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The WWII-Era Plane Giving the F-35 a Run for Its Money

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posted on Sep, 18 2015 @ 02:36 PM
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a reply to: Zaphod58

It's a shame that there isn't a small fleet of OV-10 type craft available for some of the current insurgency issues worldwide. Those airframes always looked like they'd be punishingly simple to build, and new ones with up-to-date avionics and PT-6's wouldn't cost you much more than $15-20m a pop.

I'm honestly surprised at this point that someone hasn't decided to pull a blackwater and build their own low-cost COIN platform in order to provide services to smaller countries, contractors, etc.




posted on Sep, 18 2015 @ 02:37 PM
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a reply to: yuppa

A PT-6-engined stuka just went on my "things to build if I ever become a multimillionaire" list...



posted on Sep, 18 2015 @ 02:52 PM
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reading the article it makes an interesting point.

They pointed out that many jets didn't have a long loiter time.

The insurgents would just hide when the jets came. And then come back out when they left.

but this thing can hang for a few hours. insurgents just can't wait that out.

it's an interesting point to make for having planes like these.



posted on Sep, 18 2015 @ 02:54 PM
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a reply to: grey580

That's where heavy bombers and loitering munitions come into play.



posted on Sep, 18 2015 @ 02:57 PM
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originally posted by: Barnalby
a reply to: Zaphod58

It's a shame that there isn't a small fleet of OV-10 type craft available for some of the current insurgency issues worldwide. Those airframes always looked like they'd be punishingly simple to build, and new ones with up-to-date avionics and PT-6's wouldn't cost you much more than $15-20m a pop.

I'm honestly surprised at this point that someone hasn't decided to pull a blackwater and build their own low-cost COIN platform in order to provide services to smaller countries, contractors, etc.


An apache helicopter with a couple of marines armed with Gatling guns and rocket launchers strapped in on each side.
(I believe the British did that once in order to get a platoon into a battlefield as fast as possible).



posted on Sep, 18 2015 @ 02:58 PM
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a reply to: stormcell

They've pulled guys out that way too. It's a good emergency evacuation method for ground pounders.

Personally I like the upgunned A-10.


edit on 9/18/2015 by Zaphod58 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 18 2015 @ 02:59 PM
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originally posted by: Barnalby
a reply to: Zaphod58

It's a shame that there isn't a small fleet of OV-10 type craft available for some of the current insurgency issues worldwide. Those airframes always looked like they'd be punishingly simple to build, and new ones with up-to-date avionics and PT-6's wouldn't cost you much more than $15-20m a pop.

I'm honestly surprised at this point that someone hasn't decided to pull a blackwater and build their own low-cost COIN platform in order to provide services to smaller countries, contractors, etc.


That was explored in a ANime called AREA 88. MErcenary pilots from all around th eworld sign contracts of service and get paid for each kill,downside is they have to buy their own ammo and fuel.



posted on Sep, 18 2015 @ 03:03 PM
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a reply to: yuppa

Don't laugh they did that with 3 or4 Me262s...
I'd like to hear that siren.



posted on Sep, 18 2015 @ 03:11 PM
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a reply to: Zaphod58

Argument never changes, I remember very similar issues prior to F-16 production.

AF wanted bigger heavier do it all platforms and I recall F-16 was hard sell at the time.



posted on Sep, 18 2015 @ 03:11 PM
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a reply to: Zaphod58

well they pointed out that bombers that are flying high up can't see who's friendly on the ground.

And that even with beacons there was a friendly fire incident.

I know there's pros and cons to everything.



posted on Sep, 18 2015 @ 03:14 PM
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a reply to: Phoenix

And they don't need a COIN platform that is only useful in a low threat environment, and would last minutes in a peer war. It has nothing to do with bigger and better, and everything to do with value. When you're fighting for every dime in a budget you don't spend money on a platform you MIGHT use.



posted on Sep, 18 2015 @ 03:15 PM
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a reply to: grey580

That's always a risk. During Desert Storm there was a Blue on Blue by an Apache that spent time looking at the vehicles through the gun camera before firing on them. Closer doesn't mean less risk.



posted on Sep, 18 2015 @ 03:29 PM
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a reply to: grey580

How would it give the f-35 a run for its money? Low tech vs high tech. Prop vs jet. I just don't see it happening.



posted on Sep, 18 2015 @ 03:30 PM
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originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: Phoenix

And they don't need a COIN platform that is only useful in a low threat environment, and would last minutes in a peer war. It has nothing to do with bigger and better, and everything to do with value. When you're fighting for every dime in a budget you don't spend money on a platform you MIGHT use.


Yup let the AF at Russians or Chinese if it comes to that, not sure the 35 but build more 22's

The COIN role should go back the Army.



posted on Sep, 18 2015 @ 03:30 PM
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a reply to: grey580

That was a very nice article. Having been on the ground before, I can tell you that the sound of an A10 overhead is a conforting thing.



posted on Sep, 18 2015 @ 03:34 PM
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a reply to: Phoenix

The cost of restarting the F-22 line at this point would be extremely prohibitive, as nice as more of them would be. Instead we're apparently keeping F-15s flying until 2040.



posted on Sep, 18 2015 @ 03:44 PM
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originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: Phoenix

The cost of restarting the F-22 line at this point would be extremely prohibitive, as nice as more of them would be. Instead we're apparently keeping F-15s falling randomly out of the sky until 2040.


Corrected it for you

edit on 18-9-2015 by Barnalby because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 18 2015 @ 03:46 PM
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a reply to: Barnalby

They're looking at spending an obscene amount of money to replace longerons, wings, and vertical fins on them as necessary.



posted on Sep, 18 2015 @ 04:05 PM
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a reply to: Zaphod58

And that's somehow supposed to be (effectively)cheaper and make more sense than simply upgrading what's left of the F-22 tooling to build some sort of new-build F-22 with upgraded avionics (and maybe ADVENT engines)? (Think something along the lines of the F-15E/SE compared to the F-15A, or the late-tranche Typhoons compared to the early ones, or the SU-35 compared to the Su-27, etc, etc, etc).

Are they at least thinking of upgrading them to the F-15SE standard during the refurbishments?

God, the USAF is a mess right now (at least the white world side of it)
edit on 18-9-2015 by Barnalby because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 18 2015 @ 04:09 PM
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a reply to: Barnalby

They haven't said much beyond replacing those parts on specific aircraft. This is in addition to a significant radar upgrade, and possibly going with the latest Boeing upgrade that activates the 1 and 9 stations and new rails on the inboard stations to double the missile load to 16.



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