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NEWS: NY Times calls U.S. aid for tsunami 'miserly'

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posted on Dec, 31 2004 @ 09:09 AM
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Look, I hate Bush as much as the next guy....

However, on this, they and others are way off the mark.

First of all, the $35 million was an INITIAL amount. This was a purely monetary donation, and in addition to the millions being sent in the form of supplies, military cargo and search planes, helicopters, ships, etc.

Second, an additional $20 million in pure monetary donation was pledged as well, just the other day, as the assessments keep coming in.

Third, this isn't even taking into account the PRIVATE donations from private citizens and companies in the US, many of which dwarf that of entire nations! Hell, one company at least, has already pledged more cash than the ENTIRE EU!

Bash Bush all you want, he needs it....but quit calling my country cheap! We even help our enemy in time of need, even though they refuse it....so this is NOT a road to go down...

*steps off his soapbox*




posted on Dec, 31 2004 @ 09:11 AM
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Why don't you fess up that US governments contribution is indeed miserly. Even the UK public has given more towards the relief. Now it seems like US is going to be forced into increasing it's aid to save it's face.

[edit on 31-12-2004 by Indigo_Child]



posted on Dec, 31 2004 @ 09:11 AM
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Originally posted by RANT
Don't we have some angry Republicans about?


130,000 plus die somewhere else...(about the same amount of civilians Bush has killed in Iraq so far)

Bush offers about...

The cost of his Second Inaugural Party: $30 Million Dollars plus.

Or ten 30 second SuperBowl ads: 3 million dollars each.

Whatever. I'm not one to expect anything from Bush, but the feigned indignation from those shocked the UN or others criticise Bush's stand on the concept of humanity is a tad much.


Coming from the very people that expect the government to pay for every whim and desire - this is no surprise

Another irony, these are also the same people that rally round the cry "no more deficit spending!"

Yup the same people that cried "relief is to slow" for hurricane victims then when the government kicked into high gear with that relief they cried "its all about the election"

Then they are the first to attempt to tie private expenditures for long planned events such as the inaugural and corporate advertising during the superbowl.

The GALL shown is disingenious in attempts at politicizing aid to tsunami ravaged countries.

The US is hands down the most generous nation that has ever existed yet has to endure unwarranted criticism such as this.

RANT you want to politicize? look up the lowest point in US funding of UN aid to developing countries - the answer might shed light on the hypocracy of these charges.



posted on Dec, 31 2004 @ 09:14 AM
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Peace Flyers fan.



Originally posted by FlyersFan
Okay ... I'm interested. Please explain more.
(I was a psychology major)



Glad to see that you're interested.

I'll start by pointing you in two directions(well, two aspects of the same direction rather).


The first is the psychology of Gnosis; a synthesis of the things I mentioned in my last post.

www.gnosis-usa.com...

An excerpt:


Psychology
from Greek psyche (pskhe) meaning "soul," and Logos, the "principle governing the cosmos," the Word, God. True psychology is "the knowledge of the relationship of the soul with God." Esoteric Psychology is the highest and most potent level of that knowledge, which is "private" and "interior" and is entered into in levels, according to the internal, initiatic process of the seeker.


"What is the source of all misery? Deluded perception... based on ignorance of our true nature...

Since the very heart of ignorance is the innate grasping at an "I," anyone who wishes to attain full liberation from all forms of suffering should strive to abandon this subtle, inborn ego-grasping..."

- Tsong Khapa, the First Dalai Lama




The second would be a specific branch of knowledge that is a huge part of the foundation of Gnosis; Shetaut Neter and Metu Neter:





The Tree of Life is the foundation of all religion which is reflected in Man.




Edited to add - How is donating tens of millions of dollars officially,
and hundreds of millions (a billion is expected) unofficially to be
considered 'out of tune' and 'devilish and backwards'?


I'm talking about getting to the root of it all.

The Devil(ego) tries to resolve things by starting from the tips of each little branch and working his way to the root.

The Original Man(Original Mind) goes straight to the source of things and then goes from there.


I mean, it's good that something is being done to help; but the problem is that 1) The Billions of dollars being spent on the false "War on Terror" that people support, could be going toward things like truly helping people; and 2) the deficit was not meant to be payed back from the very beginning, so the Zionist Powers That Be(known to some as "The Black Lodge") are throwing as much money around as they can because they know this; and they also know that the whole system has to collapse eventually because of it, so they are trying to pull as many souls as they can into darkness before it does.

There are sincere honest people involved, but the higher-ups are helping only because they basically have to, and nothing more.


If the latter statements seem shocking to you, then disregard them as only being my opinion for now. I'd rather you look into what I see as true psychology, and then see if my opinion could coincide with that or not.




Peace






[edit on 31-12-2004 by Tamahu]



posted on Dec, 31 2004 @ 09:23 AM
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Originally posted by Phoenix
RANT you want to politicize?


No, I don't actually.
See next post previous page.

I'm frustrated both sides have politicized it. I've been running into people so "angry" about the world's criticisim of US aid, they want to pull ALL FOREIGN AID and a host of other ugly ideas.

The politicization of this tragic event is not a one way street by a long sthot.

I'm not even saying we should do more. There's no way to do enough ever to compensate for the loss of life. But to those saying we've done enough, or too much, or pin this modest gesture as some medal on Bush's collar... honestly, they're far worse than Bush's critics.



posted on Dec, 31 2004 @ 09:32 AM
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RANT,

One thing I totally agree with you on - if I'm reading your words right - is that true philanthropy - whether at the individual level or at the government level - expects nothing in return



posted on Dec, 31 2004 @ 09:37 AM
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Originally posted by Phoenix
The US is hands down the most generous nation that has ever existed yet has to endure unwarranted criticism such as this.

RANT you want to politicize? look up the lowest point in US funding of UN aid to developing countries - the answer might shed light on the hypocracy of these charges.



First of all "the people" of the US is the most generous people of the world when it comes to financially outpour. But also other countries are been generous too between their means.

Our president is to self centered to understand that people needs the help immediately, by the time the administrations help starts arriving after the bureaucratic bs and the news media show, already other countries has moblilized their help.

That makes US kind of slow on response.

And by the way the inaugural ball for our king is outrageous, compared to our own need in our country and the deficit building up, and now he is even cutting on the defense, but how come he can not cut back on his inaguration extravaganza.



posted on Dec, 31 2004 @ 09:40 AM
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marg MARG MARG MARG

for the upteenth time - the inaugural celebrations are completely funded by private donations. They do not come out of the federal funds. They do not affect any entitlement programs. They do not affect the military budget. They don't affect anybody's wallet except the people who donated.



posted on Dec, 31 2004 @ 09:40 AM
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marg,

What exactly are you basing the slow responce on? The US already has more planes in the disaster area as well as rescue gear and the like. Just because Bush did not express sympathy in the first hours does not mean the relief was not on its way? Also, how is it that Bush gets the blame? The Red Cross is an independant organization No? Why not the critisim directed at them? Or the UN? Or the EU?



posted on Dec, 31 2004 @ 09:44 AM
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Originally posted by RANT

I'm not even saying we should do more. There's no way to do enough ever to compensate for the loss of life. But to those saying we've done enough, or too much, or pin this modest gesture as some medal on Bush's collar... honestly, they're far worse than Bush's critics.


Well I'm one who believes we (world) should do as much as possible to help these people regardless whether its government or private donations.

The carping about aid amounts first came from the UN, European nations and the left in this country as a means to make political hay, the response's you take issue with are a reaction to that initial allegation.

Yes RANT there are those that for very good reason dispise the UN at this point in time - I believe those are whom you are refering to when saying "pull aid" in a way when it comes to the UN "skim" I can't say that sentiment is wrong.

I think the US's more direct aid response is the reason for UN carping in this matter - gee they will not get due credit nor grubby hands on aid money - so sorry. Actually I believe more aid will get directly to those in need by independent action based on UN history of mis-management.

I have yet to see evidence of anyone "pinning a medal on Bush" as you alledge.

Police your own camp first by criticism of the original allegators and you won't hear a response such as you are noting.

Cause and effect - RANT.



posted on Dec, 31 2004 @ 09:50 AM
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Actually if the money comes from the private donations then the geneours private organizations that donated the money for Mr. Bushes extravaganza inagural ball, should be generous enough to help with the needy in our own country. Right? NO.

By the way he will be wearing a cowboy hat for the inaguration ball.

And yes US did got its present known in Asia with a place for a base, but help did not came with it at the time.



posted on Dec, 31 2004 @ 09:54 AM
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These numbers have changed by now, but since we are being called stingy lets do this.

In 2003 the population of the US was 291 million, of course this includes children and immigrants but does not include those not counted in the census so the numbers will be off.

www.carryingcapacity.org...

Lets each send 10 dollars to a relief fund. That way the total US private donation, would be..............

291 million times 10 = two billion nine hundred ten million

of course getting everyone in the States to cooperate would be hard...but it's a thought............



[edit on 31-12-2004 by NetStorm]



posted on Dec, 31 2004 @ 09:59 AM
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the point is NetStorm that it is unesseary to do so. We as taxpayers are paying for alot of the relief indirectly, and alot of us are giving to private cahrites that will further help out the people most effected by this disaster. The indirect costs to the US taxpayer will in all likelyhood (If you could tally it up) exceede 1 billion+ maybe even 2. But its not a dollar figure you can bat around as if we were doing the MDA telethon.



posted on Dec, 31 2004 @ 10:09 AM
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I want to make a point no one wishes to address. Correct me if I'm wrong but did not the government of the most devistated country refuse humanitarian assistance from Israel? This disaster has shown the true compassion of the Christian communities and the uncaring nature of the Muslim religion.
I am not a Jew but after this slap in the face I as a christian would not render any assistance to a nation that harbors such resentment. Name me one instance where the Muslims of the world have given assistance to others of not there own faith.

[edit on 31-12-2004 by flycatch]



posted on Dec, 31 2004 @ 10:12 AM
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Originally posted by FredT
the point is NetStorm that it is unesseary to do so. We as taxpayers are paying for alot of the relief indirectly, and alot of us are giving to private cahrites that will further help out the people most effected by this disaster. The indirect costs to the US taxpayer will in all likelyhood (If you could tally it up) exceede 1 billion+ maybe even 2. But its not a dollar figure you can bat around as if we were doing the MDA telethon.


So since you have already paid for it..you will not miss it.
Send 10 dollars



posted on Dec, 31 2004 @ 10:18 AM
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Originally posted by NetStorm
So since you have already paid for it..you will not miss it.
Send 10 dollars


Actually I have alread given to a few disaster relief org. and was on a short list for our Childrens Hospital responce team. However they decided that only a few MD's would go, no nurses.



posted on Dec, 31 2004 @ 10:20 AM
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Originally posted by FredT

Originally posted by NetStorm
So since you have already paid for it..you will not miss it.
Send 10 dollars


Actually I have alread given to a few disaster relief org. and was on a short list for our Childrens Hospital responce team. However they decided that only a few MD's would go, no nurses.


Cool
my SO is a NICU nurse, and is talking to a couple of other nurses at her hospital, about the possibilty of going. I applaud you



posted on Dec, 31 2004 @ 10:23 AM
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Originally posted by NetStorm
Cool
my SO is a NICU nurse, and is talking to a couple of other nurses at her hospital, about the possibilty of going. I applaud you


We wont be going as they just wanted MD's. lots of Nurses plus a few MD's would make for a more effective package. NICU skill would be highly needed. Im a 10 PICU / CVICU / Lifeflight/CCT Nurse so i would have been able to make a difference but no dice. Unless you can link with a professional group, you would be hard pressed to do much overthere on your own.




posted on Dec, 31 2004 @ 10:25 AM
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BANDA ACEH, Indonesia - Two U.S. Navy battle groups loaded with supplies headed for tsunami-ravaged coasts Friday and an airlift of dozens of flights brought help to this wrecked Indonesian city, as a huge world relief drive to shelter, treat and feed millions of survivors kicked in. The death toll passed 121,000 and was still climbing.
US Navy Aid



posted on Dec, 31 2004 @ 11:55 AM
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Well maybe someone listens out there after all

"The United States will increase its aid from $35 million to $350 million for tsunami victims, CNN has learned"

more to come

www.cnn.com...



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