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Fragments of the world's oldest Koran, found in Birmingham last month, may predate the Prophet Muhammad and could even rewrite the early history of Islam, according to scholars. The pages, thought to be between 1,448 and 1,371 years old, were discovered bound within the pages of another Koran from the late seventh century at the library of the University of Birmingham. Written in ink in an early form of Arabic script on parchment made from animal skin, the pages contain parts of the Suras, or chapters, 18 to 20, which may have been written by someone who actually knew the Prophet Muhammad - founder of the Islamic faith.
The pages were carbon-dated by experts at the University of Oxford, a process which showed the Islamic holy book manuscript could be the oldest Koran in the world. The discovery was said to be particularly significant as in the early years of Islam, the Koran was thought to have been memorised and passed down orally rather written. But now several historians have said that the parchment might even predate Muhammad.
It is believed that the Birmingham Koran was produced between 568AD and 645AD, while the dates usually given for Muhammad are between 570AD and 632AD. Historian Tom Holland, told the Times: 'It destabilises, to put it mildly, the idea that we can know anything with certainty about how the Koran emerged - and that in turn has implications for the history of Muhammad and the Companions.' Keith Small, from the University of Oxford's Bodleian Library, added: 'This gives more ground to what have been peripheral views of the Koran's genesis, like that Muhammad and his early followers used a text that was already in existence and shaped it to fit their own political and theological agenda, rather than Muhammad receiving a revelation from heaven.
However, these claims are strongly disputed by Muslim scholars, with Mustafa Shah from the School of Oriental and African Studies in London also telling the paper: 'If anything, the manuscript has consolidated traditional accounts of the Koran's origins.' The Prophet Muhammad is thought to have founded Islam sometime after 610AD and the first Muslim community was founded in Medina in 622AD. During this time the Koran was memorised and recited orally but Caliph Abu Bakr, the first leader of the Muslim community after Muhammad's death, ordered the Koranic material to be collected into a book.
The final authoritative written form was not completed until 650AD under the third leader Caliph Uthman. Professor Nadir Dinshaw, who studies interreligious relations at the University of Birmingham, described the discovery as 'startling'. When it was found last month he said: 'This could well take us back to within a few years of the actual founding of Islam. 'According to Muslim tradition, the Prophet Muhammad received the revelations that form the Qur'an, the scripture of Islam, between the years AD 610 and 632, the year of his death. 'At this time, the divine message was not compiled into the book form in which it appears today. Instead, the revelations were preserved in 'the memories of men'.
'Parts of it had also been written down on parchment, stone, palm leaves and the shoulder blades of camels.
'Muslims believe that the Koran they read today is the same text that was standardised under Uthman and regard it as the exact record of the revelations that were delivered to Muhammad. 'The tests carried out on the parchment of the Birmingham folios yield the strong probability that the animal from which it was taken was alive during the lifetime of the Prophet Muhammad or shortly afterwards. 'These portions must have been in a form that is very close to the form of the Koran read today, supporting the view that the text has undergone little or no alteration and that it can be dated to a point very close to the time it was believed to be revealed.'
Not often do you see ATS cherry picking other religions as often as Christianity. So if this is true this would make Islam a false religion based on fraud and plagiarism.
Maybe Muhammad is not so holy after all? Maybe he is a fraud?
It is believed that the Birmingham Koran was produced between 568AD and 645AD, while the dates usually given for Muhammad are between 570AD and 632AD.
With a possible 2-year discrepancy, there is a 92% chance that it was produced at some point during or after Muhammad’s
lifetime, and for the sake of simplicity I’ll also assume a two-in-three chance that he was an adult if alive.
Either way, the Daily Fail is hardly a reputable source of truth, after all it is ever-eager to slander Islam. Not only do those
“parchments” look as though they’ve been stained with teabags but I’m also reluctant to believe that something purportedly so old and
significant could mysteriously appear in Birmingham of all places.
Note what the article says...
“...may predate the Prophet Muhammad”
“may have been written by someone who...
...actually knew the Prophet Muhammad”
Either it was written before or after he came into being, not both.
"Caliph Abu Bakr, the first leader of the Muslim community after Muhammad's death, ordered the Koranic material to be collected into a book."
"Muslims believe that the Koran they read today is the same text that was standardised under Uthman and regard it as the exact record of the revelations that were delivered to Muhammad.
'These portions must have been in a form that is very close to the form of the Koran read today, supporting the view that the text has undergone little or no alteration and that it can be dated to a point very close to the time it was believed to be revealed."
originally posted by: Sahabi
The truth is, every ancient Qur'anic manuscript has, so far, contained significant variations as compared to today's. There is not a single ancient Qur'an in existence that is word-for-word or letter-for-letter identical to today's.
The same could very easily be said about the Bible and Torah. Even with accurate text, language has significantly changed in 2,000 years and there could easily be misunderstandings in translation.
originally posted by: Sahabi
• The truth of the matter is that Ali ibn Ali Talib was the first to compile the Qur'an in full.
originally posted by: VigiliaProcuratio
It is believed that the Birmingham Koran was produced between 568AD and 645AD, while the dates usually given for Muhammad are between 570AD and 632AD.With a possible 2-year discrepancy, there is a 92% chance that it was produced at some point during or after Muhammad’s lifetime, and for the sake of simplicity I’ll also assume a two-in-three chance that he was an adult if alive.
Either way, the Daily Fail is hardly a reputable source of truth, after all it is ever-eager to slander Islam. Not only do those “parchments” look as though they’ve been stained with teabags but I’m also reluctant to believe that something purportedly so old and significant could mysteriously appear in Birmingham of all places.
Note what the article says...
“...may predate the Prophet Muhammad”
“may have been written by someone who...
...actually knew the Prophet Muhammad”
Either it was written before or after he came into being, not both.
originally posted by: angeldoll
Anyone who believes a document of the magnitude of the Koran could be accurately passed down verbally for thousands of years has blind faith in human infallibility. It's quite simply not possible because: humans.
Would you trust it to remain pretty much identical?
originally posted by: babloyi
originally posted by: Sahabi
• The truth of the matter is that Ali ibn Ali Talib was the first to compile the Qur'an in full.
Depends who you ask. That Ali was the first to compile the Quran in full is the Shia narrative. May be true, may be false, but there's no way to authoritatively put that narrative over the opposing one that says Abu Bakr was the first to order its compilation.
"The Shīʿite view, as well as that of some Sunnis, holds that ʿAlī, one of the first converts to Islam and the fourth caliph, retired from public life after the death of the Prophet and compiled a complete version of the Qurʾān, which was later shown to the people of Medina."
Qur'an (Encyclopedia Brittanica)
It is believed that the Birmingham Koran was produced between 568AD and 645AD, while the dates usually given for Muhammad are between 570AD and 632AD.
originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: angeldoll
I can appreciate the honesty in your stance, Angel...
I'd have scoffed at the analogy too until I learned the 1st Surah within a couple of days.
I guess I'm biased, but I can also see that if I can do it (I'm terrible with other languages), then the companions of Muhammad (pbuh) must have found it 1000x easier than I did.
However, I'm happy to agree to disagree
originally posted by: DeathSlayer
Not often do you see ATS cherry picking other religions as often as Christianity. So if this is true this would make Islam a false religion based on fraud