NEWS: California Teen Privacy Law Raises Questions

Originally posted by BaastetNoir
This is a ridiculous law... in my opinion as long as you are depending on parents to live you are not "independent"...the funny thing is ... they pass this law, but as soon as the teens get in trouble they blame the parents for not knowing what their kids are doing ???

with so many REAL problems to solve and so many crimes in need of more severe laws... the time and money is wasted on the "teen privacy"...they'll get privacy when they pay their own bills.
and that is THAT !

I am raising my hand and swaying back and forth with my eyes closed saying amen brother! Parents have a legal responsibility for their children, but lets further this concept and call it a legal liability for their children. Social Services can come in and take my kids for a spanking, but I don't have the legal right to know when they seek medical treatment? As far as being raped by your father, there are legal avenues for the children to take. But as a parent who doesn't rape my kids, your damned right I have the right to know when or if my Daughter gets an abortion or treated for a STD. Protecting rights to privacy is something I am pretty passionate about, however parenting is a totalatarianistic form of government and should be so. If I had told my dad he was violating my privacy when I was 16, he would have slapped some sense into me. I am sick of Legislators telling me how I, or anyone else has to raise my kids. They don't have to deal with the angry neighbor when a window gets broke, or pay the 900 number phone bills when your kid discovers phone sex. It's getting out hand and the prisons are filling up with people who's parents didn't bust that butt when they were out of line. When I go to the store and see other people's kids runing around like little animals, and I hear their mother saying, "Now Billy stop that, Billy put that down, Billy don't make me raise my voice at you, Billy if you sit down in the buggy mommy will buy you another candy bar..." I roll my eyes, look at my kids and tell them, "That is why I am strict with you guys."

Parents ABUSING their kids is in no way responsible parenting, and is already covered under the laws....if this happened, then the child has MANY avenues to seek both protection and medical attention.
Why wouldnt the child tell a teacher, another adult, the police?
again if fear is the reason then this shows the child doesnt have the nessisary judgment to determine their safety is in jeapordy....ANY authority figure, teacher, medical person, law enforcment that even suspected abuse of this nature is required to act in the childs behalf and notify authorities. Any other adult family member or friend that knew/suspected and did nothing COULD be accountable for child endangerment themselves
(not to mention a coward)
a parent abusing their child automatically negates their rights to parental control.

This is not the same thing as taking an hiv test, pregnancy or other such "self induced" things, including getting a tatoo, seeking non emergency and/or elective medical treatments.

the point being that the law was made for the case i mentioned above, and for the majority of cases if it gets to the point that your kid has stds and you dont know you have already failed as a parent already and are wasting time with this thread when you should be parenting.

look at how fine the line you are arguing is anyway.

example:

johhny goes out and gets sue pregnant. sue leaves school to get an abortion. if sue isnt going to tell her parents on her own free will and she has access to the abortion procedure she is going to get it in school or out of school anyway law or no law.

Originally posted by CazMedia
Parents ABUSING their kids is in no way responsible parenting, and is already covered under the laws....if this happened, then the child has MANY avenues to seek both protection and medical attention.
and statistics show us that the children take that avenue what percentage of the time?
Why wouldnt the child tell a teacher, another adult, the police?
doesent matter why - fact is a lot dont.
again if fear is the reason then this shows the child doesnt have the nessisary judgment to determine their safety is in jeapordy
so if my dad beats my ass but i am afraid to tell someone because i am afraid of more beatings i dont have the judgement to determine i am in jeapordy?
....ANY authority figure, teacher, medical person, law enforcment that even suspected abuse of this nature is required to act in the childs behalf and notify authorities. Any other adult family member or friend that knew/suspected and did nothing COULD be accountable for child endangerment themselves
(not to mention a coward)

a parent abusing their child automatically negates their rights to parental control.
this is totally wrong, there are many cases where the a parent raped/abused their child and was given the choice to waive parental rights in lui of prosecution... many other cases where it continued untill the victim was old enough to flee.

This is not the same thing as taking an hiv test, pregnancy or other such "self induced" things, including getting a tatoo, seeking non emergency and/or elective medical treatments.

The law exists, and it is the fault of the general populace. If you don't like it, then don't live there and support the issue.

On the other hand, if one is raising their children properly, communication being a key ingredient, then there is no issue anyway, is there?

Just my opinion, glad I don't live there, and glad that I have good relations with my children, even the one that left is still willing to tell me about life-important issues and ask for guidance once in awhile.

But, then, I consider myself lucky.

CazMedia, there are ALOT of circumstances which occur which make this law a good thing, surely you can't be so closed mind as to think a teenager is irresponsible if they do not feel they can goto their parents about a medical issue? Maturity has no age stamp, and vice versa; unfortunatly some parents are the immature ones it's a sad but very true fact of life.

As the parent of a 16-year-old girl and the person who is responsible for feeding/clothing/housing, not-to-mention, housekeeper, chauffeur, chef and bank AND financially responsible for any crimes/accidents she may be involved with, I double-dog DARE anyone to tell me my kid has more rights to her medical privacy than I do.

This is bullcrap, hogwash and I say, bring it on you knuckle-dragging Nazi governor (uh, that would be you Arnold)...try to tell me this is a just and viable law.

Until my CHILD turns 18, I'd better know who she hangs with, what she owns, what she does, who she talks to and where's she's breathing air.

Originally posted by grafxgal
This is bullcrap, hogwash and I say, bring it on you knuckle-dragging Nazi governor (uh, that would be you Arnold)...try to tell me this is a just and viable law.

Until my CHILD turns 18, I'd better know who she hangs with, what she owns, what she does, who she talks to and where's she's breathing air.

Glad you're not my mother but anyway, my mother's very responsible, and she totally agrees with this law, she's also a nurse and trained councillor and has a degree in psychology; my whole family has some qualification or other in working with youths and all agree that it's about time a law like this came through over there. It seems odd though, Arnie always seemed so right wing, with Bush, anti-abortion, if not new right almost.

Glad you're not my mother

but anyway, my mother's very responsible, and she totally agrees with this law, she's also a nurse and trained councillor and has a degree in psychology; my whole family has some qualification or other in working with youths and all agree that it's about time a law like this came through over there. It seems odd though, Arnie always seemed so right wing, with Bush, anti-abortion, if not new right almost.

if you are underage ...all i can say is ..lets see how great your mother thinks this law is when you show up dead, or even if you get in some trouble that she will be blamed for... I think if one of this days the Social Sevrices nocks on your door and takes you away from your home because you got yourself in trouble and your mother is considered UNFIT to rase you....maybe you wont like this law so much......

I just keep my fingers crossed that you will never get in some REAL problem.... maybe its better you guys can keep live in "Cool Senseless Liberal lets all live in Peace there is no evil in the world" fairy tale land.

As to Arnold.... THATS ANOTHER JOKE ! and he want to run for President... well ... the USA did have Clinton... so why not Arnold ???

[edit on 4-1-2005 by BaastetNoir]

i don't see what everyones real problem with this law is. its not the young people who voted it in, they can't vote. It is the parents who did, if you don't like it move out of california, or don't move here.

and really people just sit on one side or the other of this fine line, you could not convince me (or the majority of people in CA) that this is a bad law... while other, like caz, sit on the other side of the line

oh well, im glad i grew up with parents like i did

btw, im A) not dead B) std free C) never got a girl pregnant and D) have a great relationship with my parents (and did in middle school/highschool too) E) have never been addicted nor taken any illeagal drug and F) withheld a lot of things from my parents by the time i was in highschool.

my personal oppinion is if your kids have something that you deam unnecesary to be withheld from you, you have already failed as a parent and deserve not to be informed.

Somehow this reminds me off when the European powers held a conference and voted on future policy regarding Africa, without the consent of the Africans.

I wonder why?

Surf

Jprophet responds to my assertion that children have avenues to seek help if abused,

statistics show us that the children take that avenue what percentage of the time?

As were using non cited stats here, lets say they are accurate..and that they show this to be a low %...
THIS ONLY PROVES MY POINT MORE! IF stats say that children dont use the systems in place for dealing with abuse, then i must ask WHY?
the only 2 reasons i can logically determine would be 1)ignorance of them..just not knowing where/how
OR
2)not having the nessisary judgment to use these services for whatever reason, mostly because they have the mentality of CHILDREN!!!
Neither of these obvious reasons negate parental responsibillity or control of the child. (for parents not abusing their kids)

Saying the fact is that a lot of children dont utilize existing avenues to seek help to justify allowing them to HIDE THE FACT that they did try seeking help is insane....If they didnt use it to start with, then hiding this is helping how? Doesnt hiding it DENY the adults responsible that may be unaware the chance to provide the help that they are responsible to give?
there is NO logic in this argument.

Jprophet says,

so if my dad beats my but i am afraid to tell someone because i am afraid of more beatings i dont have the judgement to determine i am in jeapordy?

If you cant see this, then you need help already, before the beatings even start.....If you are being abused, and you dont seek help because your affraid of more abuse, then you are NOT showing the nessisary judgment to determine you are in danger and defend yourself..i dont care if you are a child or an adult on this...your judgment is seriously lacking.
Because the child in this case is not showing proper judgment is no reason to allow them to HIDE situations from the parents responsible for them. If the parent knew after he beat the child, that the child walked into the ER seeking treatment, and that the authorities KNEW how it occured...i think that parent would be crapping his pants...ASIDE from loosing custody of the child right then. HIDING the fact that the kid went to the ER puts no preassure on the adult to provide better care for the child, and only makes the state responsible. What if mom didnt know that dad was doing the abuse? She would take action to stop it, yet was denied that chance because it was HIDDEN from her....in favor of the government raising the kid? How stupid is this plan anyway?

Jprophet tries to prop up his weak position with this jewel,

there are many cases where the a parent raped/abused their child and was given the choice to waive parental rights in lui of prosecution... many other cases where it continued untill the victim was old enough to flee.

If child X is abused and the authorities step in...it is far cheaper and faster if the parent gives up contriol of the child, rather than fight it legally. Of course this is an option used...give us the child and you wont go to prison works because the kid gets total immediate help and the parent is no longer responsible...OR drag it thru the courts, costing big $$ that could have gone to provide help for the child, while potentially allowing the situatuion to continue before enough evidence is gathered for the state to win. EVIDENCE IS VERY NESSISARY in cases of alleged abuse...you do realize that the state checks out lots of calls alleging abuse
only to find it was untrue and possibly done by a vindictive child to stir trouble where there was none because the kid was being properly diciplined and just didnt like it. Or because someone else reported it to "get" the other divorced parent, or because their interpretation of things is different than the reality....Remopval of parental rights BEFORE anything is proven is preemptive, assumptive and stupid.

The state should not take children away from parents lightly....especially in light of the fact that most states child welfare agencies are already loosing kids in the cracks becaues they are over stretched and under budgeted.
As a journalist, ive covered stories where the state took kids from mom,,who was on crack, only to put them into foster care where those "responsible adults" end up STARVING the child!!!
While mom on crack COULD become a harmful situation for a child, starving the kid certantly IS harm. In florida kids in foster care have DIED because the state had no idea where the kids were and hadnt checked up on them in years....yeah the state is really a good solution...NOT!

Hold parents ACCOUNTABLE MORE not less!

if you are a parent, i feel sorry for your kids. if you arent a parent i feel happy for the fact that since you are a journalist you will probably not breed. you apparently cannot differentiate between fear poor judgement. you might as well come out and say kids that get abused are stupid.

i got arrested before for macing a kid who was beating his girlfriends ass right in front of me. they were both in high school. she told the police i maced her when they got there. She commited a felony to cover up for the guy that was treating her like billy banks tae bo bag. love makes you do stupid things, it does certainly not mean she didn't know better.

Jprophet blasts me,

if you are a parent, i feel sorry for your kids.

Why? Because i love them and care enough for them that I wouldnt abdicate my responsibillity to/for them to the state by being cut out of their lives thru censorship of information because some weak ass parenting by others or because my kid is too scared or not making correct judgments for themselves? Give me a break here...My kid will know that as mad/dissapointed in them as i might be, that they can come to me to tell me anything because ultimatly i will help them, hard or easy...id be there for them.

You got arrested because you took the law into your own hands, reguardless of if she lied or not. The cop would have charged you for macing a minor THAT WASNT YOURS...thats assault against a child period unless there was some kind of weapon being used against her, or if there was obvious marks from being beaten....meaning there was a threat to her life, not just some potential for harm.

Even if she would have corraborated your story you could have still been charged for assault as its not a citizens place to interfere in such a fashion unless there is a serious threat of death involved. While i might have also taken action because a male hitting a female is despicable, id be aware that doing more that yelling "hey you stop it, im taking a picture of you to show the cops" means that id be putting myself at risk on many levels physically and legally.