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How exactly was Jesus' crucifixion a sacrifice?

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posted on Oct, 21 2015 @ 07:29 PM
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Crucifixion has been a part of ancient civilization for thousands of years (it even occurs to this day, at much lower numbers, sometimes willingly). Tens of thousands, if not 100's of thousands of people have been crucified, and it makes me wonder, just how is the story of Jesus a sacrifice in the first place?

The way Jesus eventually was killed isn't the main issue though. The biggest flaw in the story is that Jesus was sent to earth, from an eternal realm, which means his 30ish years on earth really weren't anything at all, and since he is god (or part of him or what have you, depending on your beliefs) he would have already known that he was going to be killed, and sent right back up to heaven.

Is this not an issue in the eyes of all Christians? 30 years out of infinite is very minuscule, and he would have suffered for a very, very short period of time, all along knowing that he'd be right back up in heaven. Where is the sacrifice in that?

To me, it would make a lot more sense Jesus went down to Earth, did his thing and spreed his message, and then eternally went to Hell afterwards. Would that not be an infinitely more powerful and moving sacrifice. Knowing that he would spend the rest of eternity in Hell, rather than knowing he'd be right back to super-perfect heaven?

Just something that was on my mind. Could someone please explain to me how his "sacrifice" was really a sacrifice?



+9 more 
posted on Oct, 21 2015 @ 07:41 PM
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a reply to: Ghost147

Hell afterwards. Would that not be an infinitely more powerful and moving sacrifice. Knowing that he would spend the rest of eternity in Hell, rather than knowing he'd be right back to super-perfect heaven?

You're confused...

His sacrifice needed to be rewarded...how else would tptb get people to play ball..?




posted on Oct, 21 2015 @ 07:43 PM
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a reply to: Ghost147

My view on this particular matter is this...

Jesus knew he would be killed if he came to this mess of a planet... but he came anyways because the people were lost when it came to knowledge of God.

it was his choice to come, and knew his own fate if he did so




posted on Oct, 21 2015 @ 07:46 PM
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a reply to: BestinShow

Perhaps by a more convincing show of gods power? Honestly, if god would just definitively show his self, even the most convinced atheists on this board would hop on over the the christian theology



posted on Oct, 21 2015 @ 07:48 PM
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originally posted by: Ghost147
Just something that was on my mind. Could someone please explain to me how his "sacrifice" was really a sacrifice?


maybe its not the Crucifixion that was symbolic of his'sacrifice', rather he let his physical self to be killed by humans as some sort of act of martyrdom?

As i wrote this i thought i had a better idea. but i dont. im not anything in terms of religion or non-religion, i dont identify with anything.

i mean the guy could walk on water, im sure he could have stopped his antagonists in their tracks (was it the romans?)


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posted on Oct, 21 2015 @ 07:48 PM
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a reply to: Akragon

The only thing is, he is immortal, so he didn't really die in the first place, and there was no threat what so ever that he may in fact go to hell (like there supposedly is for all of us). He already knew he was going right back to heaven, after what wouldn't even be considered a single nanosecond of his existence



posted on Oct, 21 2015 @ 07:50 PM
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originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: Ghost147

My view on this particular matter is this...

Jesus knew he would be killed if he came to this mess of a planet... but he came anyways because the people were lost when it came to knowledge of God.
it was his choice to come, and knew his own fate if he did so

Not sure he anticipated Paul's big "Felix the Cat" style bag of tricks. Last thing I think he would have wanted was to have an entire religion created/based upon his ceremonious murder (FORGET THE MESSAGE).
edit on 21-10-2015 by vethumanbeing because: (no reason given)


+7 more 
posted on Oct, 21 2015 @ 07:50 PM
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originally posted by: BestinShow
a reply to: Ghost147

Hell afterwards. Would that not be an infinitely more powerful and moving sacrifice. Knowing that he would spend the rest of eternity in Hell, rather than knowing he'd be right back to super-perfect heaven?

You're confused...

His sacrifice needed to be rewarded...how else would tptb get people to play ball..?



It's not a sacrifice if you get rewarded. That's called a trade.

So Jesus traded life as a mortal sheepherder and a humiliating goodbye party for an eternity as the king of kings.

...yeah, that's not a sacrifice

I'm on board with the "jesus in hell" scenario. Not that I approve of punishing innocent people, but that would be one hell (heh) of a sacrifice. A piece of God in the clutches of evil incarnate...that's how a good story should end. Better yet, he fuses with it and banishes himself to protect the universe because he can't destroy it without killing himself. Or maybe he chooses mutually assured destruction anyway?

But I digress.

edit on 21-10-2015 by TzarChasm because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 21 2015 @ 07:50 PM
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a reply to: Ghost147

Immortal or not...

the shear amount of pain he went though would be enough for anyone else to say "no way in hell im going down there...

He knew where he came from, and he knew where he was headed... In fact he even said that

By the way, Christians believe he actually went to hell after he died... based on one passage

silliness eh


edit on 21-10-2015 by Akragon because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 21 2015 @ 07:51 PM
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originally posted by: Ghost147
The only thing is, he is immortal, so he didn't really die in the first place, and there was no threat what so ever that he may in fact go to hell (like there supposedly is for all of us). He already knew he was going right back to heaven, after what wouldn't even be considered a single nanosecond of his existence


I saw a comedian do a similar stand up. His joke was if you knew you were going to get kicked in the nuts but could free everyone from sin and then the pain would go away what did you really sacrifice?



posted on Oct, 21 2015 @ 07:58 PM
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originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: Ghost147

Immortal or not...

the shear amount of pain he went though would be enough for anyone else to say "no way in hell im going down there...

He knew where he came from, and he knew where he was headed... In fact he even said that


But that is far from the most horrific way to die, and there were already 100's of thousands of others who had similar fates. If the case was simply "go through pain to show a sacrifice" then again, wouldn't hell be a much more convincing way to actually show that sacrifice?


originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: Ghost147
By the way, Christians believe he actually went to hell after he died... based on one passage


I'm afraid I am not aware of that passage, nor any Christians who believe that. Do you mind sourcing the passage? It sounds very interesting



posted on Oct, 21 2015 @ 07:59 PM
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Im not a religious man but i can see he sacrificed his physical body, but i do understand where you are coming from.


The biggest flaw in the story is that Jesus was sent to earth, from an eternal realm, which means his 30ish years on earth really weren't anything at all,

This is probably why he was able to withstand so much pain and torture knowing he is going to be back in the eternal realm, this alone to my understanding means whatever suffering you have had, if you lived a life of good you will be by his side.



posted on Oct, 21 2015 @ 08:02 PM
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It depends on how your interpreting the word sacrifice. ..
That is where you will find the answer to your question. .



posted on Oct, 21 2015 @ 08:04 PM
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a reply to: Akragon

Hi Ark,



the shear amount of pain he went though would be enough for anyone else to say "no way in hell im going down there...


Everybody that comes "down here" has to die. That's the deal. Besides that, some people suffer way more pain and agony and for a longer time than Jesus did. Jesus, apparently, lived a pretty charmed life, up until the last few days anyway.



posted on Oct, 21 2015 @ 08:08 PM
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a reply to: Ghost147


But that is far from the most horrific way to die, and there were already 100's of thousands of others who had similar fates. If the case was simply "go through pain to show a sacrifice" then again, wouldn't hell be a much more convincing way to actually show that sacrifice?


Except his purpose wasn't to show a sacrifice... it was to show the true God which was so much different then what they believed of God at the time. Only issue is they returned to said belief after he died...

Some people just don't listen... perhaps most?


I'm afraid I am not aware of that passage, nor any Christians who believe that. Do you mind sourcing the passage? It sounds very interesting


Matthew 12
Then certain of the scribes and of the Pharisees answered, saying, Master, we would see a sign from thee.

39 But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas:

40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.


The idea actually managed to get into the creeds of the Christian church




posted on Oct, 21 2015 @ 08:08 PM
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If Jesus is anything like me when people are inflicting pain on me, he giggled uncontrollably. They do say he was happy to do it, don't they?



edit on 10-21-2015 by WakeUpBeer because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 21 2015 @ 08:10 PM
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a reply to: windword

hows it going windy...


Everybody that comes "down here" has to die. That's the deal.


True... and in fact everyone that comes down here also returns from whence they came




posted on Oct, 21 2015 @ 08:11 PM
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originally posted by: TzarChasmoriginally posted by: BestinShow
a reply to: Ghost147

TzarChasm: It's not a sacrifice if you get rewarded. That's called a trade.
So Jesus traded life as a mortal sheepherder and a humiliating goodbye party for an eternity as the king of kings...yeah, that's not a sacrifice.

I wonder by his final statement "My wounds will be kept open by those that defame me" holds the clue.
edit on 21-10-2015 by vethumanbeing because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 21 2015 @ 08:13 PM
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a reply to: vethumanbeing

Sounds pretty melodramatic to be honest.



posted on Oct, 21 2015 @ 08:14 PM
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originally posted by: TzarChasm
a reply to: vethumanbeing

Sounds pretty melodramatic to be honest.

I didn't write the script and had nothing to do with production.
edit on 21-10-2015 by vethumanbeing because: (no reason given)



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