clean.

a reply to: NOTurTypical

I give up. Ignorance wins over sense, it's an ancient truth. Feel free to believe what you will. Whoever wrote the bible are also told them not to touch the Ark of covenant. They still made it, handled it and carried it around. Kept it in their most holy place.

originally posted by: Utnapisjtim
a reply to: NOTurTypical

I give up. Ignorance wins over sense, it's an ancient truth. Feel free to believe what you will. Whoever wrote the bible are also told them not to touch the Ark of covenant. They still made it, handled it and carried it around. Kept it in their most holy place.

So why are you mad exactly? What is it to you if the Jews raised pigs or not? Muslims today also don't touch them. Dude, relax. Jews didn't keep or raise pigs because of Leviticus 11:8 and Deuteronomy 14:8. Period. That shouldn't make you mad to learn this, what's it even matter to you?