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Changing the Debate on Guns

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posted on Oct, 3 2015 @ 01:26 PM
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a reply to: neo96

Forgive me if I dont learn the times of these vermin.

But yes ok we was born in the UK. so what?

Being British does not make one immune for being a psychopath now does it?

It has nothing to do with the core of the OP and that is WHY these people do what they do.




posted on Oct, 3 2015 @ 01:29 PM
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originally posted by: crazyewok
a reply to: queenofswords

a reply to: Xtrozero


so your opinions ares there is no problem with mass shootings and to ignore the issue ?


What would you have done in the case of the TV reporter shooting? As far as anyone knows, he completely isolated himself, even from his family. So do you blame them for not knowing anything in that case?

Not every family is close. Heck, my husband rarely winds up speaking to his father and step-mother, but I speak to my parents several times a week. If my husband popped off, why should his parents be expected to have some idea it was coming? My parents, on the other hand, might be expected to have a better idea of my state of mind should I be heading for the deep end.



posted on Oct, 3 2015 @ 01:31 PM
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originally posted by: neo96


But the US CONSTITUTION isn't up for international debate.




What your going to do Drone strike us brits? Invade us?

Deal with it people will take about it and analyze it.
And the USA isnt the only place with free speech

The phrase deal with it comes to mind.

Anyway why should you care? We cant do anything to change it can we? So why care unless your that insecure.


And anyway this thread ISN'T EVEN ABOUT DEBATING YOUR CONSTITUTION! Its about discussing WHY these people do what they do!

Your the one who brought the debate about your constitution in as no one was even discussing it untl you showed up. Everyone else was actually debating the REAL topic and that was WHY.



posted on Oct, 3 2015 @ 01:31 PM
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a reply to: crazyewok

It might in the sense that if we are analyzing cultural influences as part of the issue. In this case, he spent part of his formative years in the UK under the influence of that culture.

In these cases, people are always quick to point at American culture as the culprit as though their own cultures don't stink, but for this shooter, he lived under the influence of both cultures. So if culture is the issue, at least in part, then your culture is at least partially to blame and at least part of the problem lies there.



posted on Oct, 3 2015 @ 01:34 PM
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originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: crazyewok
a reply to: queenofswords

a reply to: Xtrozero


so your opinions ares there is no problem with mass shootings and to ignore the issue ?


What would you have done in the case of the TV reporter shooting? As far as anyone knows, he completely isolated himself, even from his family. So do you blame them for not knowing anything in that case?

Not every family is close. Heck, my husband rarely winds up speaking to his father and step-mother, but I speak to my parents several times a week. If my husband popped off, why should his parents be expected to have some idea it was coming? My parents, on the other hand, might be expected to have a better idea of my state of mind should I be heading for the deep end.



I am going to take a guess your Husband is a adult over the age of 21. So I think his parents role in bringing him up is over.

As to what id do?

I have no idea.

Maybe its a problem without a solution?

Doesn't mean there isnt a problem and its not worth debating even if there is nothing to do.


edit on 3-10-2015 by crazyewok because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 3 2015 @ 01:34 PM
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originally posted by: crazyewok

so your opinions ares there is no problem with mass shootings and to ignore the issue ?


I guess you warned us with your post name, but you do come to some crazy conclusions. I think I stated it is an extremely hard thing to fix or prevent without going down the Thought Police route. We can do a lot of things to limit anything right? Lowering all speed limits to 25 would greatly reduce deaths in traffic accidents as example, so should we do that?

With about 14,000 murders per year from guns in a population of 330 million and 300 million guns what is the right thing to do? Is that an acceptable level of risk, just as 40k is an acceptable level in allowing people to drive 70 MPH?

In a prior post I put most of the blame on the person who didn't control their weapons. Mine are in a safe and my kids do not know the combo, though my kids are really good kids. Most of these incidences are people who were not even legally able to own a gun, so they got the guns from someone else. In the few cases where the person went out a bought them there really wasn't any triggers suggesting they should not be able to do that, so I do not know the answer to all this other than it is a horrid event that most likely we can not prevent with just about any course of action.


edit on 3-10-2015 by Xtrozero because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 3 2015 @ 01:35 PM
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a reply to: crazyewok

Well to be 'perfectly' clear.

I don't particularly like foreigners telling me what my rights should be.

It's not a drug problem.

It's not a mental health problem.

It's not a firearm problem.

The op should have clearly left that part out.

People are blaming things, and entire groups of people for the actions of A person that is ALREADY in violation of FEDERAL, STATE, and LOCAL laws that says ' Thou shall not kill'.

I absolutely REFUSE to give up any more rights for a crime I haven't committed.

And I will thank others to STOP trying to make me accountable for it.
edit on 3-10-2015 by neo96 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 3 2015 @ 01:36 PM
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a reply to: crazyewok




What your going to do Drone strike us brits? Invade us? Deal with it people will take about it and analyze it. And the USA isnt the only place with free speech


Nice vitriol.

What people need to DEAL WITH.

IS that AMERICANS have their constitutional rights.



posted on Oct, 3 2015 @ 01:36 PM
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a reply to: crazyewok




Its about discussing WHY these people do what they do!


Good luck with that unless you know how to bring the dead back to life.

Nobody will ever know why people snap like this so in my opinion it's a dead end road with no correct answer.



posted on Oct, 3 2015 @ 01:37 PM
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a reply to: crazyewok

There is a commonality there.

I can't pretend to know what the solutions are. How can we, when we can't identify the problem. The violence isn't the problem, it's the end result of the problem.

Societal? Illness? Environmental? Brainwashing? (doubtful). Just plain evil? (again, doubtful.)

All of these together, are, in my not so humble opinion, going to play a roll. Some will be more of a factor than others.

A person feels out of touch with society in general, who may develop a condition that is only made worse by misdiagnoses, and made worse by drugs, whether legal, or not.

No one factor is, again my opinion, going to be the main culprit. Many factors are in play.



posted on Oct, 3 2015 @ 01:37 PM
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originally posted by: Xtrozero


In a prior post I put most of the blame on the person who didn't control their weapons. Mine are in a safe and my kids do not know the combo, though my kids are really good kids. Most of these incidences are people who were not even legally able to own a gun, so they got the guns from someone else. In the few cases where the person went out a bought them there really wasn't any triggers suggesting they should not be able to do that, so I do not know the answer to all this other than it is a horrid event that most likely we can not prevent with just about any course of action.



~Maybe that's a idea?

Hold responsible who ever sold or allowed access to the firearms that allowed these kids to kick off?

Still only seems like a band aid though and doesn't address the why.



posted on Oct, 3 2015 @ 01:38 PM
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originally posted by: crazyewok
a reply to: neo96

Forgive me if I dont learn the times of these vermin.

But yes ok we was born in the UK. so what?

Being British does not make one immune for being a psychopath now does it?

It has nothing to do with the core of the OP and that is WHY these people do what they do.


Have you ever thought that Americans were just a more violent group of people, just as you Brits are a more violent than Japanese? What stops a person in England from performing mass murder, lack of guns?



posted on Oct, 3 2015 @ 01:39 PM
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These shooters usually target a location where there are going to be a lot of people clustered in a small area. Easy targeting, fish in a barrel. They also target a locale where a quick, armed response is unlikely. For example; schools, schools, schools, oh yeah, colleges, high schools, the occasional church, kindergartens, schools, universities, a couple military bases. Schools. Movie theaters.

In an armed society, one must be armed, period.

The US has tried the subtle route. Open carry is strongly discouraged and heavily stigmatized. Concealed carry is uncomfortable, inconvenient and often unclear in terms of legality.

Guns should be legal all the time, everywhere, without question. Cops all carry guns and they rarely have effective mass shootings at police stations. Shooting ranges almost never have mass shootings. More guns, displayed openly, means less victims.



posted on Oct, 3 2015 @ 01:40 PM
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a reply to: crazyewok

So you advocate the Underpants Gnome approach?

1. Kids are going on murderous rampage.

2. ?

3. Charge parents for it if they don't stop the kids.

You basically admit there is no way the parents can really be expected to know for sure, but you say the solution to it is to put them under the pressure of facing murder charges if they fail to correctly read their children's minds. There's no answer, but you're going to punish them for it anyhow.



posted on Oct, 3 2015 @ 01:41 PM
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originally posted by: neo96


Well to be 'perfectly' clear.

I don't particularly like foreigners telling me what my rights should be.

Well on a INTERNATIONAL forum you will just have to deal with it wont you?

You Americans , especially of the neocon variety like to preach to us what our rights should be so whats good for the goose is good for the gander.



originally posted by: neo96
It's not a drug problem.

It's not a mental health problem.

It's not a firearm problem.

The op should have clearly left that part out.

People are blaming things, and entire groups of people for the actions of A person that is ALREADY in violation of FEDERAL, STATE, and LOCAL laws that says ' Thou shall not kill'.

I absolutely REFUSE to give up any more rights for a crime I haven't committed.

And I will thank others to STOP trying to make me accountable for it.



No one in this thread is trying to make you accountable.

Again you missing the whole core of the conversation.


you and ONLY you here are making it about "gun rights" here and making it about brandishing all gun owners.
It smacks of paranoia from you now.



posted on Oct, 3 2015 @ 01:43 PM
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'nuff said....



posted on Oct, 3 2015 @ 01:43 PM
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a reply to: crazyewok




Hold responsible who ever sold or allowed access to the firearms that allowed these kids to kick off?


Sounds like your suggesting gun laws here, is it only ok to be off topic when it's your own posts?



posted on Oct, 3 2015 @ 01:44 PM
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originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: crazyewok

So you advocate the Underpants Gnome approach?

1. Kids are going on murderous rampage.

2. ?

3. Charge parents for it if they don't stop the kids.

You basically admit there is no way the parents can really be expected to know for sure, but you say the solution to it is to put them under the pressure of facing murder charges if they fail to correctly read their children's minds. There's no answer, but you're going to punish them for it anyhow.



No you know what it likely is a bad idea on the face of it.

Im just throwing ideas out.

Though maybe making those responsible for allowing access to fire arms illegally ? Charge them with the murders as accessories.



posted on Oct, 3 2015 @ 01:45 PM
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a reply to: crazyewok




You Americans , especially of the neocon variety like to preach to us what our rights should be so whats good for the goose is good for the gander.


Neocon eh.

Not the one telling you what rights you have now am i ?



posted on Oct, 3 2015 @ 01:45 PM
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originally posted by: jaws1975
a reply to: crazyewok




Hold responsible who ever sold or allowed access to the firearms that allowed these kids to kick off?


Sounds like your suggesting gun laws here, is it only ok to be off topic when it's your own posts?



Yes it's as common as him saying derp derp when he doesn't know anything.




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