Superiority complexes in the world and on ats.

a reply to: deadlyhope

I'll be blunt I think religion is ridiculous, does that make my own mind better than everyone else? Absolutely not it's just that this personal decision no longer hinders me to find information in the wildest of places, It also allows me to up my mind to extreme possibilities while staying within the parameters of our reality. Religion, kind of the opposite. I also don't want science to completely abolish religions (even though in the long term I think it would be the best for humanity) as some people require spiritual fulfillment to help them through their lives. Similar to how a patient suffering from a tumor requires some medication to help their body fight it off.

Saying "no, Santa Claus isn't real and we need to avoid going back to the dark ages" is less reasonable. Do people understand that others could actually learn the things they wish they would if people were more kind, eloquent, and understanding? ( which I definitely assert I am not these at times) Instead sometimes people just fuel the fire. They don't attempt to connect on any intellectual base, because of their own bias that the other person "can't" be intellectual due to one thing they believe in.

Creationist aren't much better in that regard, they've hijacked the platform of science to legitimize their religion. Now the latter statement isn't inherently unethical, I think it's great that religious people are willingly testing their beliefs as objectively as possible. Sadly what is unethical is that many creation "scientists" tend to falsify data to fit their preconceptions. Anyone who points this out to them, is called out as you said;

They don't attempt to connect on any intellectual base, because of their own bias that the other person "can't" be intellectual due to one thing they believe in.

It works both ways, Yes I'll admit there a ton of aggressive anti-theists out there who are not willing to pander to any intellectual discussion, even on this site as someone probably already mentioned. As an anti-theist myself, I wouldn't think less of you if you still thought Santa clause existed, your just ignorant to information that's widely available in different mediums. I will think less of you, if you're willfully refusing to open your mind and learn some scientific theories that might totally shift your thinking. Unfortunately that makes up like 90% of all religious folks who are willfully ignorant of the other side of the coin.

originally posted by: deadlyhope
What is your goal within this thread, if I may ask?

Mostly, I like to hear myself talk. LOL! I like discussion. I like to run my mouth (or my fingers). LOL! And I like to get to know other members. I've been here for a long time and never knew you before the creation thread. So, it's nice to meet you.

One point I hoped to make is that my view that religion is the same as a belief in Santa Claus is NOT me being superior, and it's NOT to belittle anyone. It's simply my view. I believe strongly in the freedom of religion, of thought and of expression, even though I don't participate in religion.

I absolutely don't think you're "wrong" in anything you've said about how you feel. I really try to stay away from such value judgments. I may disagree with you, but that doesn't mean I think you're wrong. I'm an old hippie who holds the Constitution near and dear. I love people. I would love for us all to get along. But that's a little pie-in-the-sky, even for me.

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

Nice to meet you as well. It's nice to give myself a different tone to read your posts in, even if it doesn't reflect reality - often times I'm bound to read posts in the wrong tone, or more rude of a tone than they intend if I do not know anything about a person. Knowing you enjoy discussion and getting to know people has me reading your sentences in a nicer dialogue, which while it isn't important overall, is refreshing for me.

a reply to: deadlyhope

Non-believers are very obtuse, narrow minded, unobservant, ignorant, and many other words if they have come to a reason not to believe..

Hahahahaha. This thread is about superiority complexes, right??

Too funny, man. Well I think you're superior at comedy.

Me the 7th Earl of Monkey better then most?.
Absolutely .

a reply to: deadlyhope

I know what you mean about reading in a tone. But full disclosure people tell me I'm "harsh" and I am. I'm usually frank, straight-forward and sometimes I sting and bite. But it don't mean a thing.

Now, that quote in Lucid's post shows me that you're way more harsh than I am! And as a "non-believer" (in what you believe, anyway), I see you not only bite, but you're going for blood! You can certainly believe whatever you want about non-believers, but that don't make it true.

It is pretty funny, Luce, considering the subject of this thread...

a reply to: Lucid Lunacy

Nice misuse of a quote to try to paint a different picture. I said this

Non-believers are very obtuse, narrow minded, unobservant, ignorant, and many other words if they have come to a reason not to believe, or never came to believe in the first place, and they compare religion to Santa Claus in a literal way.

I only was talking about people with those attributes that believe religion is directly comparable to other things, as it's more deeply rooted in a lot of ways.

Not to mention I still don't feel myself superior to those people. I wasn't making the assumption that I'm a better person in society and the world because I have a very minor understanding of psychology and culture, and don't relate religious beliefs to other things because it's not at all the same.

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

Read my reply to that post, lucid cut the quote short to serve their own purpose.

Believing religion is directly comparable to fantasy is admitting lack of understanding of cultures, traditions, psychology, anthropology, etc. I won't say it makes a person better or worse, it definitely does make them less intelligent in those areas, though.

Not to mention some religious revere science, and simply believe God is a higher form of evolution, there's thousands of different beliefs, to discredit every single belief in one sentence comparing it to Santa Claus does show general ignorance on the topic in my opinion.

I'm ignorant myself in many aspects, I'll admit it.

a reply to: deadlyhope
How do you feel someone is obtuse, closed-minded, unobservant, and ignorant, and then not feel superior to them in that regard? Truly. You'd have to have some internalization about yourself to contrast them to in order to make such an assessment. Superiority is implicit to that.

I honestly don't see how I misused the quote, but whatevs.

Comparable to other things? Sure. Santa Claus? Sure. They are both stories wholly lacking in evidence to substantiate them as truths.

So with that you're welcome to think I'm obtuse, closed-minded, unobservant, and ignorant.

I mean it doesn't bother me. I think my position is superior too

a reply to: Lucid Lunacy

A position being superior is not a person being superior. Within this thread you'll find that I do not as much have a dislike for individual and specific forms of being better than someone else. Such is being human. Someone has a higher iq than me, someone can lift more weight than me , someone is more knowledgeable than me about religious topics I take part in.

I don't mind at all that you think your position is superior.

The people I'm talking about can hardly be found in this thread, or even many of mine. As my title presents, it's about what happens in the world. The Holy crusades, Hitler and his superiority/inferiority issues - such things still exist, and sometimes you get a glimpse on ats.

Some go along the lines of..


"I have searched the world far and wide and have found your religion to be false, and mine to be true, and to be any value to mankind, you need to follow what I do"

Some believe themselves to be worth something more to the world and to mankind because of one facet of themselves.

This is the what I'm against. I don't care if someone says they're smarter than me, have a better spiritual outlook than me, have more intelligence in an area. Not to mention, it's not about me.

I care when people choose to belittle others based on one thought they find superior.

You cut the quote short. " if they have come to a reason not to believe" does not depict what type of people I was pointing out.

originally posted by: deadlyhope
Non-believers are very obtuse, narrow minded, unobservant, ignorant, and many other words if they have come to a reason not to believe, or never came to believe in the first place, and they compare religion to Santa Claus in a literal way.

I do that. It's just my view. And I'm none of the things you attribute to these people. Most of us are not any of those things. Just FYI.

Not to mention I still don't feel myself superior to those people.

Do you see that you're saying people are acting in a superior way because of the things they say JUST LIKE your quote above? It could be considered a very mean and superior attitude you have there. I'm not saying you are, I'm just saying that most of the people you think are feeling superior, probably aren't. They're just having a discussion on a board, throwing their opinions out there and caution to the wind.

Chances of an actual superiority complex is probably less then zero on ATS, but the vast majority are just spouting our opinions, not to feel superior, but just to have some fun and interaction with other people... And you know... a superiority complex comes from insecurity anyway. So, if someone is acting all superior, it's probably because they feel inferior... Something to think about.

Believing religion is directly comparable to fantasy is admitting lack of understanding of cultures, traditions, psychology, anthropology, etc.

I totally understand anthropology, and am not less intelligent in any particular subject than someone who believes in God. Anthropology doesn't give any factual basis to the existence of a deity. Yes, the first cultures believed in the Sun God, Ra, and so on. That doesn't mean they were right or that Ra is an actual entity.

Some people (including me) compare a belief in God to a belief in a fantasy being. It's just my opinion. To me, it's the same as anything or entity we might imagine. But I know that TO YOU, it's different. You have a belief and honestly? I see how religion helps some people. I see how they use prayer, the bible, their faith and other religious materials to help them in their lives. I don't have a thing against that. I've been that way! I understand it.

a reply to: deadlyhope

A position being superior is not a person being superior.

No disagreement from me there. I only think in terms of specific belief(s). Not the totality of a person. Obviously it's entirely possible, and often the case, that one has superior knowledge in specific areas and not much in others.

You cut the quote short. " if they have come to a reason not to believe" does not depict what type of people I was pointing out.

Alright. Fine. So with the inclusion of the 'those that compare religion to fantasy' aspect all my thoughts still hold true. Even if you think it towards them specifically [in regards to these beliefs] , superiority is implicit to your position.

I think this thread has diverged a bit from superiority complex, which entails underlying feelings of inferiority. On the extreme end of this complex is megalomania. I've seen that on ATS, and I agree it's a cause for concern!

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

No, no I don't believe that someone that believes in God is more intellectual within a certain study, like culture.

I believe that to assume the mindset involved with believing a religion is the same mindset to believe in Santa, the Easter bunny, etc is lacking a more in depth look at religious beliefs. A person's religious beliefs is far more entailed that something so simple as the Easter bunny. And the psychology behind it is far more complex. You can't study a child and their imaginary friends, and apply that exact same study towards adults of all ages having religious beliefs - this isn't my opinion, this is factual - well, within the realms of psychology, which admittedly is not the most concrete form of science, but the point still stands.

The comparison is not a very intelligent one, as we are all humans, all bound to different emotions, etc.

a reply to: Lucid Lunacy

I can agree with that. Perhaps I have diverged a bit and am explaining an extreme end - unfortunately this extreme presents itself in the real world all the time, which is the main thing I have a problem with, and the main thing others may agree with.

Disliking smugness and minor bouts of superiority is an opinion of mine, but as Benevolent Heretic has pointed out, this is just my way of thinking and is no more valid than others, nor is there any reason I should be agreed with on minor issues.

a reply to: deadlyhope

I do not (agree).

Well, that is hardly surprising. You are a member of a culture that cherishes the myth of equality so as not to face the reality of massive inequality within it. Your society would crumble if it admitted the truth.

I grew up in a different kind of society, one in which authority was respected and everyone knew their place in it. Such a culture is not automatically unfair or exploitative, neither is it incompatible with democracy. Most people find such societies more secure and comfortable to inhabit than societies where competition is relentless and everyone has to prove themselves all the time. But no-one who has grown up indoctrinated in the American social paradigm can properly understand this.

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

a superiority complex comes from insecurity anyway.

Which is probably why it is actually called an inferiority complex. But a genuine consciousness of superiority is not a 'complex'.

a reply to: deadlyhope

How about if we compare religiously minded people to a completely healthy person who walks around on crutches because it's easier to walk on crutches instead of using their own legs?

a reply to: Woodcarver

It is? I'd say it's easier to drive a car.

What is your goal, if I may ask?

it doesn't seem productive debate is your goal.

You're not linking sources backing up anything you say, converting me to your own way of thinking is either not your goal, or you're terrible at it.

If you're a troll, please go back to your bridge.

If you want to engage intellectually, which I assure you I can do despite your mentality against the majority of the world, including people who are adept scientists... I'd enjoy that.

I'm open minded - I've changed my stances on many topics based on productive and collaborative debate and discussion. I'm not stuck in my ways, or unwilling to hear another side.

If you have a unique perspective and want to share pieces of who you genuinely are, I'd enjoy that.

If you want to spit out more comments about religious people being lesser people, without any real credited reason to back it up, I'll ask you please to let the discussion fall to people more interested in more altruistic exchanges.

Over the last year Yahoo and MSN have re-formatted a lot of their stories to NOT include "Comments". There was an untapped source of vocalization for malcontents and contrarians, and just plain argumentative Sob's. As their sources of 'Venting' disappeared to a large extent, the participants were forced to look for forums and public sites like ATS. I usually find the content descending into a bichfest or peeing contest, sometimes reaching a dozen or more pages. I'm sure someone with the time could verify the count of new arrivals to ATS in the last year, verses the last few previous years, searching for a platform that would allow their Rants. ATS is ever evolving...... drugs are fair game now, and just a few months back, they were regularily monitored and removed if content contained any mention of their use or descriptions of their effects.

That is the biggest upgrading of content I'v seen this year. And while it is a popular topic, I think we as a group 'ATS' were more inclined towards a bit more substantial topics and posts.

Religion ................ then all the loonies come out........ The atheists smug in their purpose, the religious smug in their belief of an express reward for them only. Condescending individuals both..... Literally two sides of the Same Sword....

Curious how they scream and decry separation of church and state, but find it completely fine to start loading the shelves with Christmas things in early or mid October.......

Religion...... now that will Really ....start division here, guaranteeeeee'd.

You still don't get it?

It's a valid question. You didn't like the comparison to santa, so i brought in another. You then deflect, and ignore the question, citing that i might be a troll. An emotional outburst instead of discussing the topic.

I don't need sources if i'm asking a question. Only when making a claim. But you are allowed to skirt any comments i "spit" out if you wish. If it helps you avoid painful revelations about your inferiority complex. See what i did there? Prob not.....

What do you need religion for? That can't be obtained other ways?

It seems like you feel belittled when people disagree with you.

a reply to: deadlyhope