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With 241k Syrians killed since 2011, Syrian survivor Mass Exodus, what will become of Syria?

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posted on Aug, 29 2015 @ 06:23 PM
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with tens of thousands of Syrians migrating EVERY day into neighboring european countries for months on end now, following US/NATO occupation of Libya concurrent with CIA's covert flow of weapons into Syria turning peaceful civil protests violent, will Syria's fate now rest in the hands of ISIS & newer CIA ops?

www.independent.co.uk...

Mideast Destabilization 101. Heck, if Al-Assad's education wasn't so european, would he have then suffered the same fate that Gadafi did following US/NATO strikes on Libya?



I do wonder what is the West's plan for Syria. It's refreshing to see it seems a different strategy altogether than was used upon Iraq & Afghanistan. Does this clean up Syria for the restoration of more efficient CIA-DEA smuggling routes or something?


edit on 29-8-2015 by Sovan because: (no reason given)




posted on Aug, 29 2015 @ 06:39 PM
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Syria will be a giant parking lot



posted on Aug, 29 2015 @ 06:59 PM
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To the OP.

US / NATO is not occupying Libya. The NATO "no fly" mission was to stop Gadhafi (the dictator) killing off the opposition.

Assad is the "victim" of a civil war that has attracted and made-real ISIS. It is irrelevant that he's had a "western education". He's out of place in the 20the century.

Christ. I truly don't know why people think dictators are good.

Blame it on the CIA.



posted on Aug, 29 2015 @ 07:22 PM
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US intel agencies aware/tracking/supervising flow of weapons from libya to syria concurrent with us presence thereabouts to kill gadaffi/son/grandkids



posted on Aug, 29 2015 @ 08:20 PM
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originally posted by: Sovan


US intel agencies aware/tracking/supervising flow of weapons from libya to syria concurrent with us presence thereabouts to kill gadaffi/son/grandkids


If i remember that was during the no fly zone and the mistaken attempt to arm th e"good muslims" Not now though. Situations change.



posted on Aug, 29 2015 @ 10:40 PM
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The West has no plan for Syria. If the West had its way they would go back to Syria being a dictatorship that the US could simply threaten to bomb Assad whenever he threatened to step out of line. If he could have avoided ordering his troops to shoot unarmed civilians he would likely still have a country and a military.

Since he did not the US and the West is left with trying to clean up the mess with as little involvement as possible. At this point with most of the Syrian military either dead or having changed sides and Assads small area of control growing smaller every day despite the best efforts of Iran and Hezbollah. So Assad will fall likely in next year or so. What the US expects to happen at that point is new coalition government to be formed joining Assads former forces with the FSA/Kurdish alliance. That these forces backed by coalition air strikes will then move and crush ISIS and the other little groups that are all fighting each other. That is the plan.

After that it is likely we will see some fighting for control. The truth is the only thing most Syrians have in common is great hate for Assad. Like Libya it will then take time to form a true coalition government. This is the problem with nations that only remained together because of brutal regimes forced them to. One the only thing they have in common, a hatred for that dictator is gone it takes some fighting for those people finally come together strictly out of being tired of violence.



posted on Aug, 29 2015 @ 11:59 PM
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a reply to: paraphi

Er don't mention the fact they armed ISIS


Blame it on the CIA



posted on Aug, 30 2015 @ 01:26 AM
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originally posted by: paraphi
Christ. I truly don't know why people think dictators are good.


Objectively, one could say that dictators keep a certain level of stability which can be considered a good thing.

I mean, Libya was the most prosperous African state with the highest HDI under Gaddafi. It's now embroiled in a civil war between two governments which claim legitimacy, and hundreds of other militias. Objectively, Gaddafi's rule when compared to Libya's current situation, was quite good.

Syria's currently undergoing a crippling civil war, and it is safe to say that people would probably prefer Assad over ISIS or other jihadist-aligned rebels.

Iraq is also engaged in a moment of instability as a result of the overthrowing of Saddam Hussein and the ways in which the US led coalition went about replacing his regime.


edit on 30-8-2015 by daaskapital because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 30 2015 @ 02:15 AM
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a reply to: daaskapital

Problem is always once a man larger than politics who runs a country is deposed and dies there seems to be a period of absolute chaos. Tito in Yugoslavia is my first memory of this but I expect there are numbers ones from the past and certainly since Sadam Iraq has been in chaos, which is not saying the one man dictatorship is a good thing but I can't help thinking that despite his dodgy bits Gaddafi did a lot for Libya and now look at it.

As far as Syria is concerned I suspect its a matter of geography - Israel wants to expand and where better and how strange that the one huge enemy of ISIS never gets so much as a cough in its direction - something stinks as far as ISIS is concerned especially how its funded and armed. I suspect that once it has cleared out certain parts it will be destroyed and the new land owners will prance in, regardless of the human tragedy.



posted on Aug, 30 2015 @ 02:50 AM
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a reply to: daaskapital

Oh, the Libya PR machine-made myths. Remember that the UN supported intervention in Libya was to curtain Gaddafi's atrocities against his own people.

ISIS is just an excuse for Muslims to perpetuate the internecine struggle between different denominations of Islam. What we see now, and what we have seen for a couple of decades is Muslims killing Muslims. Dictators may have sat on the spring, but it was going to "boing" at some stage. It happened in Libya with NATO support and it has happened in Syria without it.



posted on Aug, 30 2015 @ 03:12 AM
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originally posted by: paraphi
a reply to: daaskapital

Oh, the Libya PR machine-made myths. Remember that the UN supported intervention in Libya was to curtain Gaddafi's atrocities against his own people.


The only thing being they weren't myths though. Libya did have the highest HDI out of any African state, and it has decreased since Gaddafi's ouster (albeit not by much). Source: countryeconomy.com...

Also, while the UN intervened in Libya over suspected atrocities committed by the government against civilians, intelligence agencies in the US and other states had zero information pointing to any massacres or the like. In fact, reports suggest they were quite concerned that politicians such as Hillary Clinton were not taking the intelligence into consideration, instead wanting to enter into another war on unsubstantiated allegations. Officials in the Pentagon maintained direct contact with the Gaddafi regime in an attempt to seek a peaceful conclusion to the Libyan civil war, all the while Hillary Clinton and co were pumping the propaganda and trying to oust the family from power. Source: www.washingtontimes.com...


ISIS is just an excuse for Muslims to perpetuate the internecine struggle between different denominations of Islam. What we see now, and what we have seen for a couple of decades is Muslims killing Muslims. Dictators may have sat on the spring, but it was going to "boing" at some stage. It happened in Libya with NATO support and it has happened in Syria without it.



ISIS is just a terrorist organisation which has used religion as a guise for their political motives. In fact, it has managed to incite a coalition of different denominations, religions and politics to come together to battle it. You are correct that the spring would have released regardless of whether or not a dictator was in power, and you provide pertinent examples. Still, we have seen a trend which shows that countries under dictators, at least in developing countries, have probably fared a bit better than democracies. I think the Arab Spring shows this, with the only democratic success story being Tunisia.
edit on 30-8-2015 by daaskapital because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 30 2015 @ 03:31 AM
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a reply to: daaskapital

If you are dictator you can present whatever you like to the world and keep all the grisly brutality hidden. I am sure many people in Libya did not have a high HDI. All dictatorships - including China - pay particular attention to controlling their PR. When presenting Libya's life expectancy, did Gadaffi declare the numbers of those whose lives ended prematurely under his policy? Of course not!



posted on Aug, 30 2015 @ 10:00 AM
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There are about 9 million displaced Syrians (2011: 23 million population), either inside Syria or those who are refugees in neighboring countries or the EU.

I was quite surprised when I read how certain countries in the EU are already doing or talking about having refugees live with students and the elderly in retirement homes.

If it were up to me, I'd allow the refugees to stay but only if they would agree to form an army, get training and weapons so once they are ready to go back they can try and clean up the mess they left behind. It takes a lot of hard work and sacrifice but what are the other options? Let it all sort itself out and have chronic refugee problems or having it occur every few decades?

Surely they have little to no future in the EU, maybe their children when they get education from a young age but even then it would be better if they were to be sent back so they can work on their own country having better education than most in that region. I believe it's the right thing to do, to empower them through education and weapons so they can learn how to fend for themselves instead of having to ask other countries for help without a real end.

It's not like the majority who are Muslim will leave their religion and it's not like the EU will convert to Islam. I believe it's better to have people of the same ideals and beliefs share a stretch of land, it just works better for everyone.



posted on Aug, 30 2015 @ 10:20 AM
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a reply to: johnnyjoe1979

Your option of turning hem into a foghting force has merit. While staying in host country they shall become soldiers in th earmy to pay their way,and while being soldiers will learn how to soldier and become better fighters. then after their terms are up send them back to syria with weapons and let them clean house.

Anyone refusing to join said units will be deported anyways. You stay you earn your keep this will not be a free hand out.



posted on Aug, 30 2015 @ 10:33 AM
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originally posted by: daaskapital

originally posted by: paraphi
Christ. I truly don't know why people think dictators are good.


Objectively, one could say that dictators keep a certain level of stability which can be considered a good thing.

I mean, Libya was the most prosperous African state with the highest HDI under Gaddafi. It's now embroiled in a civil war between two governments which claim legitimacy, and hundreds of other militias. Objectively, Gaddafi's rule when compared to Libya's current situation, was quite good.

Syria's currently undergoing a crippling civil war, and it is safe to say that people would probably prefer Assad over ISIS or other jihadist-aligned rebels.

Iraq is also engaged in a moment of instability as a result of the overthrowing of Saddam Hussein and the ways in which the US led coalition went about replacing his regime.



And yet the vast majority of the people in those places would never want to go back under control, in particular in Libya. The price the people who live under those dictators have to pay and the people in the nations that surround them as well becomes more than they are willing pay. The horrors that people like Gaddaffi, Saddam, Assad perpetrated against their own people is why despite the conditions they live in now they would not go back to the way it was.



posted on Aug, 30 2015 @ 06:50 PM
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warning, graphic:
www.youtube.com...



posted on Aug, 30 2015 @ 09:58 PM
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I'm pretty sure you could make a convincing argument that Syria no longer exists...



posted on Aug, 31 2015 @ 04:35 AM
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a reply to: Awen24

I suspect that's the perspective some people would like the people in the West to believe. Then whatever the motive is for all this terrible upheaval in Syria is really about will manifest itself in time.

What bothers me is the human suffering this is causing and the problems it is producing which could ultimately destabilise Europe also.

I cannot get away from the mass exodus of people fleeing their own country because its reminiscent of the Palestinians having to flee their own homes. Again, there is something so dreadfully, morally wrong here and we all seem to be trapped onlookers manipulated by the humanely despicable behind this.



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