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The American Psychiatric Association was Bullied into Removing Gayness from the DSM

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posted on Sep, 24 2015 @ 03:22 PM
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originally posted by: jheated5

originally posted by: Darth_Prime
a reply to: Domo1

I'm still waiting on your message


But to your point.. Gay Men and Woman can still reproduce, i know you know that, i also know that you are talking about Reproducing with the same-sex. Ok, but If there was a Gay Man and a Woman left alone on Earth, they could still reproduce


Well why not a gay man and a gay man??? I mean if there was a gay man and a gay woman and they were the last on earth and still reproduced, I guess that would make them then hetero in the end right?


Good luck with limiting human sexuality just to sex.
Oh and no. They still would be gay. You should google what homogenic and heterogenic means.




posted on Sep, 24 2015 @ 03:24 PM
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a reply to: jheated5

No, Because your Sexuality and a "Sex Act" are different.

All anyone sees with Gays is Sex, and Sex and Sex... no one mentions Relationships, or Companionship or anything that Straight People do



posted on Sep, 24 2015 @ 03:33 PM
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a reply to: Darth_Prime




I'm still waiting on your message


Aw crap, which one again? I could have sworn I sent that if it's the one I think, I'll shoot you a message in a bit and perhaps you can remind me.




But to your point.. Gay Men and Woman can still reproduce, i know you know that, i also know that you are talking about Reproducing with the same-sex. Ok, but If there was a Gay Man and a Woman left alone on Earth, they could still reproduce


True, but they would think it's icky.

I don't really think reproduction methods matter all that much honestly (not entirely sure what point I was getting at there), I just don't think saying homosexuality is normal is correct, as it is by definition not normal. That's absolutely fine, it's not normal for someone to have green eyes either.

I think the OP is taking this discussion an ugly way, but from my brief reading it does seem like homosexuality was removed from the DSM due to politics more than anything else. Now that being said, I don't think that homosexuality is a mental disorder. I agree with the outcome, but not necessarily the means.



posted on Sep, 24 2015 @ 03:41 PM
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a reply to: Domo1

To put it overly simplified:

If you put 20 lesbians and 20 homosexuals on an island, I fear the species wouldn't survive. This, to me, seems to be an indication that it's counter-evolutionary and thus not according to the norms of nature, and thus, not "normal". I know a lot of people find that offensive, but it is what it is... I'm not considered "normal" for reasons other than my sexual preference, the only reason I can see to find that offensive would be because people stigmatise me, not because I'm different per definition...

The word "normal" simply loses all meaning if we consider everyone to be normal... Of course we're all normal!! But some people ARE fundamentally different
edit on 24-9-2015 by HalfLeaf because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 24 2015 @ 03:46 PM
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Well then it's a good thing I don't value the word "normal" or think the DSM is remotely objective.

I think a case can be made if you believe psychiatry is some sort of hard science, but critical thought clearly shows it's far from it right now.



posted on Sep, 24 2015 @ 04:02 PM
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originally posted by: pl3bscheese
Well then it's a good thing I don't value the word "normal" or think the DSM is remotely objective.

I think a case can be made if you believe psychiatry is some sort of hard science, but critical thought clearly shows it's far from it right now.


So when it's a proven fact the homosexual brain is different, just like the ADD brain is different (scans show this), that's not hard science?

Edit: Never mind, everyone involved admits it's an emotional topic. Emotions cloud judgement. I don't feel like having this debate for the x-th time.
edit on 24-9-2015 by HalfLeaf because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 24 2015 @ 04:11 PM
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originally posted by: HalfLeaf

So when it's a proven fact the homosexual brain is different, just like the ADD brain is different (scans show this), that's not hard science?


Everyone's brain is different. Sorry to burst your bubble.


People with ADD are as normal as homosexuals, they DO however differ from other normal people.


See how meaningless the term is. Your sentence clearly shows this. Normal is inherently about emotions, not logic.


So "normal" is a meaningless term anyway if you think it applies to everything and everyone.


I think it's used to stigmatize people, and not much more.


I don't think it should, there's a "norm", the norm to me seems to be people who have survived up to this point in time, those who could survive and reproduce and lead to mankind as we know it.


Well then you've already contradicted yourself, as ADD would be "normal".


Advances in technology etc have allowed "non normal" people to thrive just as well, which is a great thing, but it's a bit absurd imo to pretend there's no such thing as "normal".


What's absurd is thinking that a norm has ever or could ever be quantified. Clearly advances in technology show that the species is continuously evolving, and that stimuli influences structure, which influences function. Babies of today are wiring differently than even two decades ago.



posted on Sep, 24 2015 @ 04:12 PM
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a reply to: Pinke

Well, i think people have defined normal as "Straight" because that is the Majority, we can't deny that. but i was Born Normal because i was Born this way... if that makes sense

Some people use 'Abnormal" as just another way to degrade GLBTQ+ people, or as a way to Justify discrimination.. and i'm not saying Domo is doing that, we have had this discussion before.

but it's very raw way to look at things, Straight is normal because it is, what if Gay is normal and there is just a bigger amount of Abnormal Straight people?



posted on Sep, 24 2015 @ 04:14 PM
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a reply to: Domo1

I'm not saying anyone would enjoy it, but it can be done... and it has been done, there have been many People who have "Played it straight" because they thought they had too, or to survive Etc. but they are Still GLBTQ+



posted on Sep, 24 2015 @ 04:15 PM
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a reply to: HalfLeaf

That is false though, if you put 20 Gay Men and 20 Gay Woman on an island, they could Reproduce



posted on Sep, 24 2015 @ 04:18 PM
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a reply to: Darth_Prime

It's also short-sighted. An individual does not a species make. We are social creatures of many people playing different parts to strengthen each other as a whole.



posted on Sep, 24 2015 @ 04:19 PM
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a reply to: Darth_Prime




Some people use 'Abnormal" as just another way to degrade GLBTQ+ people, or as a way to Justify discrimination.. and i'm not saying Domo is doing that, we have had this discussion before.


Certainly not trying to degrade, thanks for saying that.



posted on Sep, 24 2015 @ 04:25 PM
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a reply to: Domo1

I know, we had a similar discussion before so i knew that wasn't your intention. but some people do have those intentions, just like saying it's a "Mental Disorder"



posted on Sep, 24 2015 @ 04:28 PM
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originally posted by: Metallicus
Gayness is a sexual deviant behavior by definition as it 'differs from the norm', but I don't think science has determined the cause one way or the other. My guess is it is a genetic disorder and not a mental one.


Liking Metallica and Heavy metal in general is considered a devious behavior and differs from the Norm as well, but I think you'd agree that those people have no business saying what's right or wrong. (Tipper Gore had quite a following at one time) Yes?



posted on Sep, 24 2015 @ 04:50 PM
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a reply to: Darth_Prime

Sure, they could. What if it's an experiment where none of them knew that's how to properly reproduce? Would they?

Put 20 straight men and women on an island and it doesn't matter if they knew that's the "proper" way to make babies, they'd do it instinctively. That's my point. Evolutionary speaking, the gay population wouldn't have reproduced even though they COULD, the straight one would.

And for the love of god, I'm very pro GLBT, but don't turn it into a religion which refuses to look at simple facts.



posted on Sep, 24 2015 @ 05:36 PM
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a reply to: HalfLeaf

If no one knew how to "Properly Reproduce" than Straight people would be having Sex for Fun and not reproduction which goes against the argument in the first place that Sex is only for "Reproduction" and that is why Gay is not Normal



posted on Sep, 24 2015 @ 05:45 PM
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a reply to: Darth_Prime

Sexual urges (including the fun feeling) are part of the biological process, males are attracted to female features precisely so species would reproduce

But you know what? Whatever, you're allowed your opinion, it's just... it goes against science, you refuse to acknowledge the homosexual brain is wired differently, and that's fine, but it's an undeniable fact that if the human species in it's "normal" state were wired that way, we would have been extinct by now.



posted on Sep, 24 2015 @ 06:13 PM
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a reply to: Anonymous007

Gay is the new black. There is indeed a mental disorder afoot Watson.



posted on Sep, 24 2015 @ 06:23 PM
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a reply to: Anonymous007

Why all the preamble?
You could have just said "God hates fags".
That's what you really mean, right?



posted on Sep, 24 2015 @ 06:24 PM
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originally posted by: Anonymous007
a reply to: seeker1963

I don't really care what people do behind closed doors.

But I do care about what falsehoods are forced down the throats of others -- especially how children are indoctrinated into accepting a behavior as "right" and "normal".



What you don't seem to understand is that a disorder is basically whatever the editors/contributors of the DSM say it is. They publish their definition. Here's how disorder is defined in DSM-4 for example:

"A mental disorder is a clinically significant behavioral or psychological syndrome or pattern that occurs in an individual and that is associated with present distress or disability or with a significantly increased risk of suffering death, pain, disability, or an important loss of freedom."

Without bigotry there would be none of the "distress or disability or with a significantly increased risk of suffering death, pain, disability, or an important loss of freedom" since homosexuality/bisexuality don't inherently cause any of those things. That's why it's not considered a disorder. As to why you consider it a disorder; I don't know but perhaps you should ask yourself why you're so threatened by what other people are doing with their lives?

edit on 2015-9-24 by theantediluvian because: (no reason given)



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