FOX News: Transgender girl drops class after 200 protest for and against her.

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: Annee

Opinion, belief --- does not trump the knowledge and experience of an actual person who lives it.

On a side note, you should read the book "The Man Who Mistook His Wife for a Hat" by neurologist Oliver Sacks. The guy who mistook his wife for a hat had some rare visual data disorder, and when about to put his hat on, reached for his wife's head instead and attempted to lift it off like her body was a hat rack. He mistook his foot for his shoe and his shoes for his foot and couldn't decide which one to put on the other. There was another guy who didn't believe his leg was his. Great stories and great read. Point being, people's experiences are often delusional.

The body is extremely complex.

I had an infection in the Fallopian tube. The things that were going through my head were very, very, very, bizarre. Hormone crazy to the extreme. Being logical I was able to rationalize why this was happening. I can't even imagine someone not of strong mind going through that experience.

Then there's the brain, with all its complexity. Nothing would surprise me.

originally posted by: OpenMindedRealist
a reply to: Annee
When in doubt, dodge and deflect!

I have been very straight forward and precise in my thoughts on this thread. And always am.

If you think doubt/dodge/deflect ----- you don't know me.

originally posted by: Deaf Alien
a reply to: OpenMindedRealist

Nah. Comparing transgender people with people who believe and act like animals is an insult. Someone in this thread compared transgender people to sociopaths who cut off dogs and cats heads.

The clinical zoanthropy comparison DOES NOT equal the sociopath comparison, my friend. Do not attempt to lump the two together.

From a purely pragmatic approach (which is what science is all about) why is the zoanthropy comparison not appropriate? Are they not both examples of an individual believing they are something completely different than what the scientifically are, to the point where they even demand those around them treat them, think of them, and even believe they are what they say they are in blind rejection of the obvious truth standing right in front of them?

a reply to: burdman30ott6

There are differences between the male and female brain. Studies have been done comparing the brains of transgender male-to-females and female-to-males with the brains of cisgender females and males. The transgender male-to-females had brains that were more feminized than the cisgender males - and that was BEFORE any hormones. Same with the female to male brain being more masculinized.

I have yet to see any brain scan comparisons of anyone who is transpecies to determine if their brains are more "animalized" than full humans. If you've got any links to said brain scan comparisons, I would be willing to believe they are the same as transgender people. Otherwise, it's an invalid comparison.

a reply to: burdman30ott6

Most people who believe they are animals don't get demand to have a litter box installed in the office.

I've seen those documentaries with people that think they're a cat and whatnot -- they realize they aren't actually a cat, and know that nothing they can do will actually make them into a cat. They realize this is a human world, and that they may feel like a cat inside and do cat-like activities in the freetime, they still have to act human and be human to get around in society.

I can sort of see where they might overlap, but unlike believing oneself to be an animal, transgender people can actually DO something about it.

a reply to: Annee

I understand...

If you answer it scientifically, then you're forced to acknowledge there is no difference. If you answer it emotionally, you're forced to state something utterly ridiculous and support a manner of equality which allows a human being to live out a mental fantasy of being a pooch, behaving like a pooch, and being provided accommodations of a pooch.

It's not an easy question to answer while toeing a politically motivated positional line.

a reply to: MystikMushroom

hahahahaah..
you talking about them lamer furry people huh
another group that is mentally ill

a reply to: Deaf Alien
I'm not sure you understand camparisons and contrasts.

You do know that any two things can be compared/contrasted right? Determining the degree of similarity between two things is the entire point.

Perhaps psychoses is a sharp contrast to gender dysphoria. Perhaps zoanthropy is an apt comparison. If you disgree then tell us why. This is a discussion forum.

a reply to: burdman30ott6

From a purely pragmatic approach (which is what science is all about) why is the zoanthropy comparison not appropriate?

For one it is so rare. How many people do you know of that believe they are animals and act like animals? Besides isn't it a part of schizophrenia?

I have worked with a 6 years old boy who acted like a dog that barks, bites other children, pee and defecate everywhere. That was because his parents left him in a pen with dogs outside.

a reply to: OpenMindedRealist

I'm not sure you understand camparisons and contrasts.

Um yes I do.

Perhaps psychoses is a sharp contrast to gender dysphoria.

BINGO! You got it.

a reply to: MystikMushroom
You don't think those people would begin to make absurd demands, if there were a national movement to make the public more accepting of zoanthropes?

It would only be a matter of time before you found yourself putting on cat ears along with your unscented deodorant every morning.

originally posted by: Mugly
a reply to: MystikMushroom

hahahahaah..
you talking about them lamer furry people huh
another group that is mentally ill

Noooo there's a difference.

There are people that dress up and like to pretend to be animals for fun -- then there are people that sincerely believe that they ARE an animal and want to be an animal all the time.

It's like a person that LARPS in the park on the weekend vs. a person who think they really are in the wrong time period.

At the end of the day, the LARPer goes home and hangs up his foam sword. The other person still feels like they were born in the wrong time period and can't get back home.

a reply to: OpenMindedRealist

As someone pointed out, it's pretty rare to come across these people.

Also, wearing cat ears to placate someone in the workplace is a distraction. Wearing unscented deodorant isn't a distraction.

Ok, I am going to try this again.

I made a post on page 19 about the bigger issue of the current state of law in terms of minors.


Recently a teenage girl was named both the adult defendant and victim of two counts of sexual exploitation of minor - second-degree exploitation having a sexually explicit photo of HERSELF!!

www.fayobserver.com...

I mention this to demonstrate how absolutely crazy we have gotten in this country over some laws as they apply to minors.

As I said in my last post, I am behind her 100%, but the laws and culture are not quite there yet. A couple of parents screaming about "indecent exposure" or such could ruin her life. It is not worth the risk at this point.

Jadestar, If you read my previous post you know that I am behind her , but I fear for her in terms of what the law could do to her. I have been reading your posts for awhile, and as a general rule of thumb agree with you and sometimes even give a mental "You go girl" when you are defending the rights of transgender people.
However, in this case, with the reality of the current state of law, this particular battle over underage locker rooms needs to be fought at a later time. Hopefully sooner rather then later.

a reply to: Deaf Alien
And for two? For three?

Probably should come up with a few backups. Your excuse that "it's so rare" also applies to gender dysphoria, which affects less than half a percent of the population.

originally posted by: MystikMushroom

There are people that dress up and like to pretend to be animals for fun -- then there are people that sincerely believe that they ARE an animal and want to be an animal all the time.

.

and i think if someone believes they are an animal and has to dress in a purple raccoon costume to go grocery shopping then that person is mentally ill

a reply to: OpenMindedRealist

My excuse? Excuse for what?

It is very rare even in comparison to gender dysphoria. How many people do you know of that suffer from clinical lycanthropy. How many do you know of that demands rights?

Now how many transgender people do you know of, maybe know personally?

Thought so.

a reply to: Deaf Alien

For one it is so rare. How many people do you know of that believe they are animals and act like animals?

That excuse, for why you think zoanthropy cannot be compared to gender dysphoria. The only reason you gave was that zoanthropy is rare, but gender dysphoria is not much more common.

a reply to: OpenMindedRealist

That excuse, for why you think zoanthropy cannot be compared to gender dysphoria. The only reason you gave was that zoanthropy is rare, but gender dysphoria is not much more common.

I already gave the answer. It is a part of schizophrenia. Pay attention.

You even said that psychosis is a sharp contrast to gender dysphoria.

originally posted by: Deaf Alien
a reply to: Teikiatsu

Dude grows up in a male body. Dude has all the male equipment. After 13 years in this body, dude suddenly thinks he's not a dude and is in the wrong body.

Don't know about Lila. We don't have all the information.

However, transgenderism is a real phenomenon. Some children as young as maybe 3 to 6 have identified themselves as the opposite sex.

You won't hear me argue that transgenderism is a phenomenon. That doesn't make it valid.

I have a 5 year old who identifies as (in no particular order) Iron Man, a turtle, and a monster truck.

His identity does not lead me to implant an electromagnet on his chest, or superglue a shell on his back, or bolt his wrists and ankles to wheels. I do however pat him on the head and say "That's nice."