The ‘cult’-like church whose members are accused of fatally beating a teen

originally posted by: Murgatroid

originally posted by: 123143
Catholics wiped out entire cultures. I think that a much more egregious offense.

You're right...

The Roman Catholic Church has to be the largest cult in the history of the world.

But what very few realize is that Catholicism and atheism both share the same source.

The same is true of Scientology, Jehovah's Witnesses, Christian Scientists, Mormons, etc.

Must we do the ignorance of atheism again?

Atheism doesn't do anything. It's a NOUN and has no belief, ideaology, book/bible, etc --- nothing.

It's a lack of belief in gods. That's it. Nothing more.

a reply to: ketsuko

Ma'am, I have been following this thread since it began.

These people killed their son.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: ketsuko

Ma'am, I have been following this thread since it began.

These people killed their son.

Did I somehow imply they hadn't?

a reply to: ngchunter

If you want to come after parents who homeschool then you really do court open civil war.

No, not "open civil war."

"Open civil discussion."

I'm not "coming after" anyone.
I'm advocating for the children.

originally posted by: ngchunter

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: ketsuko

They kept their members isolated from others and things like that.

Like home-schooling?

If you want to come after parents who homeschool then you really do court open civil war.

homeschoolersanonymous.org...

a reply to: ketsuko

Actually, they weren't homeschooling.

They certainly were't "public schooling." The place was like a prison.

According to their townsfolk

Deborah stayed home to school the kids, Humble and fellow neighbor James Constantine said.

According to the NYT

The Leonards were apparently longtime members of the church, part of what Lieutenant O’Neill called an immersive religious environment. “This was a way of life,” he said.

“Their church life, if you can call it that, was the center of their world.” Lucas and Christopher were home-schooled, said Ron Wheelock, the superintendent of the Sauquoit Valley Central School District.

Wiki Death of Lucas Leonard

Cult expert Rick Ross said "This is an old-school group...It’s typical in many ways. They’re very isolated, they've cocooned their members and homeschooled the children.

Sorry, did I miss something?

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

jim jone's groups were isolated, the waco church was isolated, some of the mormon groups are isolated....
but, that's a pretty big coccoon to have enveloped them where they were living at, probably spending much of their time at....they lived a few miles away from the church. the mother was friends with a neighbor, another neighbor relied on the kids to take care of his dog when he was on trips. if they were isolated it wasn't really because of pressure from the church really, because the farther away from it you got, the less pressure the church could invoke on them.
the kids might have been somewhat islolated, and not so much by choice, but if the mom and dad were, it was by choice.
although, if I were to guess, mom's choice was more to believe that God wanted her to surrender her will to her husband..
thus you have an anti-social husband....could he have been just as anti-social without the church? I got a feeling that there's a possibility that he could have been.
a not so anti-social wife who managed to retain friendship possibly despite of her anti-social husband...
and the kids, who well, it sounds like, that they just may have not have been so isolated that they accepted what was being presented to them as normal and wanting to get out of it.

more new news...

Prosecutors believe the counseling session was held because Lucas had expressed interest in leaving the church. In the court documents, District Attorney Scott McNamara says the church pastor, Tiffanie Irwin, then initiated a counseling session, where she accused Lucas and Christopher of several other things with the intent to infuriate the boys' parents and half sister.

When the victims' mother, Deborah Leonard, pleaded guilty last month, she shared with the court that the church believed Tiffanie Irwin was a prophet and could hear directly from God.

During the session, according to court documents, Irwin accused the Leonard boys of sexually abusing children within the church, fantasizing about engaging in sexual relations with the church pastor, practicing witchcraft, using voodoo dolls to cause harm, and planning to murder their parents, Bruce and Deborah Leonard. However, throughout the investigation, police and prosecutors have said no sexual abuse is evident and that Lucas and Christopher are victims in this case.

www.twcnews.com...

I think most of them have refused the plea deal.

a reply to: dawnstar

This is where religions get into the cult zone. When they believe their leader is in direct communication with God.

Catholics......I'm looking at you......

a reply to: IslandOfMisfitToys


but then if you consider the catholic church as a misled cult, which well it hasn't changed that much since it's beginning it's always had a head that it considered to have a direct link to god, well...
can it's children, the protestants, the methodists, ect not also be not so correct in their beliefs?

originally posted by: IslandOfMisfitToys
a reply to: dawnstar

This is where religions get into the cult zone. When they believe their leader is in direct communication with God.

Catholics......I'm looking at you......

It's not just Catholics. There is one religion that is governed by a body of men only, who have given themselves the name of the "Faithful and Discreet Slave" as mentioned in the Bible. That's right....they think they are the dispensers of all spiritual food and you are supposed to eat it up as if it were coming directly from God.

You cannot question them, doubt their leadership, criticize their conduct, much less oppose their "new light" as coming from God. If you do, you are labelled an 'apostate' and disfellowshipped from that organization. Once disfellowshipped, friends and family cannot talk to you, eat with you, or acknowledge you in any way.

I have seen families destroyed by this bunch. Some of the abandoned have committed suicide because coping with the ostracizing was too much for them. And the funny thing is, most of their members have no idea who these men are, much less what their names are. If you ask them, they would have to look it up on that organization's website!!

I won't name the organization, but I bet some of you posting on this thread know who they are.

The latest news for those who are interested... basically, the pastor's court date has been pushed back to Fed 22.

cnycentral.com...

a reply to: queenofswords
I've encountered Jehovah's Witnesses.
I think I recognise the terminology.

Where is the line between a religion and a cult? I'm not sure there is one.

So they were strong strict believers and followers of the Bible?
What a surprise.

Another reason i stopped being religious a few years ago.

two of the defendants have waived their rights to a jury trial. their trial will start this thursday..

www.twcnews.com...

originally posted by: dawnstar
two of the defendants have waived their rights to a jury trial. their trial will start this thursday..

www.twcnews.com...

Thanks for the update.

I was just thinking about this the other day.

a reply to: Annee

I've been checking for updates on it a few times a week.
I'm kind of curious about a few things... one of which is weather or not they claim they are protected because of religion. I know, it's way far out, but so is beating to death your congregation.

and I am curious as to weather my hunch that there was a power struggle in the church that triggered this.
hopefully more will come out as the trial progresses.

a reply to: ngchunter

But some of us are dangerous...

Yes some are, which is why they are being rooted out of decent society.
Guns or no.

K~

originally posted by: dawnstar
a reply to: Annee

I've been checking for updates on it a few times a week.
I'm kind of curious about a few things... one of which is weather or not they claim they are protected because of religion. I know, it's way far out, but so is beating to death your congregation.

and I am curious as to weather my hunch that there was a power struggle in the church that triggered this.
hopefully more will come out as the trial progresses.

Parents have been convicted for the death of children because of religion. So, I don't think so.

I think I read there was a power struggle in the church.

I'm curious how the surviving son is doing. Sure hope he's getting what he needs.