Alien Misrepresentation

a reply to: JadeStar

I have no intention of revealing my identity here on ATS. I value my privacy, and my name isn't nearly so common.

And wow, a book signed by Stanton Friedman.

originally posted by: Scdfa
a reply to: JadeStar

I have no intention of revealing my identity here on ATS. I value my privacy, and my name isn't nearly so common.

And wow, a book signed by Stanton Friedman.

He sent those books to me after he challenged me to take him up on his offer. We've talked back and forth by email about various issues and he liked my ATS posts specifically the ones on the Barney and Betty Hill star map and my "Origin of the Species" posts here in this forum.

He also helped me procure some copies of things from the University of New Hampshire's Hill collection for my research for said ATS post(s).

Fine. I'm done with you. You told me to go first implying that you would. You've now proven your character as was alluded to here...

originally posted by: Ectoplasm8
a reply to: Scdfa
I'll give you one thing Scdfa, you're consistently... inconsistent.

Instead of deflecting the questions and feigning confusion, why don't you answer them? You don't want to become the forum clown who never can substantiate anything he says, do you?

Congrats.

originally posted by: JadeStar

originally posted by: Scdfa
a reply to: JadeStar

Pics or it didn't happen. Sorry.

You're sorry, alright. Whatever happened to the Jade who used to at least pretend her serial denying was based on science?

She's still here wondering why someone who meets aliens and sees UFOS all the time has not one photo to show for it. No phone? No camera? In 2015? Seriously?

You sure abandoned the scientific method!

Asking for evidence of a claim IS the scientific method. Or have you forgot that?

Is that what they said to Schroedinger? Pics or it didn't happen?

You're the one who claimed to see aliens and UFOs in the MACRO world. This has nothing to do with Schroedinger or QM/QP.

That avatar isn't you. So pics or you didn't happen.

Lol, of course it is. Now you're just desparate.

Lots of credible people have seen UFO's, An FAA friend of mine has seen several, one landed on the runway. Lots of evidence has been tested and found not to be from this solar system,

And last, who cares if you know about it? Will it help anyone if you know?

The people demanding proof are not even looking for proof themselves, so if someone does all the looking for them, how can they hope to learn about the issue?

Those that have seen things like a real saucer shaped craft land on an airport runway include a Chief ATC officer of the FAA, whom I knew personally, but he passed away at the age of 89. He was a Captain in the Air force, This won't prove anything to you, but it does to me, but I didn't need it after seeing things myself long before.

If things like this are something you and others feel are not real, then why waste time ridiculing those who know they are real?
Those who don't think they are real, don't even look for truth anyways, they just point out how crazy they think others are to make up for their own personal bias. Is that helping you, me, or anyone? It only helps those who have a fear of what they don't want to understand by implanting their head deeper into rocky ground. Not even an ostrich will let danger rule them to that degree.
I know a lot of former skeptics, who were mentally ruined after they witnessed a domed circular craft that maneuvered in ways that no currently known man made craft can operate. After they saw it for themselves, some had mental breakdowns, because they "knew" these things couldn't be real.

Is that what you and others are afraid might happen? If you really think they aren't real, you shouldn't be participating in UFO threads with such a disdain for those that understand what they have seen. It is dangerous ground you walk on, and I hope you don't ever see these things, because I can already see the mental crippling happening in the aftermath, and that is very ugly to see happen to people. I have seen it unbalance skeptics who thought they created the concept of balance with great pride I might add.. The fall is a real long one, and when they hit bottom, leaves a big crater in their noggin.

The same goes for others here who make such light of the subject. I hope you don't get the proof you seek, because with the attitudes you have, it will turn you into a
"Here's your Thorazine again" person.. And just forget about human decency or feelings, those were vacated gone long ago. That doesn't leave much to look forward to in the next life does it?

Maybe it is all a test to see how people treat people. With harm, or with compassion? You have to be your own judge.

originally posted by: Scdfa
a reply to: JadeStar
So you are pressuring me to reveal my personal information on this website? Is that sort of thing allowed here?

No, it is not. If you cannot post within the terms and services of ATS, you should not be posting here.

I quote the terms and conditions:

15e. "ii) You will not Post, use the chat feature, use videos, or use the private message system to collect or ask for the personal information (data mining) about forum members, including email addresses and "real life" names, in any manner whatsoever, or for any reason whatsoever.

Funny how that rule didn't seem to matter when you asked her to Identify herself.

originally posted by: Scdfa
a reply to: JadeStar
If you're asking me to reveal my identity in this chatroom, I'll ask you to please go first.

I can't say I'm surprised, though. Diversion tactics and double standards are par for the course when you're asked for something, anything, to back up or support the wild, baseless claims you make.

a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

Is that what you and others are afraid might happen? If you really think they aren't real, you shouldn't be participating in UFO threads with such a disdain for those that understand what they have seen. It is dangerous ground you walk on, and I hope you don't ever see these things, because I can already see the mental crippling happening in the aftermath, and that is very ugly to see happen to people. I have seen it unbalance skeptics who thought they created the concept of balance with great pride I might add.. The fall is a real long one, and when they hit bottom, leaves a big crater in their noggin.

Well said, great post. However, I have a lot less sympathy.

How seriously can we take some of these people?
"I refuse to accept the evidence. Now convince me!"

originally posted by: Scdfa
a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

Is that what you and others are afraid might happen? If you really think they aren't real, you shouldn't be participating in UFO threads with such a disdain for those that understand what they have seen. It is dangerous ground you walk on, and I hope you don't ever see these things, because I can already see the mental crippling happening in the aftermath, and that is very ugly to see happen to people. I have seen it unbalance skeptics who thought they created the concept of balance with great pride I might add.. The fall is a real long one, and when they hit bottom, leaves a big crater in their noggin.

Well said, great post. However, I have a lot less sympathy.

How seriously can we take some of these people?
"I refuse to accept the evidence. Now convince me!"

So where is your evidence?

You make a lot of claims, so let's see some evidence.

originally posted by: Scdfa
a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

Is that what you and others are afraid might happen? If you really think they aren't real, you shouldn't be participating in UFO threads with such a disdain for those that understand what they have seen. It is dangerous ground you walk on, and I hope you don't ever see these things, because I can already see the mental crippling happening in the aftermath, and that is very ugly to see happen to people. I have seen it unbalance skeptics who thought they created the concept of balance with great pride I might add.. The fall is a real long one, and when they hit bottom, leaves a big crater in their noggin.

Well said, great post. However, I have a lot less sympathy.

How seriously can we take some of these people?
"I refuse to accept the evidence. Now convince me!"

What part of discuss the topic not each other hasn't sunk in?

Reminder: If one makes claims of an extraordinary nature they can and should be asked for evidence. I just got clarification that asking for such does NOT violate the ATS T+C.

Asking for a link to a UFO report that an ATS member alleged made to CBS which CBS thought was very convincing is fair game (as it was presumably news and in the public domain) and I should not be demonized for doing so.

Those who make wild claims without being able to back them up should.

The problem with this subject is that when someone can't back up their story they play the victim and take any inquiry as a personal attack. It's not. But if you have no pictures, no video, no alien hardware all we have is your story therefore all we can examine is its veracity.

What I see a lot of are people saying they don't want the stories examined. Hmm, I wonder why that might be….

a reply to: AdmireTheDistance

Funny how that rule didn't seem to matter when you asked her to Identify herself.

I did no such thing. I made the point that revealing personal information on the internet is a very stupid thing to do.

Funny how the two of you were unable to comprehend that...

originally posted by: cuckooold

originally posted by: Scdfa
a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

Is that what you and others are afraid might happen? If you really think they aren't real, you shouldn't be participating in UFO threads with such a disdain for those that understand what they have seen. It is dangerous ground you walk on, and I hope you don't ever see these things, because I can already see the mental crippling happening in the aftermath, and that is very ugly to see happen to people. I have seen it unbalance skeptics who thought they created the concept of balance with great pride I might add.. The fall is a real long one, and when they hit bottom, leaves a big crater in their noggin.

Well said, great post. However, I have a lot less sympathy.

How seriously can we take some of these people?
"I refuse to accept the evidence. Now convince me!"

So where is your evidence?

You make a lot of claims, so let's see some evidence.

I said the evidence.

Let's me see if I understand you correctly. You reject all the evidence for alien contact, but you want me to convince you?

Does that about sum it up?

originally posted by: JadeStar

originally posted by: Scdfa
a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

Is that what you and others are afraid might happen? If you really think they aren't real, you shouldn't be participating in UFO threads with such a disdain for those that understand what they have seen. It is dangerous ground you walk on, and I hope you don't ever see these things, because I can already see the mental crippling happening in the aftermath, and that is very ugly to see happen to people. I have seen it unbalance skeptics who thought they created the concept of balance with great pride I might add.. The fall is a real long one, and when they hit bottom, leaves a big crater in their noggin.

Well said, great post. However, I have a lot less sympathy.

How seriously can we take some of these people?
"I refuse to accept the evidence. Now convince me!"

What part of discuss the topic not each other hasn't sunk in?

Reminder: If one makes claims of an extraordinary nature they can and should be asked for evidence. I just got clarification that asking for such does NOT violate the ATS T+C.

Asking for a link to a UFO report that an ATS member alleged made to CBS which CBS thought was very convincing is fair game (as it was presumably news and in the public domain) and I should not be demonized for doing so.

Those who make wild claims without being able to back them up should.

The problem with this subject is that when someone can't back up their story they play the victim and take any inquiry as a personal attack. It's not. But if you have no pictures, no video, no alien hardware all we have is your story therefore all we can examine is its veracity.

What I see a lot of are people saying they don't want the stories examined. Hmm, I wonder why that might be….

First you say I play the victim. Then you complain about being demonized.

Ah, my daily dose of irony.

What part of discuss the topic not each other hasn't sunk in?

You tell me. Your entire post is about me.

originally posted by: Scdfa
You reject all the evidence for alien contact, but you want me to convince you?

Does that about sum it up?

How does one reject evidence that does not exist? I believe everyone participating in this discussion would be quite accepting (and excited about) any such evidence.

originally posted by: NoCorruptionAllowed

originally posted by: JadeStar

originally posted by: Scdfa
a reply to: JadeStar

Pics or it didn't happen. Sorry.

You're sorry, alright. Whatever happened to the Jade who used to at least pretend her serial denying was based on science?

She's still here wondering why someone who meets aliens and sees UFOS all the time has not one photo to show for it. No phone? No camera? In 2015? Seriously?

You sure abandoned the scientific method!

Asking for evidence of a claim IS the scientific method. Or have you forgot that?

Is that what they said to Schroedinger? Pics or it didn't happen?

You're the one who claimed to see aliens and UFOs in the MACRO world. This has nothing to do with Schroedinger or QM/QP.

That avatar isn't you. So pics or you didn't happen.

Lol, of course it is. Now you're just desparate.

Lots of credible people have seen UFO's, An FAA friend of mine has seen several, one landed on the runway. Lots of evidence has been tested and found not to be from this solar system,

And last, who cares if you know about it? Will it help anyone if you know?

The people demanding proof are not even looking for proof themselves, so if someone does all the looking for them, how can they hope to learn about the issue?

Those that have seen things like a real saucer shaped craft land on an airport runway include a Chief ATC officer of the FAA, whom I knew personally, but he passed away at the age of 89. He was a Captain in the Air force, This won't prove anything to you, but it does to me, but I didn't need it after seeing things myself long before.

If things like this are something you and others feel are not real, then why waste time ridiculing those who know they are real?

You're assuming that there would be no scientific value in examining why somone might have seen something like that.

Its not my job to say whether something is real or not without all of the facts. It's my job to gather information to make that determination.

If someone says, "why should I talk to you" then it's easy to say, "yes, that was another hoaxer, liar, whatever".

Those who don't think they are real, don't even look for truth anyways, they just point out how crazy they think others are to make up for their own personal bias. Is that helping you, me, or anyone? It only helps those who have a fear of what they don't want to understand by implanting their head deeper into rocky ground. Not even an ostrich will let danger rule them to that degree.

Do you honestly think I am that way. Do you honestly think I'd be studying the subjects I study if I wasn't searching for truth?

Science itself is a search for truth.

But stories are not necessarily truth and the wilder the story the more evidence is needed to make it true.

I know a lot of former skeptics, who were mentally ruined after they witnessed a domed circular craft that maneuvered in ways that no currently known man made craft can operate. After they saw it for themselves, some had mental breakdowns, because they "knew" these things couldn't be real.

I wouldn't be mentally ruined. I'd be entralled and have a lot of questions and i'd have my iphone out filming it in HD too btw.

Is that what you and others are afraid might happen?

Not at all. Perhaps you did not see in the Space Exploration forum where I said one of my pet projects is devising an experiment to look for alien self organizing "smart dust" in the near earth and solar system environment.

If you read about smart dust you could see how it might be a possible explanation for some of what people have reported IF such reports were not the 95% of UFO reports with mundane explanations.

if you really think they aren't real, you shouldn't be participating in UFO threads with such a disdain for those that understand what they have seen. It is dangerous ground you walk on, and I hope you don't ever see these things, because I can already see the mental crippling happening in the aftermath, and that is very ugly to see happen to people. I have seen it unbalance skeptics who thought they created the concept of balance with great pride I might add.. The fall is a real long one, and when they hit bottom, leaves a big crater in their noggin.

I didn't realize UFOs were a religion.

I'm not here for belief. I'm here for fact finding as a scientist. I have no need to believe one way or the other. I just look to gather useful data.

I see that challenges plenty of people's beliefs though. I'm not the mean old skeptic but as a scientist I have every right to be skeptical and to be honest most people are rightfully skeptical of this subject because the amount of garbage in it.

As I've said before, I'd love all of the stories to be true. If they were then that would make a lot of people's jobs (and my future job hopefully) a lot easier.

We're not there yet and won't be until there is more than just some stories or poor quality video/photos to analyze.

originally posted by: AdmireTheDistance

originally posted by: Scdfa
You reject all the evidence for alien contact, but you want me to convince you?

Does that about sum it up?

How does one reject evidence that does not exist? I believe everyone participating in this discussion would be quite accepting (and excited about) any such evidence.

So it is your position that there is no evidence for alien contact?

That is simply a false statement.
You may not feel the evidence constitutes proof, but it is an untrue statement to say that there is no evidence.

Just remember: For every Mulder there has to be a Scully.

a reply to: JadeStar

Do you honestly think I am that way. Do you honestly think I'd be studying the subjects I study if I wasn't searching for truth?

Science itself is a search for truth.

But stories are not necessarily truth and the wilder the story the more evidence is needed to make it true.

I don't believe for one minute that you are looking for the truth about alien contact. Sorry.

And you are incorrect, no evidence is needed to make my experiences true.

You may ask for evidence to convince you that it's real, but evidence is not needed to make it true. You say you're a scientist?

a reply to: JadeStar

The only wild claims I've seen are yours claiming to know about something enough to say there is nothing there, but then demanding someone else "prove" it to you. That means you really know nothing, and don't intend to ever know. How's that working? I can see that it hasn't so far.
You don't need to prove your own ignorance, and no one else can do that for you if you already understand that.

It's hilarious to see the same group make the same claim of self ignorance. Who can break you out of that shell? Only yourselves, so stop asking others to do it for you.

a reply to: JadeStar

You feel you are a scientist? Prove that to me.
So far I haven't seen you do anything that would constitute the behavior of a scientist.
All you have done is say the whole thing is bunk.
Testimony about saucers is evidence.
You offer no evidence or even testimony that would sway anyone not to consider testimony to the contrary.
I think you better stick to your unscientific methods, since you seem to get more fans that like that style of "belief". It has a payoff better suited to your current style of learning IE, a zero sum gain with plenty of applause. Who cares that it doesn't mean anything? I don't.

originally posted by: Scdfa

originally posted by: AdmireTheDistance

originally posted by: Scdfa
You reject all the evidence for alien contact, but you want me to convince you?

Does that about sum it up?

How does one reject evidence that does not exist? I believe everyone participating in this discussion would be quite accepting (and excited about) any such evidence.

So it is your position that there is no evidence for alien contact?

Yes it is.

That is simply a false statement.

No, that is the simple truth of the matter.

You may not feel the evidence constitutes proof...

Totally irrelevant, until there is some evidence.

...but it is an untrue statement to say that there is no evidence.

Unless you have some evidence that you have yet to present, then my statement is factual.

originally posted by: NoCorruptionAllowed
Testimony about saucers is evidence.

If you actually believe that to be true, then you have no business whatsoever asking others to validate their scientific credentials.