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does your religion belong in the United States of Americas Government?

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posted on Sep, 22 2015 @ 05:31 PM
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a reply to: BuzzyWigs

From the founding documents of this nation it is obvious of the intent to keep "God" and get rid of the "Church".

Taxpayer dollars have been used to pay chaplains of the House and Senate since the spring of 1789, when the first of 106 different ordained Christian ministers were elected to those jobs.

swampland.time.com...


The Senate has elected a Chaplain since 1789 to serve as pastor, deliver opening prayers and presiding at funerals and memorial services for departed members.


Both the House and the Senate follow the same practice and employ a Chaplain who typically performs that duty, typically assisted by religious officials from outside Congress who come to deliver an opening prayer as guests on a regular basis.

The tradition to open the Continental Congress with prayers started before there was a Declaration of Independence, Constitution or Bill of Rights.




"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness..."

Our Founding Fathers separated church from state, but they wisely did not separate God from state; they acknowledged God as the source of our rights, and, in fact, they were careful to place Biblical morality directly into our founding documents and laws, and into our values and culture precisely to help prevent a future of totalitarian or tyrannical rule in America.

The combination of keeping Judeo-Christian religious morality in the state, as opposed to the church it's self; and, additionally, setting up our laws based on reason and common sense has contributed to the American Character, and to what is known as "American Exceptionalism."

Our Founding Fathers were religious in a new way, the Judeo-Christian way, and they were the liberals of their day by deducing that our political and human rights come from a power higher than human government; but they were conservative to Biblical morality.

There was and still is a connection between God and Liberty; He is the author of it. It is ironic that American Conservatives are now the champion of this our most liberal founding principle; and also an irony that most American Conservatives are wholly unaware of their connection with the liberal founding ideas of this great republic.

It is also an irony that many American Liberals have turned a blind eye to the required connection between God and Liberty. As Thomas Jefferson and John Adams noted, as you will see below, Liberty cannot survive among men without its Divine connection.

Thomas Jefferson and the great majority of our Founding Fathers explicitly put God into the national life of the United States, by putting the Creator into the Declaration of Independence. It is important that American Liberty has something to do with God; that is something for students to know and discuss, even if they are not particularly religious. This does not represent some form of tyranny of the religious majority or an injustice; it was in fact the wisdom of our Founding Fathers to stand in opposition to tyranny and injustice by acknowledging the source of our rights -- those rights originating from God rather than from King George III, or for that matter from the Soviet or Chinese Politburo, or a courthouse, or a legislature.

"God who gave us life gave us liberty. Can the liberties of a nation be secure when we have removed a conviction that these liberties are the gift of God?" He also wrote: "Almighty God hath created the mind free. ... All attempts to influence it by temporal punishments or burthens...are a departure from the plan of the Holy Author of our religion...
Thomas Jefferson

"I have sworn upon the altar of God eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man."
Thomas Jefferson

"It is the duty of all nations to acknowledge the providence of Almighty God ...."
George Washington



www.americanthinker.com...

"We have no government armed with power capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and religion. Avarice, ambition, revenge, or gallantry would break the strongest cords of our Constitution as a whale goes through a net. Our Constitution was made for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other."

John Adams

"In regard to this great book, I have but to say, it is the best gift God has given to men. All the good Savior gave to the world was communicated through this book. But for it we could not know right from wrong."

Abraham Lincoln



But back to the point. To try to portray that God (minus the Catholic Church) and the Judeo-Christian values of the people and leaders were not the primary influence on this nation is pure insanity, you can see it for yourself all throughout our history and traditions.




posted on Sep, 22 2015 @ 05:32 PM
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Ideology, whether it is political or religious has its extremes. A religious extremist is just as bad as a political extremist.



posted on Sep, 22 2015 @ 05:35 PM
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a reply to: ketsuko


Just because a person of faith advances a policy doesn't mean it is automatically a religious policy.

Trump, or Paul. Those are your choices on the right-wing side, then.

Everyone else IS pushing a religious police policy (especially everyone else in your race-horse stable).
So - do you go for the oligarch? China china!!!

Or, do you go for the guy who wants to abolish government entirely? Capitalism all the way!!

Or - do you rethink your choices.?? ....

up to you. You have plenty of brain-power and access to the internet. Just.....think. Please.

Democratic Socialism is NOT Communism.



edit on 9/22/2015 by BuzzyWigs because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 22 2015 @ 05:35 PM
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originally posted by: DBCowboy
Ideology, whether it is political or religious has its extremes. A religious extremist is just as bad as a political extremist.


I guess that was my point.

As those who bash those who have a religious belief for imposing it on others, I find those are also the same who find it perfectly AOK to demand that others believe as they do politically.

Not much of a difference in my eyes.



posted on Sep, 22 2015 @ 05:37 PM
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a reply to: DBCowboy

Unfortunately though, a lot of the time the two overlap. We are seeing this a lot these days, a person's religion interfering with their policies and political ideologies having a foundation in religious ones.

This is why I think religion is largely a political tool. Some will vote for someone solely based on their religious views, because their policies are based on their religion. The current GOP is a great example of religion interfering with politics.



posted on Sep, 22 2015 @ 05:38 PM
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a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Think what you like.

I know how you think when it comes to this. If I ran for office and made a law that said murder was illegal and gave my rationale as being based on the Commandment, you would be all for murder because how dare I shove my religion down your throat.



posted on Sep, 22 2015 @ 05:39 PM
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a reply to: ketsuko

If I ran for office and made a law that said murder was illegal and gave my rationale as being based on the Commandment, you would be all for murder because how dare I shove my religion down your throat.


What?


Nope! Wrong. I'm against the 'death penalty' of living, breathing human beings.


So - we fail at communication again. As per usual. Thanks for playing. Perhaps you're thinking of "war" and drone bombings as "not murder"??? I have no idea. Again. So, we're done.

Have a great evening.
edit on 9/22/2015 by BuzzyWigs because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 22 2015 @ 05:39 PM
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originally posted by: seeker1963

originally posted by: DBCowboy
Ideology, whether it is political or religious has its extremes. A religious extremist is just as bad as a political extremist.


I guess that was my point.

As those who bash those who have a religious belief for imposing it on others, I find those are also the same who find it perfectly AOK to demand that others believe as they do politically.

Not much of a difference in my eyes.


Yeah. Just look at the election and the followers. According to some, Sanders is the new pope, to others, Trump is. Just as crazy as someone pushing a new religious leader as far as I'm concerned.



posted on Sep, 22 2015 @ 05:41 PM
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originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
a reply to: DBCowboy

Unfortunately though, a lot of the time the two overlap. We are seeing this a lot these days, a person's religion interfering with their policies and political ideologies having a foundation in religious ones.

This is why I think religion is largely a political tool. Some will vote for someone solely based on their religious views, because their policies are based on their religion. The current GOP is a great example of religion interfering with politics.


Your missing the obvious, those on the left act just as religious due to their political beliefs. Of course it's easy to see the hypocrisy of the Right, because Religion is one of the things they pretend to hold dear. Now I am not saying Democrats are not religious, because I know many who are, but it are those on the left who are just as zealous of their political beliefs, that run just as much of a parallel in comparison to the religious zealots on the right?

Hope that makes sense.....



posted on Sep, 22 2015 @ 05:42 PM
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a reply to: infolurker

Again, Article 11 of the Treaty of Tripoli:



The government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion. 


Written by John Adams.

And another by Thomas Jefferson, the guy who wrote the Declaration of Independence:



Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined and imprisoned; yet we have not advanced one inch towards uniformity.


Is obvious that the U.S. want founded as a Christian nation when looking at the facts.
edit on 9/22/2015 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 22 2015 @ 05:43 PM
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originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
a reply to: DBCowboy

Unfortunately though, a lot of the time the two overlap. We are seeing this a lot these days, a person's religion interfering with their policies and political ideologies having a foundation in religious ones.

This is why I think religion is largely a political tool. Some will vote for someone solely based on their religious views, because their policies are based on their religion. The current GOP is a great example of religion interfering with politics.


The GOP is using religion (abusing) to get votes and followers. Same with the "Church of Sanders" or the "Temple of Clinton". They all do it and their followers are no different than hellfire and brimstone Baptists preaching damnation to the masses.
Rational thought tends to leave the building when you enter a church or a townhall meeting.



posted on Sep, 22 2015 @ 05:48 PM
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a reply to: seeker1963

Kim Davis is a Democrat, so the religious zealots cross party lines for sure, it's just more noticeable on the GOP side.



posted on Sep, 22 2015 @ 05:50 PM
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originally posted by: DBCowboy
The GOP is using religion (abusing) to get votes and followers. Same with the "Church of Sanders" or the "Temple of Clinton".


Can you elaborate on how Bernie Sanders is using religion to get votes?



Sanders is the presidential contender most willing to dissociate himself from religion. Though he identifies as Jewish and by Jewish law is Jewish, he has freely acknowledged that he is not a religious person.


Unabashedly Irreligious



posted on Sep, 22 2015 @ 05:51 PM
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a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Yes, we did. My point went right over your head.



posted on Sep, 22 2015 @ 05:53 PM
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a reply to: ketsuko

Nope, your point did not. Or, you didn't make yourself clear. It's on you to clarify your position.

Tell me about your stance on Sanders, then.
Your other options are Trump or Paul.


edit on 9/22/2015 by BuzzyWigs because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 22 2015 @ 05:53 PM
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originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: DBCowboy
The GOP is using religion (abusing) to get votes and followers. Same with the "Church of Sanders" or the "Temple of Clinton".


Can you elaborate on how Bernie Sanders is using religion to get votes?



Sanders is the presidential contender most willing to dissociate himself from religion. Though he identifies as Jewish and by Jewish law is Jewish, he has freely acknowledged that he is not a religious person.


Unabashedly Irreligious


The zealous fervor with which his supporters are in his corner. It's not religion in a recognized sense, but in an emotional sense. Obama commanded the same with all the fainting legions and the media cult of personality with their propensity to have photos with halos and the like and the subtle and not so subtle religious posing in his day.



posted on Sep, 22 2015 @ 05:54 PM
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originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: ketsuko

Nope, it did not.

Tell me about your stance on Sanders, then.
Your other options are Trump or Paul.



Yes, it did, and to talk about my opinions on those candidates would be off topic here. This is not a discussion about who is thinking about voting for whom.



posted on Sep, 22 2015 @ 05:55 PM
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originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
a reply to: seeker1963

Kim Davis is a Democrat, so the religious zealots cross party lines for sure, it's just more noticeable on the GOP side.


Without Religion? What does the GOP have left?

Why do you think the GOP all of a sudden is all for "immigration reform"? Same reason the Democrats are, yet because it is for a fresh voter base, they can't accomplish anything more that the current stalemate our worthless Congress has been gridlocked with along with every other issue that is slowing decaying our Republic. Our government has become narcissistic children who are opposite polarities that can never compromise because of what they have become. Why? We have aligned ourselves with their division!



posted on Sep, 22 2015 @ 05:56 PM
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originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: DBCowboy
The GOP is using religion (abusing) to get votes and followers. Same with the "Church of Sanders" or the "Temple of Clinton".


Can you elaborate on how Bernie Sanders is using religion to get votes?



Sanders is the presidential contender most willing to dissociate himself from religion. Though he identifies as Jewish and by Jewish law is Jewish, he has freely acknowledged that he is not a religious person.


Unabashedly Irreligious


Sanders isn't using religion, but the same irrational following is happening. Sanders may be smart, but to some, he is "Jesus". Sanders isn't using Christianity or any other religion, but with any political figure, they develop a "religious-like" status.



posted on Sep, 22 2015 @ 05:58 PM
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a reply to: ketsuko

This is not a discussion about who is thinking about voting for whom.

It isn't? Why on God's Green Earth would it NOT be, when these heated arguments are ALL ABOUT the religious stances of the people running for GOP?????

I asked you - Trump or Paul? Or any of them (on the GOP debate circuit right now).....

Or - none of the above?
Have you LOOKED at Sander's policies?

Have you compared them to your Jesus-based tenets?



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