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originally posted by: MotherMayEye
a reply to: Gryphon66
Amazing. I replied to GetHyped, Pardon jumped in, and I am somehow needling Pardon by responding.
So. Uhm...ok.
originally posted by: MotherMayEye
a reply to: Gryphon66
Great. So you have jumped in to do what you are chastising me for doing.
I got your terrific point and can see you are totally in a position to make it.
originally posted by: Boadicea
a reply to: MotherMayEye
Half of me feels like I should jump in here, since it's my thread and I hate to see you (or anyone) ganged up on... but at the same time, you're handling this so well you don't need me! I'd say the stars you're getting tell the tale best. So I'll just say good job standing your ground.
Everyone's words will stand on their own merits in the end.... people will do their own due diligence and come to their own conclusions.
originally posted by: Boadicea
a reply to: MotherMayEye
Half of me feels like I should jump in here, since it's my thread and I hate to see you (or anyone) ganged up on... but at the same time, you're handling this so well you don't need me! I'd say the stars you're getting tell the tale best. So I'll just say good job standing your ground.
Everyone's words will stand on their own merits in the end.... people will do their own due diligence and come to their own conclusions.
The vaccines we use today have minimal risks and an extremely safe track record. They have undergone rigorous testing and scrutiny by the scientific community and have proven their effectiveness in large-scale clinical trials.
As a result, the days of school closures for measles and pertussis outbreaks have become a relic of the past. The side effects from vaccines are almost always mild. And even in the extremely rare case of a more serious allergic reaction, physicians and their staff are trained to deal with it.
Simply put, the benefits of vaccination substantially outweigh the risks.
Baltimore-area doctors made a public stand in favor of vaccines Monday, standing literally shoulder to shoulder to urge holdouts to get their kids vaccinated against measles.
"Ours is an unequivocal message. Vaccines are safe, they are effective, and they save lives every single day," Baltimore City Health Commissioner Dr. Leana Wen said as the group stood up in front of a seminar about measles at the Johns Hopkins University school of public health.
"The Disneyland outbreak raises the real risk that measles may come roaring back. We have come too far to let that happen," the group said in a statement.
The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention says 121 people have been reported infected with measles so far this year. One outbreak — the one linked to Disneyland — is responsible for 85 percent of the cases, CDC says.
originally posted by: MotherMayEye
a reply to: Pardon?
Seriously. I don't need you to reexplain your position. My point is that you won't reach anyone with ridicule and condescension.
Like anti-vaxxers, you don't have much use for common sense though.
originally posted by: MotherMayEye
a reply to: Gryphon66
Amazing. I replied to GetHyped, Pardon jumped in, and I am somehow needling Pardon by responding.
So. Uhm...ok.
originally posted by: Gryphon66
Ah, but you did "jump in there", didn't you?
And as your evidence and/or justification, you're counting stars. LOL.
You're okay with someone posting off-topic in your thread ... so long as they're on your side of the argument, eh?
What's your take on your OP now?
I'm curious. Do you still feel that you were just dropping another "perspective" into the discussion that you found during your research?
originally posted by: Pardon?
originally posted by: MotherMayEye
a reply to: Pardon?
Seriously. I don't need you to reexplain your position. My point is that you won't reach anyone with ridicule and condescension.
Like anti-vaxxers, you don't have much use for common sense though.
If people are genuinely looking for advice I'm happy to give it.
And I'll give it hopefully in a way that's easy to understand.
If people are posting fallacies and lies deliberately due to their belief system then I may appear like I'm making them look ridiculous.
What makes it look like I'm being condescending is when these posters ask questions or cite information in such a way to try to make them look like they know what they're talking about.
I show them that they don't.
Simple as.
originally posted by: Pardon?
originally posted by: MotherMayEye
a reply to: Gryphon66
Amazing. I replied to GetHyped, Pardon jumped in, and I am somehow needling Pardon by responding.
So. Uhm...ok.
You're not needling me at all.
I felt I need to explain what the "debate" is as I didn't think you'd got it.
But I've got a very long fuse.
I have to have on this site.
originally posted by: Boadicea
originally posted by: Gryphon66
Ah, but you did "jump in there", didn't you?
Yes and no...yes, I did jump in and give credit where credit is due, but no, I did not jump into your argument.
And as your evidence and/or justification, you're counting stars. LOL.
Nope, neither "evidence" nor "justification," just confirmation... and I didn't count either. Just couldn't help but notice a few bright green pointy spots right there by her moniker. And it made me smile.
You're okay with someone posting off-topic in your thread ... so long as they're on your side of the argument, eh?
Actually, given that my OP did express an issue with how the national dialogue is being framed and debated, I would say that her comments were in fact quite topical. And as far as being on my "side" of the argument, not totally. We agree that government mandated forced vaccination is unacceptable. Not to speak for her of course, but I believe I have more concerns about the adverse side effects of vaccines than she has expressed; however, I would also assume that we both understand all medical procedures have potential adverse affects. If we were to have an in-depth discussion, I'm sure we would find further areas of both agreement and disagreement. That's life.
But more important, I'm sure we could discuss it in a reasonable and friendly fashion, without insulting each other, or asking gotcha questions, or quibbling over semantics, and we could both respect each other's positions, knowing that neither of us have all the answers and we're both just doing our best to understand a complex situation with serious implications on both sides.
What's your take on your OP now?
The same as it was when I wrote it. There are many and varied reasons for questioning vaccinations, as exemplified by the many and varied doctors who have expressed concern with vaccinations for many and varied reasons. I don't know what the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth is. I am not anti-vax. The all-or-nothing dialogue is disturbing. Forced vaccination is unacceptable.
I'm curious. Do you still feel that you were just dropping another "perspective" into the discussion that you found during your research?
I have no doubt that I was dropping many and varied perspectives into a thread for information purposes and for discussion. Obviously. I seriously have no idea what other purpose you think I could have, but I would love to know because it would tell me much about where you're coming from and how your thought processes work...
originally posted by: MotherMayEye
originally posted by: Pardon?
originally posted by: MotherMayEye
a reply to: Pardon?
Seriously. I don't need you to reexplain your position. My point is that you won't reach anyone with ridicule and condescension.
Like anti-vaxxers, you don't have much use for common sense though.
If people are genuinely looking for advice I'm happy to give it.
And I'll give it hopefully in a way that's easy to understand.
If people are posting fallacies and lies deliberately due to their belief system then I may appear like I'm making them look ridiculous.
What makes it look like I'm being condescending is when these posters ask questions or cite information in such a way to try to make them look like they know what they're talking about.
I show them that they don't.
Simple as.
The only thing I really raised my eyebrow at -- with regard to you -- was the meme you posted and said was spot on:
I don't see how making fun of someone's opinion is going to help enlighten, educate, and bring them into the fold.
Sure, you can do that. I understand the scientific evidence is on your side. I just think it will cause people to tune out.